Muller Dynamo

[Groundloop]

@lasersaber,

Good work. :-)

If you measure 345Hz at one coil then multiply by 60 and divide by number of magnets (8)
to get the RPM. (345 * 60) / 8 = 2587 RPM.

GL.

[xenomorphlabs]

@khabe ,oh dear two weeks you say . Between Kennedy announcing the "man on the moon" program and its realisation took about ten years . We are dealing here with something far more important for the future of mankind . Perhaps your doors need another coat of paint ?
       Here is something I find strange . Page 13 reply number 192 . Here romero describes a simple machine by Raymond Kromrey . He says he has built it and it works very well .It looks like a generator . Is it supposed to be OU . There are 2 diagrams and I find it difficult to relate the two together . My interpretation is this . We have a rotor with 4 magnets .There are 4 coils and 4 ferrite bars . anyone agree? From the link provided I could not find relevant info on coil winding and connection . Comments please /

If Romero is convinced that the Kromrey Converter operates on the same principle like his Muller Dynamo, then the OU part comes from pumping the Bloch Wall. The Rotor breaks the magnetic lock between the 2 outer PMs lead through the ferrites.
After all the reason for putting the magnets the way he did, is still not totally agreed on.

[nul-points]

nice work laser!  another lean build

pretty fast, too, even without stator mags & washers - maybe on the next one you should use a tripod arrangement?

[Tudi]

I'm not sure that you need to make all the 8! combinations to get to a working version. My theory is that he only used the magnets on top of the coils to finetune the device. He had manually made coils. Which probably had different resistance/inductance...other details. So he used the magnets to simply strengthen the magnetic field in some coils to be able to adjust the balance = reduce the coging. You could do this finetuning pretty quickly, just rotate it a bit and see the lock position of your rotor, try to put a magnet on the oposite side (the rotor magnet should be between two stator coils) to increase the coging on that side = balance it overall.
But reducing coging might not get the device to OU, just a very efficient dynamo.
The washers show in magnetic field simulations that simply aid the magnetif field better.
The large gaps reduce the strength of the magnetic field, but he had a very aided field ( from 1 magnet to another through the ferite core and washer ) I guess this is what romerouk ment by finetune to the "lightbulb". But this just makes it convert less mechanical energy to electrical energy = run more before it slows down != OU.
We all know these effects and hardly expect the magic from these, so no need to insist on most of them. Maybe the roation speed ? The frequency of the magnetic field colapse buildup. Very sensible device parameters and parameter combinations ? Now those might be the key. If so, the chances to reproduce this might be really small.
Another strange thing on the waveform he posted is that he almost completly eliminated the pull-back force of the magnets. Like he did not use the magnets when they were leaving the coils at all. But on the circuit draw we have, he uses no special circuit to do this ? Coging happens on the magnet aproaching the coil and leaving the coil. How did he kill the "leave" part ?
Nice work lightsaber. how could you not measure the amps at the output of the coil ?

[khabe]

Hi khabe

My understanding of the words of Rom concerning the RC engines is not that he could produce OU with the engine on its own.

I understood that they could be used as a driver for the setup, so you do not need the driver coils. 
In other words. Due to the efficiency and RPM/power of those motors , they are suitable to connect to the "dynamo" as the driving engine. 
Edit:  Oh wait...  it seems the other way around...  Damn.. this beats Sudoku 

Yeah, but facts are speaking otherwise,
I did read first 20 pages, got splitting headache from,
This guy does not understand about motors ... sorry, but this is true,
And it looks like he forgetting  what he spoke in previous post and what did prate few days or week before, differnt figures ... already did, done ... will do ...
Bu OK, it does not matter anymore,
The only thing we can do is await a new Messiah arises 
cheers,
khabe

I get many questions about How I started this project, where the ideea came from:Turnigy SK3542-1250 Brushless Motor - is made on the same principle uneven magnets/coils.
This is where I started , I was playing with a small airoplane... then I studied Muller info...
This type of motors are using neos and should be very hard to turn them with your fingers but having Mullers arangement they turn very easy.
One of this motors can be turned very easy in an overunity generator.
They are cheap to buy on ebay.Since then, I bought  different types and re done the windings, the only problem is that they are quite small to work with also removing the existing windings is not easy.
I also have a large DC motor that is underconstruction transforming it in this type of generator. I removed the existing large magnets and added one smaller magnet for each section in the rotor, remaking the coils just like in Muller design.
I hope this helps in understanding a bit more about how to build and how it works.

@woopy
good to see you arround.
Regarding the stranded wire:
Some time ago in a Bedini project I have built 2 identical coils but one with normal wire and another with stranded wire.I was using this coils to collect the power from the rotor powered with a Bedini standard circuit.Same core same wire diameter, all the same...
The results at that time(no load):   normal wire output was 9.2 volts
                                                stranded wire output was 12.3
since then I have always used stranded for most of my coils
it is easy to do the same experiment like me, actually it would be nice if someone else will confirm this.
I always try everything myself, I don't take all info I found as granted.
If I was wrong I would like someone to tell me.

@Groundloop
one more change to the drawing: input cap 47000uf

"Regarding the stranded wire" I hope you believe that there is no voltage difference when Litz wound or solid wire wound - this is fact

First picture shows 2 motors that are almost OU when comming from factory.They come with Muller arangements inside already.I have left info about them but looks that it was missed.
This is probably the easiest way for people to try Muller's config.You don't get a lot out but more than in.I have tested it with another normal dc motor to drive the shaft.Come on people, this one is cheap, search on ebay for it.You need to redo the windings again to have sections of 2 coils next to each other forming one set, coil up and coil down from my larger device.I used 0.3mm single wire.

Second pic shows more parts that are going to be used to the next device.

"First picture shows motors that are almost OU when comming from factory.They come with Muller arangements inside already ..."
Chiese made OU motors
And Muller arangements inside ... oh dear ...
Note that even Muller speaks this is more than hundred years old trick and discovered who knows by