Muller Dynamo

[k4zep]

Hi all,

Has there been any research that when you induce into a coil, a voltage with the coil at X inductance, and magnetically change the properties of the core during TDC in a generator, hence lower/or increase the inductance, does the core will give up a burst of extra energy.  That is you induce a voltage into a coil, then you change the inductance of the coil, does the output voltage change........some old article I read years ago alluded to this.......any ideas?  Very poor way of expressing it, but it is an idea and my terminology is lousy too.

Ben K4ZEP

[hartiberlin]

The LED will also light with 3V plus on the output leads with the input leads open circuit.

Hoppy

Wow, this is interesting !

Now it would be really cool,
if someone could find the circuit diagramm of this DC2DC converter,
so we could have a look how it works and why this is the case.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.

[LtBolo]

RomeroUK is pushing away from discussions that most are having (wire specs, coils specs, etc), and suggesting this is about efficiency. Obviously 99.999% is not going to get it, so it is obviously more than that.

There are many aspects of efficiency that can apply here. Drive coil efficiency is obviously important, and so is generator coil efficiency, but neither of those directly answer the question of OU. Conventional theory won't answer that question for obvious reasons, but that does beg the question of what part of the system is OU. It would seem that the answer lies in the magnet/coil interaction, and the answer isn't in our books.

When the stator coil is energized by the passing rotor magnet, what does its field look like? Is it in opposition? Attraction? What about the ferrite core? Does it attract or repel the rotor? How does the stator magnet effect that? Does the stator coil conduct for its entire interaction with the magnet? There is a lot going on here, and I think you end up with some conflicting forces. The tuning RomeroUK talked about will have everything to do with which forces are dominant when.

A few observations come to mind...

The ferrite is naturally attracted to the rotor magnets, however the stator magnets will fight that.

The stator coil will probably be producing a repulsive field on rotor magnet's approach, but the ferrite will likely still favor the strong neo, perhaps more than be repulsed by the coil. Obviously a function of the coil's field strength plus the stator magnet.

On rotor magnet departure, the coil will switch to an attractive field, which will be fighting the stator magnet, and supporting the ferrite's affinity for the strong rotor magnet.

The diode bridge will prevent the coil from passing current until its voltage exceeds that of the cap. That gets very complicated.

The cycle *may* look something like this:
1. Rotor magnet attracts to the stator coil ferrite pulling it in...maybe...depending on how strong the stator magnet pushes back.
2. The rotor magnet starts inducing a voltage in the stator coil, but initially current does not flow due to the bridge remaining reverse biased.
3. Eventually coil current starts flowing, creating a repulsive field which fights the rotor magnet. The stator magnet is assisting the coil.
4. As the rotor magnet passes over the center of the coil and starts pulling away, the stator coil begins reversing its field. While it does so, it stops conducting while below the cap voltage. The ferrite possibly returns to attraction, fighting the pull out.
5. The stator coil gets to a high enough reversed voltage that it forward biases the bridge and current flows. This will be an attracting field at this point, and will add to the ferrite's attraction, but be in opposition to the stator magnet.
6. The coil stops conducting, ferrite is clear of rotor magnet's field.

Pretty messy. Just for fun, overlap the cycles of 7 coils at different phases. Don't even think about tossing in the drive coil interaction...you'll go mad.

The actual forces at work will vary greatly based on spacing, magnet strength, RPM, operating voltage, operating current, etc. Meaning, build it and tune it for efficiency...tune some more...and tune some more...and if you lucked into designing the components so that their operating point coincides with the point where the magic occurs, you might make it work. Not knowing where the magic is to begin with will make this much, much harder. Would be real nice to have a theory...

[lumen]

Well,
I must admit, that Tinu is IMHO right in his critique.

Have another look at the circuit drawing at:

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3842.msg286835#msg286835

There you can see, that the switch RomeroUK is switching
off only cuts off the voltage from the cap and the input of the DC2DC
converter.
Nothing else is switched off...
So how can the LED really stay lit for 43 seconds is a real question
when we don´t know, where this additional recovery diode is ?

For the LED to be lit it should be D2, but then the switch
does not work as the recovery diode would just short it out...
If it is D1, then DC2DC converter would be obsolete or redundant
and the 15 Volts DC would directly go to the driver input and we would
have a runaway...!

So the question is really important, where is this recovery diode and
what does it exactly do !

Regards, Stefan.

Stefan,
Romero said that the recovery diode was from just one coil and only for charging up the battery.
So this configuration would not provide the full output current back into the input for a runaway condition. It could provide enough to keep the charge on the battery and could also raise the output of the DC/DC converter once the drive coils are disconnected. If this is true, then the input current to the DC/DC converter that is provided by the 47,000uf capacitor would never be used since the output is already higher than 12v. It's only use at this point would be to keep the LED lit until the rotor slowed enough to output less than 12v or the LED consumes the charge on the capacitor.

@Tinu, Sorry I should snap back at your inquisitiveness.

[Bruce_TPU]

@woopy . You remark that the output voltage does not rise with RPM as you would expect ..Now look at Romero`s post this evening . He says " At1240rpm we get too low voltage , maybe at 1034 we get better, this is just an ordinary dynamo , but this Machine is so much more " or words to that effect . Notice that as he has written this , it is not quite right . The bit I question is the number 1034 , which is lower than 1240 . I suspect instead he means 1340 . I think what he is saying is , This is not a normal machine . Do not expect the voltage/rpm curve to be like a normal machine . Read Romero`s post again and see if you understand then .

@neptune,
Or, perhaps Romero really meant what he wrote, and the 1034 RPM's is the best operating speed, for this rpm which would be related to it's operational frequency.  So, is there resonance at work somewhere in here with these coils?

@ woopy,
I would suggest SLOWING DOWN the rotor, the the aforementioned rpm, and see what you see! 

Cheers,

Bruce