Heat Pump / Refrigeration. Can same overunity concept apply to Eletronics???

[RedEagle]

@Low-Q

I totally agree with you.
keeping the fridge door open does not cool the kitchen, it warms it up.
And absolutely right, to make it work you need 3 reservoirs which I take in respect as you can see in my presentation. (the extended Carnot process)
The picture of that process just explains why it can work, it does not show the actual process in the generator, which is more complicated and involves more different energy levels.
Additionally the feedback provides a cascading effect to increase the heat.

The presentation was made for people with no technical skills, so I tried to keep it simple and just explain the basic principle.
This also means that the description is missing two parts.

For your convenience I add this presentation as pdf to this post.
It is the same that can be found on my webpage http://farislandllc.com

[pix]

Heat pumps are definitely not overunity, and if you try and put any of this calculated COP to any work it will not succeed. Many people have tried.
Kind Regards

Hi to All,
Heat pumps, and all refrigeration systems take advantage of peculiar way refrieration medium ( commonly called Freons) behaves.Efficiently absorbs and releases heat from surrounding.It is comon to all gases, but man engineered a special gases that do it very efficiently. Basically, refrigerant when going from liquid state to vapour ( on expansion device) vapour has low temperature- so it "sucks" heat from surounding.Then, when compessed -refrigerant "gives off" that heat to other cooling medium, like water or air ( in condenser). It also coud be explained by physics of entrophy- different states of entrophy ( or like some says " order of matter"), requires different energy levels.
A heat pump is a device, that by the help of efficient gas and cost of 1 unit of electical energy- converts large amount of low grade ( ambient) heat into smaller amount of "high grade" heat.
A heat pump is COP>1 device, for 1 unit of electrical energy, gives a few units of heat energy.The only difference from calling this OU device is- we know from where energy comes. I would say, a OU device is a COP>1 device where we don't know from where extra energy comes. Energy can't be created or destroyed.Every OU device only "converts" one state of energy to another state of energy.
Heat pump is a very efficient device, that converts large amount of low temperature heat, into smaler amount of high temperature heat by help of electric energy.
Regards
Pix

[pix]

@Low-Q

I totally agree with you.
keeping the fridge door open does not cool the kitchen, it warms it up.
And absolutely right, to make it work you need 3 reservoirs which I take in respect as you can see in my presentation. (the extended Carnot process)
The picture of that process just explains why it can work, it does not show the actual process in the generator, which is more complicated and involves more different energy levels.
Additionally the feedback provides a cascading effect to increase the heat.

The presentation was made for people with no technical skills, so I tried to keep it simple and just explain the basic principle.
This also means that the description is missing two parts.

For your convenience I add this presentation as pdf to this post.
It is the same that can be found on my webpage http://farislandllc.com

To RedEagle,
I would say a better solution o convert heat into electricity by use of refrigerants is Organic Rankine Cycle.It is like a steam driven turbine- the difference is: water has to be heated to high temperatures  to create a steam with parameters suitable to drive turbine connected to generator.Refrigerant does the same but at much lower temeratures, waste process heat or even ambient heat could be used in this cycle.  It's like inverted refrigerator where compresor is replaced by expander.
Simply explaining- refrigerant has different pressure at different temperatures.If we heat liquid refrigerant by-for example solar panel to 70 deg C, it will have let's say 26 Bar pressure. Then if we put cooler into the lake water of 20 degC temperature, refrigerant will have let's say 8 bar pressure at that temperature. So, we have 18 bar pressure difference. If we put expander in between, then we will have a lot of power to drive generator. System is closed loop, heater, expander and condenser has to be properly calculated for refrigerant mass flow.Expander could be done from scroll, vane of screw compressors. A lot of such systems are already in use and gaining more attention.System will work as long, as there is temperature difference.
I am designing my expander, it will be something completly new.
Regards,
Pix

[Low-Q]

For your convenience I add this presentation as pdf to this post.
It is the same that can be found on my webpage http://farislandllc.com

Interesting document. The system with the recycled input energy you presented is much like one I have been thinking of, expect I want to use gerotary compression pumps. These pumps does not need a million RPM to compress the working fluid and its efficiency is high already at low RPM. The expansion walve is replaced by a gerotary turbine, but its capacity must be less than the compressor. This will create an imbalance in pressure which is what I want. A 5 to 1 compression will recycle 20% of the energy supplied to the compressoin pump.


A plausible way to not using energy at all to compress and expand the working fluid is something I am working on. If this idea works out the heat pump would have a COP of way more than traditional heat pumps - even a lot more than industrial heat pumps.


I will (some day) post the idea somewhere at this site so I can have some inputs on cons and pros.


Vidar

[markdansie]

First of all. Heat pumps are not over unity machines. They move heat from one source to another. It's like shuffeling coal (Which contains lots of stored energy) from one place and into an oven.


[size=78%]The COP of a heat pump is often misunderstood. If it has a COP of 5, it means the pump can TRANSPORT 5 parts of energy with 1 part of energy input. It does not PRODUCE 5 parts of energy from 1 part of energy input. An ideal heat pump would have a COP of infinity, because transporting energy from one source to another does in fact not require energy at all. However, a heat pump suffer from losses because the pump must fight against a pressure difference between the cold and the hot radiator. The pump must compress the hot working fluid so it can deliver heat indoor. As the liquid working fluid expands it releases its heat energy and gets very cold. This gas will now be warmed up by the outdoor air or the ground. It will pick up heat only if the cold gas is colder than the outdoor air or ground.[/size]




Vidar

Great explanation, yet so many do not understand this
Mark