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Overunity Machines Forum



Magnetic OU principle, You should really take a look at this !

Started by Butch, July 02, 2008, 01:01:34 PM

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0 Members and 9 Guests are viewing this topic.

373bmc

Just a quick thought here guys.. There 2 sources of energy available here.. The seperation stroke, and the resultant potential created in the mass raised.. Capture both.

Butch

I am posting to our web page simulations and force charts of the moving elements divided into segments. We got force increases as high as 16 times and possibly 32.
Will post web link when Eric gets the folder uploaded.
Will test in real world situation to verify.
Thanks,
Butch

drsquires

Reply to abbarue....

The answer is not quite.  The idea is that if you move the magnets to a point close
to the stack of steel elements, washers or otherwise, you will reach a point of maximum
attractive force.  If you hold the stack clamped and measure the attractive force and
then let them expand and measure the attractive force again those two force measurements will
be equal.  Therefore in a rotating system or even a linear one if the entry and exit attractive
forces, (pull-in and pull-back) are equal they will average out to zero.  So those "cogging"
forces fall out of the total force equation and you are left with only the expansion force.
THAT is what comes for free.  The expansion force and movement of the elements has NO EFFECT
on the attractive cogging forces.  The expansion force is isolated due to it being at right angles to
the attractive cogging forces.

The requirements are that the volume of ferrous material in the gap must remain constant
and the gap distance must also remain constant.  Also, the steel elements must not
move out of the field region (artificially induced gap change).   Luckily, they can't move out because
they will only move to where the force drops to zero and stop.  It's self-regulating in this regard.

There is no worry about "defeating Lenz" either.  There is no Lenz effect to be concerned about because
the inductance in an EM version won't change.  The only possible way this can bite you is if you
use non-laminated steel with moving magnets or changing fields.  Then you will induce Lenz based
eddy currents in the steel that will cause drag or eddy current losses heating the steel.  But that
would be bad design in the first place.  Don't use solid steel sections except for static force measurements.

I hope the rest of you are finally understanding this concept.  "Yucca" gets it now.  This effect can
be harnessed to do incredible things once you understand it.  I have done a lot of optimization
work on it over the past year.  I would like to see you guys go through the same process
as a means of independent verification.

Cheers,
Dave Squires

Butch

Quote from: Butch on October 13, 2008, 02:52:00 PM
I am posting to our web page simulations and force charts of the moving elements divided into segments. We got force increases as high as 16 times and possibly 32.
Will post web link when Eric gets the folder uploaded.
Will test in real world situation to verify.
Thanks,
Butch

Here is the link for the simulations, open the force table in MS Word.
http://www.fdp.nu/shared/manager.asp?d=files\ButchLaFonte\Perpendicular%20Magnetics\Force\
Thanks,
Butch LaFonte

drsquires

To get the point across on how powerful this effect can be since Butch posted the wimpy
simulation results and very suboptimal structures I will post one simulation result of a better
structure to get you guys going the right direction.

This simulation uses M19 steel with 7 large segments that would be 4 inches deep and 3 inches high.
The gap on each side to the magnets is 0.25 inch. The magnets are N45 NIB. 
The total stroke would be about 8 inches in this example.
The force developed at the starting point shown here is just over 390lbs or 1738 newtons. 
Again the magnetic forces of attraction would be much larger, but is of
no consequence if proper design is used to manage and cancel those forces.

Enjoy,
Dave Squires