Joule Thief

[jadaro2600]

@all, this is FFR, not to question individual intelligence.  Someone somewhere will have enough time to eventually go over this thread and catalog the ideas set forth herein.

@electricme,

I look forward to your setup.  The idea of using powdered iron has crossed my mind, but rather than doing it as you described - I was going to simply coat the wire in glue and apply the iron powder.  This could be repeated - in effect, there would be a multi-layer powder-coated wire ...this would effectively strengthen the field directly around the wire - it would also reduce those eddy current in the toroid that xenomorphlabs mentioned ( that I've been aware of  - and after some experimentation, they do indeed form in toroids ).

Most of my bifilar setups incorporate a twisted pair of magnet wire which has been ( twisted tightly and evenly ); this is how I've made my experimental linear transformers - and they do work without being in any special location - they're referred to as a gimmick in the electrical realm.   

I've thought about using the gimmick as the primary and a tertiary as a pickup - this has been the implied suggestion of many here.  Now adding iron powder-coating to the gimmick might increase yields substantially.  I think the idea is a good one.

I have a hard time finding local supplies - I did find some 1200 (F) degrees grill paint made by Rust-Oleum - it might make a good adhesive for this while remaining heat resistant - if everything is spaced just right, it might make a better coil coating then this enamel that normally comes with the magnet wire.  It's reporting to be about twice as heat resistant than most enamel on high grade mag wire - but this stuff it probably just good for local setups like you've mentioned.

It sounds like you're suffering the plagues or something - hope all gets better.

@gadgetmall,

Firstly, I can't ignore the need for ferrite - but I did, and the results were weak, so yes, ferrite is needed - the configuration is left to question though.  Eddy current will form in the toroid, and this swill cause losses to heat - eventually, maybe not at first, but at resonance when the steady state potentials are reached and everything is warmed up so to speak, there will be a measurable loss.

Some people have reported an unusual effect that when they first turn their device on, they get a brighter light and after a few seconds, things dim down a bit.  This is due to heat - heat destroys the field - it might also be caused a rotating magnetic field or a current flowing around the toroid since they do conduct on the inside.

I think it's the eventual idea is to light fluorescents using the joule thief with as little current as possible - my proposal was to stick to a 12v source - but I realize there are already application using this.  I got one lit with a 9v battery, but the transistor got hot.  I haven't revisited that design either.

Also, I understand the notion of chemtrails - I've seen them frequently - but I have a feeling that some of what I'm seeing is the result of temperature differentials and the condensation remaining at certain altitudes rather than at others.  It doesn't help living near so many airports.  I don't trust these emissions regardless - this gradient is just an even more valid excuse for them.

@gadgetmall & electricme,

If the magnetic domains in ferrite could be insulated, then the effects generated when subjecting them to a magnetic field could potentially increase.  The toroids conduct about their circumference.  The method proposed by electricme may indeed help isolate the effects of circumferential eddy currents.  The idea proposed might isolate magnetic domains closer to the wire away from where eddy currents are more apt to form ( since electric current flows at the center of a coil more so than about it's circumference )

Know of any iron based paint?  It would save me / us the trouble of trying to powder coat a coil setup.   something red maybe? ..I've even entertained the idea of powder coating with iron oxide as well - since oxygen is a polar molecule in the environment.

[nievesoliveras]

@jadaro

Use metal flakes paint. Maybe it is real metal flakes.

Jesus

[Pirate88179]

@ Jim:

Using your idea of the crushed/powdered ferrite and my idea of the plastic tubing, we could also then experiment with the "gap" principle we were discussing a while back.  Instead of having to saw through an existing ferrite toroid, due to the flexible nature of the tubing, we could easily experiment with various gaps whose width could easily be accurately controlled with a screw mechanism.  As was pointed out by someone, these gaps were used to create the high freqs required by radar during the war so by being able to very precisely change and control this gap, we might push our frequencies much higher than we thought we could as being limited by the transistor.

Just a thought.



@ Jadaro:

I like your idea of coating the wire.  No mater if you use ferrite powder of iron powder, with your method you could shape your wire exactly how you want it, because this will not be flexible after wards, and spray the wire with your paint and while wet, apply a thin coating of powder, let dry and repeat as many times as needed to get the amount of material to cover your wire.  You may even be able to use a heat source to "bake" your finish on as you go. (be careful of exploding fumes from the paint)  With this method, I imagine you could get a pretty thick build up of material fairly quickly.  As the layers are building, you could also perform some tests to see where you are magnetically (and for tunability) so you could see when to stop layering.  I think this is also a great idea that you have to build a wire inside the core essentially.

This will be fragile when done but I'll bet it will work!   As for the iron paint, I am not sure what is added to the high temp paint you already thought of but my guess it would either be a metal powder or a ceramic refractory material of some kind. It might be listed on the side of your can.  I think it would be better to add your own powder as you go so you, and then others, can replicate it.  Great thinking on your part here.

Bill

[WilbyInebriated]

2 rechargeable 1.2v batteries will run a 8 watt fluoro very nicely. i can run voltages from as little as .95v to 6v, but it's not really a classic jt, more of a resonant 'royer'.

[resonanceman]

@all,

If you've seen some of my posts, you know that I've created a ferrite-free design which employed a coil about a coil.

I was wondering ( in the late stagnation of this thread and the subsequent wandering toward chemtrails ( oil vapor - which I see all too often living near an air-force base an all ) ) ... if anyone has had any secondary thoughts about coil design which did not use ferrite?

This type of design would be something scalable and wouldn't require the specificity of any material other than the gage of wire and the general configuration - perhaps a special setup?  ..an ignition coil setup or something random like that.

Lately, I've asked myself a few questions regarding how this device could be improved to be more flexible when it comes to replicating without extreme deviations in baseline design ( sort of like a standard );  Not that I wish to regulate anyone's creativity, however, the presence of such a multitude of designs can create confusion for anyone wanting to 'get started'...I also understand that I'm just asking for more, and varied, designs - which is totally hypocritical.

Since not everyone has access to ferrite toroids, and not every toroid is the same; my initial designs were made without them, however the perpendicularity of the magnetic fields causes some question as to their efficacy - generally speaking, it's like having a voltage collecting sleeve around a ring-shaped coil, and thus it collects a minimal amount of voltage when the magnetic filed collapses - which brought to mind an interesting reversal of the input and output terminals on the coil.  To my surprise, the voltage gain was the same in either configuration.  Any attempts to add a tertiary coil to the design nullified any gains.  Remember, this isn't your average coil setup...

jadaro

I agree  we need to come up with  an alternative to  the toroids ....... they are not  available  everwhere and  not alll   of them  will  work with the JT .
I have  come up with something that  works ..... I am not saying that it works great .....but the voltage  I have got  is similar  to the  voltages  from my  black  toroids from  electronic goldmine .

I am calling it a floppy  toroid .   

I  imagine  that most  people  have an old VHS tape laying  around .

I found one .... tore  it apart then  broke  the  top  off the  full real  and  pulled  about  3/16 think  loop  off the   real.
I then  wrapped  electrical  tape  around  this  loop  of magnetic  tape .

I have sense wrapped  2 bifilar windings ( about 6 feet each )   of wire  from  a cat5 cable   around  the  toroid   ( MK  style ) 
( edit  ...... that is  2 windings  each one a bifilar twisted pair )
I have got each  of these coils  to light  a led ........and now I have them  running in parrallel   in one JT
Connecting  them  in  parrallel  lowered  the  voltage just a little .....but I am  guessing that others here  will  improve  greatly  on my results so far


The  voltage  I was talking about is  measured by hooking a bridge   across the  diode .......then  a cap  to the bridge  and messuring the  voltage  on the cap     I got  2.9v  for  the  bifilars separately  and  2.7V with them in parrallel


( edit ......this   toriod  did not  work  without  the a cap  across the  transistor  load  resistor .   I  recommend  using   a pot ..... the  range  that it  work in is  narrower than the black  toroids. 
I used  .01uF  and .1uF  the  .1uF works better  )



I plan to keep playing  with this .    
Maybe  a secondary  or 2



gary