"Free energy" and "Overunity" We need a definition.

[poynt99]

Actually, "renewable" is a bad term IMHO.

That's actually what it DOES mean Bill 

Renewable Energy sources are those that renew themselves without human intervention, so by definition, your earth battery and every other natural source of energy, is "renewable".

Renewable Energy sources include:
- Solar
- Wind
- Geothermal
- Water (ocean waves, river flow etc.)
- Biomass (wood, ethanol, etc.)

- Telluric Current/Earth Batteries perhaps belong in their own class of renewable energy?

.99

[Pirate88179]

@ poynt99:

I agree with your term for all except the last one you listed.  Ethanol, made from corn, or whatever, is made...then used...and the corn has to be grown again.  So, there is human intervention.  But, as for the rest, yes, I agree.

Maybe, just maybe, the earth battery is renewable also in that, we "drain" it, and the earth "renews" (charges) it again?  That is exactly why I made this topic.  Not to argue semantics, but to define what it is we are after.  Please, I am not saying you are arguing semantics, but I know this will come up if/when others respond to my posts.

I really appreciate your responding to my topic.  I have seen your other posts on many other topics and I do value your opinion.  I am here to try to learn and possibly, help others and maybe contribute in any way that I can.  when I take a step back from all that is taking place here, I see a need to define our goals.  If others do not agree, then maybe they are correct and I am wrong.  (It has happened before)  If/when I ever "get it", I guess I would just like to know if my "it" is the same as most folk's "it".  Thanks again for taking the time to post here.

Bill

[captainpecan]

This is a very interesting topic to me. I have previously gotten into some interesting discussions regarding this issue.  The problem is, most people try and complicate the hell out of it, when I believe, it is in fact very simple.  At least the way I see it anyway... wright or wrong...

The first problem is that most people actually think that Free Energy is exactly the same thing as Over Unity.  In my opinion, they are extremely different.  One is impossible, and the other is everywhere!  Let me explain...

Over Unity is impossible, and laws of physics prove this in many ways.  But before you get upset, realize this...  Under Unity is also impossible!  Everything is EXACTLY UNITY!  Energy cant be created or destroyed, only converted to other forms of energy.  For instance, an electric motor loses energy to heat from resistance and to other factors.  But if you add up the electrical energy sent to it, then you add up the heat energy lost, plus the kinetic energy gained from the rotation, and all other forms of energy entering and leaving the equation... You end up with exactly what you had when you started.   If energy was described as a molecule, and you added up every molecule of energy in the universe, since it can't be created or destroyed, then there is exactly the same amount energy in the universe today as there was 500 years ago.  That being true, this also means that every single device ever invented actually runs at perfectly UNITY.  But this also means that every bit of energy ever used, was free......

Free Energy is what we are all searching for.  And when you study what the laws of physics tell us, they also prove that Free Energy is everywhere.  Think of it this way...  Free energy actually means... AVAILABLE Energy.  How much it financially costs us is irrelevant.  A battery is actually a free energy device.  Charge it up, now you have "available" energy to use... Just like a hydroelectric generator, there is plenty of free "available" energy in the form of kinetic energy in the flow of water.  A hydroelectric generator simply converts the available kinetic energy into mechanical and electrical energy we can use.  If you add up all the sources of energy together, it's still exactly unity.  But to us, we made use of the free energy that was there, and we converted it so we could run our lights!

Free Energy is everywhere.  Converting it efficiently is the problem to be solved.  Honestly, a simple pendulum is a free energy device.  Think about it, all the energy that is put into it is lifting it from the bottom steady state in the middle position to a higher position.  Doing this, we must overcome the inertia of the pendulum wanting to stay still, and overcome gravity by lifting it up.  Now what happens when you let it go...  You get the gravitational energy back when it swings back to it's starting position again, but now the gravitational energy and the inertia wanting to keep it moving, forces it past it's starting position and on it's way back up the other side.  This is where the free energy enters the equation.  Newtons law says "every action has an equal and opposite reaction".  Guess what, nature see's the pendulum moving past where it started and gravity enters the equation to force it back to the start and fighting to overcome the inertia.  Now what you end up with is gravity and inertia fighting back and forth working against each other trying to stop the pendulum from moving as it keeps moving past the starting point until everything eventually balances out and it comes to rest.  When you really think about it, there is energy being converted back and forth like crazy in something as simple as a pendulum, with only one little lift to start it.

Just my take on it...  But for those who believe free energy only means energy you never paid any money for...  I've got a very simple way to get all the free energy you want...  Get someone else to pay your electric bill, and never pay them back!  There's your free energy device that fits the definition exactly...

[captainpecan]

When you view free energy like I view it, idea's start popping up like crazy...  I've got about a thousand of them, most of them are not practical at all, hence the very nature of the problem.

Like this one...  There is a lot of free energy in something as simple as air bubbles... lol 
Think of this. How much electrical energy does it take to make air bubbles, hardly any at all.  But no matter what you do with an air bubble in water, it will fight to get to the surface.  So theoretically, you could pump some air bubbles in the bottom of a tank, let the air bubbles push small wheels on their way to the surface. Just like those nifty little things in your fish tank that move when air bubbles build up under them... Those small wheels "turbines" will generate some electrical energy to keep the battery charged you are running your air pump with.  Not enough electrical energy being generated to keep it running...  make the water tank taller, and "conserve that energy" as you keep reusing the energy from the air bubbles as they keep fighting through all the turbines on the way to the top.  A mile high tank of water, would get one little air bubble helping to push hundreds or thousands of turbines on it's way to the surface.  How much energy did it take to make that one air bubble?  Dont want to waste the air bubbles, instead of running a pump, split the water with the energy the bubbles make.  Now your bubbles are HHO and can be used even further!  hmmm... or maybe even just capping it off at the top, and feeding the air back to the bottom through a hose.  After everything finally balances out pressures, every bubble that hit's the surface would release one in the bottom of the tank.  Then it would not even need to be powered by electricity at all....

Practical.... nope... stupid, maybe, maybe not...  interesting... yup... lol

[spinner]

"Free Energy" and "OverUnity"... FE & OU

For both terms one can find as many definitions as he wants... Both descriptions can be found in classical physics, but it frequently differs from the various interest groups (like this forum) common understandings...

FE? I'd say it is any recognisable (or maybe not?) energy source which is used by us, people, in an "unconventional / not commonly used" ways..

E.g. Earth batteries, "environmental charge" electricity, local fluid pressure potential differency ... Tapping the kinetic energy of a stream of water, coming from a tap while filling your pool or bath tub... Using the heat of your car exhausts for powering Peltier's, etc... Using a rain fall kinetics... etc, etc ... This "FE" is there since ever, but are we using it??? Why not?

Renewable energy (Poynt's point) is usually the prime energy source... Which means that this FE is still "CoE defined"... It's rather small in the magnitude of the effect (otherwise it would be widely used), and the project (!) never is absolutely "free of cost"... Even though the energy source itself is "for free"...

Check out the main energy sources used today... Renewables are still the small part of our energy pie. Even though they're a "Free Energy"...


OU?
There is actually NOT EVEN ONE DEVICE, which could be declared as "OverUnity"... (there are many claims, but ...If ones know any of such device, please, point me to it...)

This is the thoroughly researched area of a classical physics / thermodynamics.. Considering a very strict rules (definitions of a closed system), so far not even one device produced more "output" than "input"....

Which would be equal to producing power/energy out of nothing.
Which would made Perpetual motion a piece of cake.
Which is (to date) never achieved, and is considered "impossible"!... But ... Is it, really?