Peter Lindemann, The Mechanical Engine: A Re-Evolution of Bessler's Wheel

[BAHammer]

Good bye Jim,

Until another time, another pseudonym.

Ralph

  Ralph,
only reason I quit using p-motion was Alan did not like me posting with other people. This was an attempt to discourage him. But he is your friend.

[mindsweeper]

OBSERVATION:

The lack of a good moderator sure does surface on overunity.com

Why must people bicker so much..

[BAHammer]

OBSERVATION:

The lack of a good moderator sure does surface on overunity.com

Why must people bicker so much..

Good point MS.
Myself, I think what is going on with Alan and me is that he is working on Mt 24. Some of the things he has posted suggests this. Just as he brought Mt 24 into this thread. There could be something he wanted me to clarify. He has posted that I will need to learn to dance for the public. And it could be why in the G-Force thread he was busy saying he had proven it won't work. That is because he was/is working on it and did not want someone else working on it.
This would go to, why not work cooperatively in an open forum ? And the basic reason would be that some people want the attention most of all for "discovering" perpetual motion.
And yet, if they had put years into studying math, science among other things, they would have a bit more respect for how difficult it is.
Later tonite, I might post clearly the most likely way Mt 24 worked to help Alan.

[BAHammer]

  Alan,
in case you are working on Mt 24 and other Bessler drawings, could be wrong.
The first drawing with the red lines going to 2 different weights could be Bessler's first wheels of this type.
This would mean that the over balanced weight would be rotated at least 45 degrees aftyer 45 degrees from bottom center. this would mean it would be leaning in towards the center of the wheel. And without bearings ( he had none ), the wheel would have rotated slowly allowing the weight to fall against the arm.
The second drawing is Mt 20. it shows which weight that can rotate to Mt 24.
The third drawing shows on Mt 24 where i moved it to show he could use similar mechanics in different drawings.

edited to add; The first attempt might have had 2 opposing ( 180 degrees apart ) weights with a line attaching them. This would cancel out centrifugal force as both weights and rods would be at 45 degrees to the force of gravity.
The second, with a weight at 45 dergees, it might have had more stored potential kinetic energy. In simpler terms, once it could swing down, it might have shifted quicker.

[BAHammer]

 And with this, at 90 degrees. bessler might have found out that it was easier and simpler to have 2 weights shifting at the same time with the same cf acting on both of them.
Because the line would be closer to center than the weights, this would mean that both weights would cancel out their respective cf because it would be the same on all weights with the same rod/weight relationship.
As he went along, he would have refined his design based on what he learned from his other working models.
Of course, with Mt 20, the lever is inverted ( backwards ). Even a dog would tire of doing the same trick. He was a little bit smarter.

edited to add; with 2 arms at 45 degrees to the axle, the weights on rods would also be at 45 degrees to the force of gravity.
With the levers, the opposing lever helps to act as a counter balance. The shift in the 2 main weights creates more of a shift in balance as they are heavier than the lighter weights on the levers.
And in all, there might be 3 different configurations that would allow Mt 24 to work.
Had to run spell check 

  Alan,
If I have to venture a guess, I'd go with 135 degrees. The reason for this is when the weight that needs to move to it's starting position would be at 45 degrees after bottom center. The first drawing with red lines. The red line that does not go straight across. If you look at Bessler's pic, the weight and arm does not rotate out to 90 degrees. This would mean that the weight hanging from the arm could be rotating some before it reaches the level of the axle. It would have the help of the long lever and it's weight.
  it's a guess, this means I could be wrong.