Claimed OU circuit of Rosemary Ainslie

[Rosemary Ainslie]

.99:

I would just measure at the center of the shaft.  I think that it is reasonable to assume that every point on the resistor could be used as a reference for the delta-temp measurements.  The center of the resistor is the center of the thermal mass which would imply that that point acts as the smoothest low pass filter for the power dissipation, but that is really splitting hairs.  Every point on the resistor body still smooths out the varying heat power into a constant temperature, as long as you keep measuring at the same point.  You could also lower the angle of the shaft if you wanted to slow down the moving column of air which should even out the temperature more.

MileHigh

Hi MileHigh.  Words fail me.     Would love to hear more on your waveform analysis.  Not so keen on the apparatus positioning advices anymore.      

[MileHigh]

Hi Rosemary,

I am not sure where all of the exuberance is coming from exactly, I will assume it is from Harvey's analysis showing negative average battery energy.  Thus the conclusion that the battery is being charged while it runs the circuit.

Everyone should realize that more data will be recorded and reported.  Any approach to science should be conservative, taking things one step at a time.  So celebrate if you wish but be aware that you have to gather much more data before you can arrive at a conclusion with a high degree of confidence.

In Poynt's power measurement setup, he will effectively be doing what we asked Aaron to do with the "negative dominant waveform" setup, power the device with a capacitor.

Current will flow out of the second capacitor into the Ainsley circuit load, the second capacitor effectively acting as a power supply.  Powering the circuit will lower the voltage on the second capacitor.  When the circuit kicks power back into the capacitor, you will not see any voltage spikes like you would see with a battery, but the second capacitor voltage will go up a tiny smidgen.  The second capacitor will soak up any return energy with no losses at all, in contrast to a battery where there are losses.

In Poynt's setup, if the second capacitor starts to drop in voltage indicating more energy out than in, then current will start to seep into the second capacitor from the first capacitor (which will be connected to his power supply).  Poynt's multimeter will be placed across this resistor to measure any possible DC voltage drop.  If he measures a voltage drop then he will have both critical numbers, the average current and the voltage that is powering the Ainsley circuit load.

This technique is simply a trick that allows you to convert a very difficult to measure complex current consumption/return waveform into a simple DC value that even the cheapest multimeter can read.  Let's see what happens!

MileHigh

[Rosemary Ainslie]

Hello MileHigh

So glad to see you're still fighting your corner.  I was afraid we'd have nothing left to talk about. 

The exuberance is simply because there's been a replication.  Frankly I was beginning to feel like the fraud that TK accused me of being.  And 10 years is a long time.  I also started assuming errors in our analysis.  Not a nice place to be.  So.  Make allowances. 

Your point regarding the need for extra data collation.  It's unarguable.  But at least there's a replication to start from.  With the skills here - one assumes the counter arguments will get addressed and that's always a good thing.  But the 'cherry' is the opportunity to work towards a paper - and the 'checks and counter checks' will, presumably, be thoroughly evaluated.  At its least we've got you and Poynt to argue where required and probably also where it's not required.  But again.  That's also all good.

I'm not sure of the relevance of Poynt's test.  To me if you bury the spike in a capacitor you're also denying the very effect that the circuit requires - which is that spike.  If you're trying to evaluate the energy in the spike then put it to work in recharging a supply source or running a load.  Cannot see any sense in the arrangement.  But I'm open to correction.  Frankly - I've never got my head around the 'capacitors' and it's simply because I've never seen inside one.  What material?  Why does it hold charge?  Things I don't know and really don't want to know.  The test objects are to determine the value of energy returned in the 'off period' of the duty cycle.  I need to see that this nearly equals - equals - or betters the energy delivered.  That sort of helps my thesis. 

But if Poynt's test is in fact relevant then I'm sure we'll need to take cognisance.   And I shall be happy to do so. 

[MileHigh]

.99:

I think mounting the resistor horizontal still may be an option worth looking at. That way we should be able to take a measurement anywhere along the top and it should not vary much.

I think that keeping the tube thermally isolated is the most important factor, as you clearly have done in your setup.

If the tube is horizontal then the heated air inside the tube is subject to any random wafting air in the area.  If the heated air gets blown out then the tube has to heat the new air again, introducing a wobble in the temp.  This is in contrast to the tube in a vertical position or at an angle where the tube itself becomes it own "heat pump" with the rising column of air.  This makes it a bit more stable and self-regulating in terms of temperature.

Ash:

I HOPE OU FORUM HAS SOUR GRAPES!!! Yep its about time some one said it.

Bring it on baby!  lol

Let's just see what happens.  My mouth is not watering yet.   

MH

[fuzzytomcat]

Everyone should realize that more data will be recorded and reported.  Any approach to science should be conservative, taking things one step at a time.  So celebrate if you wish but be aware that you have to gather much more data before you can arrive at a conclusion with a high degree of confidence.

In Poynt's power measurement setup, he will effectively be doing what we asked Aaron to do with the "negative dominant waveform" setup, power the device with a capacitor.

Current will flow out of the second capacitor into the Ainsley circuit load, the second capacitor effectively acting as a power supply.  Powering the circuit will lower the voltage on the second capacitor.  When the circuit kicks power back into the capacitor, you will not see any voltage spikes like you would see with a battery, but the second capacitor voltage will go up a tiny smidgen.  The second capacitor will soak up any return energy with no losses at all, in contrast to a battery where there are losses.

In Poynt's setup, if the second capacitor starts to drop in voltage indicating more energy out than in, then current will start to seep into the second capacitor from the first capacitor (which will be connected to his power supply).  Poynt's multimeter will be placed across this resistor to measure any possible DC voltage drop.  If he measures a voltage drop then he will have both critical numbers, the average current and the voltage that is powering the Ainsley circuit load.

This technique is simply a trick that allows you to convert a very difficult to measure complex current consumption/return waveform into a simple DC value that even the cheapest multimeter can read.  Let's see what happens!

MileHigh

I didn't realize that there was a approve testing method that is used by some university, government or accredited testing agency on the method of measuring current return to battery's. Could you please reference the material a document, PDF or where the text is located so that all members, guests and replicators can use this published information on there replication it appears you know right where it is, and for the life of me I just can't find those documents to share with the "open source" community.

Fuzzy