Joule Thief 101

[MileHigh]

<<< The correct answer to this question !is!-at T=0 ,when the voltage connects to the coil,the current rises instantly to an infinite value. >>>

Really, eh?  The current rises instantly to an infinite value for an ideal inductor when connected to an ideal voltage source.  That's a pretty striking fact.  So striking in fact that you would think it's something that you would have heard about before.  Christ, it's such a striking statement that you might hear about it just as often or even more often than the bloody Schumann resonance.

But in fact you never hear about it.  And the reason you never hear about it is because it's a nonsensical "fact" that you made up on the spot when we got into this discussion.  You invented it out of thin air using your own convoluted "logic."

That's something for you to think about.

[MileHigh]

Not really MH,,  your ideal parts provide for an infinite condition which is absolutely stupid to begin with,, things stop in science when you have an infinite answer,, no duh!!

Wrong.

[tinman]

 author=MileHigh link=topic=8341.msg483359#msg483359 date=1462682924]


MileHigh
[/quote]

Your so confused MH,your disproving your self in your own statements.

Firstly, there is no bloody resistance in the example, so why in hell are you even mentioning a resistance?

You cant be serious
Because MH,you have stated in your question that you have 4 volts for 3 seconds over--you guessed it,a coil that has zero resistance.

Perhaps the EE guys are fed up and want to see you sink or swim on your own.  We both know that if Poynt came here and backed me up then you would stop being belligerent and shut up and listen.

We both know Poynt will not back you up,as he knows as well as i do that you cannot have 4 volts over a coil that has no resistance.

<<< Because T=L/R,and as R=0,then T also =0-->instant.  >>>

  Secondly, let's put that issue aside and look at your statement.  You are saying that "Tau is also equal to zero" but Tau = L/R so when R is zero then Tau is equal to infinity, not zero.  What the fuck??

Well first up ,T represents Time.
The time required for the current to rise to 63.2% of the maximum value after the switch is closed is the ratio of inductance to resistance (L/R). As there is no resistance,the the value of T(time) is an instant value. As to get to the 63% mark is instant,then maximum current is also instant. As there is no resistance,then the current maximum is infinite.
I see that bad language is coming back MH

Right now you are completely mixed up and apparently don't know where to start.  You looked up some stuff online and presented some links but you draw incorrect conclusions from the links.  The question is very basic.  It's an important question because if you know how to answer it then you can look at a circuit on paper and get a preliminary sense of how it works.

I have answered your question correctly.

I think you should try to get a discussion going with your peers but leave out the gurus.  Figure it out among yourselves.  Whatever you do is up to you but I am telling you with 100% certainty that right now you are dead wrong and all of your trash talk about me is bouncing right back at you.

I am telling you i am correct,and you are wrong.
Find just one(yes-just one) example of an ideal voltage being placed across an ideal inductor--you will not--well maybe in MH fairyland.

An ideal inductor/coil cannot dissipate any real power,it does not have resistance nor hysteresis loss and does not heat up,and there for cannot dissipate the power being created when you place your ideal voltage across it. And so that in it self proves your answers incorrect,and also shows why an ideal voltage cannot be placed across an ideal inductor--as i stated some time back.

As i said before,i believe the reason that no EE guy here has said anything MH,is because it will show that you are incorrect. As sad as it may be,you guys tend to stick together,whether one of you know the other is wrong or not. It would be nice if those in the know stood for accurate and correct answer's,and not swayed by the !lets stick together! motto that seems to exist here.

Are you saying MH,that you can have a DC current flowing through an ideal inductor/coil,and also have a voltage across it at the same time?.


Brad

[tinman]

<<< The correct answer to this question !is!-at T=0 ,when the voltage connects to the coil,the current rises instantly to an infinite value. >>>

Really, eh?  The current rises instantly to an infinite value for an ideal inductor when connected to an ideal voltage source.  That's a pretty striking fact.  So striking in fact that you would think it's something that you would have heard about before.  Christ, it's such a striking statement that you might hear about it just as often or even more often than the bloody Schumann resonance.

But in fact you never hear about it.  And the reason you never hear about it is because it's a nonsensical "fact" that you made up on the spot when we got into this discussion.  You invented it out of thin air using your own convoluted "logic."

That's something for you to think about.

Thats exactly what would happen-->if it could happen,which as i stated many times already,cannot happen. You cannot place an ideal voltage across an ideal inductor or coil.
A voltage cannot exist across an ideal coil/inductor while a DC current flows through it.
So your answer to your own question is wrong,as it cannot happen.
If by some !ideal! chance that this could be done,then it would be as i said it would be--the current would rise to an infinite amount in an instant the moment the ideal voltage is placed across that ideal coil/inductor.


Brad

[tinman]

Alrighty then lets start with the first simple question.

If I have 1V source with an endless supply of charge carriers and connect a 0.0 ohm wire across that source,,

How much current will flow while the circuit is connected?

How much energy is there when an almost mass-less object is instantly accelerated to any change in velocity?

So an ideal wire will pass an infinite amount current if connected to an infinite supply that is at some voltage.

Now the question becomes,, is there a relaxation time period for a wire with no resistance??

If the answer is no then the universe just blew up,, if the answer is yes then what is causing the delay which in and of itself would be providing for a resistance.

Anyway I look at it I see that an infinite source with any "ideal" conductor\coil setup will have a moment at least upon contact of an instant movement of charge carriers which are almost mass-less objects that would be accelerated instantly to some change in velocity.

So to consider the questions posed one of the parts can NOT be ideal.

MH, you posed the questions with all ideal parts,, and well you can not argue with f=ma

If the answer is no then the universe just blew up,,

Bingo Webby.
An unstoppable force,meets an unmovable object.
To quote Poynt-post 2334-->At t=0, I think the universe might blow up 

I have provided the correct answer to MHs question he asked EMJ,Wattsup,and anyone else that cared to take it up. MH did not answer his own question correctly,but feels he can still pass judgment on those he thinks got it wrong.


Brad