water gravity wheel

[mr_bojangles]

this idea stemmed from P-Motion's thread on besslers water wheel

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8389.msg214644#new
found there^

and i did not wish to flood his thread with a different topic (sorry about that mate) so i started a new one

AB Hammer you have shared some wisdom already but i welcome any more insight into this idea


basically as you can see, one wheel, one roller

there is a bladder, it can be thought of as simply as attaching a garden hose to the inside of a wheel and connecting the ends

water is introduced only to one side of the tube/bladder

the idea is, because the roller and the water weigh the same, it seeks to balance out, somewhere half way between where the water meet and the inner roller connect

(also if you notice, the water weighs more at the top due to its triangular shape at the top of the bladder)

think of it as having the same amount of weight at the 3 o clock and the 12

they will even out as this should

we lock the roller and allow the system to balance out, half way between where the roller and water are introduced

now we unfix the roller, and it seeks balance, rolling down towards the middle

while trying to do this, it squeezes the bladder, pushing the water back up the side, making it overbalanced

i am not sure the red rollers are necessary, but would ensure a seal

if you're concerned the weight would be increased, the total weight of all rollers could be equal to the weight of water to compensate

first pis is latest drawing that includes a double roller, second pic is the first proof of concept without a double roller

[Cloxxki]

Wow, am I ever slow sometimes. NOW I understand your "bladder", genious!

I see that bladder, for my visualisation, as a wedge out of styrofoam or something more durable, wedged in the only space left after the water is added. Or better, water will be added as last "part" simply until full.
The wedge will float on the water, or any liquid for that matter, thus even in the water makes it past the bottom of the wheel, it will not be much of it.
The red rollers may not be needed for the thing to work per se, but will be useful to keep it oriented correctly internally, and not counter-act itself at times.
For smooth opereration, with tolerances as implicitly indicated here, water itself may actually be a bit to "rough". A lightweight oil of some kind (compliant to the bladder material chosen of course) might smoothen operation by self-lubricating.

I am quite facinated with your design, it feel a bit like coming home to something. Maybe as I kid I once dreamt of it. Some toys have similar dynamics, although I couldn't name one now.

More than usually, I am super interested to learn why it should NOT work. I can't see it at this stage. I do see amendments made to it that might improve operation. As you may have read, I suggest one-way clutches pretty much everywhere (I'm a cyclist). When it work though, your waterwheel may not even need it.

Are you considering building this, if no-one can tel you why it won't work?

Regards,

J

[historisis]

Wow, am I ever slow sometimes. NOW I understand your "bladder", genious!

I see that bladder, for my visualisation, as a wedge out of styrofoam or something more durable, wedged in the only space left after the water is added. Or better, water will be added as last "part" simply until full.
The wedge will float on the water, or any liquid for that matter, thus even in the water makes it past the bottom of the wheel, it will not be much of it.
The red rollers may not be needed for the thing to work per se, but will be useful to keep it oriented correctly internally, and not counter-act itself at times.
For smooth opereration, with tolerances as implicitly indicated here, water itself may actually be a bit to "rough". A lightweight oil of some kind (compliant to the bladder material chosen of course) might smoothen operation by self-lubricating.

I am quite facinated with your design, it feel a bit like coming home to something. Maybe as I kid I once dreamt of it. Some toys have similar dynamics, although I couldn't name one now.

More than usually, I am super interested to learn why it should NOT work. I can't see it at this stage. I do see amendments made to it that might improve operation. As you may have read, I suggest one-way clutches pretty much everywhere (I'm a cyclist). When it work though, your waterwheel may not even need it.

Are you considering building this, if no-one can tel you why it won't work?

Regards,

J

It won't work cause of many reasons: one, the fiction of the water being squeezed will add too much resistance for the device to continue. second, it needs pressure on the pre and post rotation so it will partially counteract the resistance. Sorry... But, keep trying you'll get it.

[Cloxxki]

The inevitable funnel shape towards the bottom of the wheel where water might be forcing itself out, might be may highly hydrophobic, to reduce it's willingness to go there at all. Hydrophobic bladder or wedge as well as inner wheel outer would also not hurt.

Sadly, if all else fails, mercury might be the trick to make this work. Seems it can be more easily convinced to stick together while flowing well. And plenty of heft.

It never going to easy, but the OP has a great design here, IMHO.

[FreeEnergy]