The downfalls of conventional electrolysis - and how to fix them

[ramset]

spinner
this one will be good to watch buddy!!

Chet
Also Farrah's opinion on what is happening with Mookie's cell
Farrah
Quote:
As a consequence of Mookie employing his time and effort in experimenting with electrolysers and magnetism, he has recently afforded me a ‘Eureka!’ moment.

Though my interpretations of what is occurring differ vastly to that of Mookie’s own interpretations, I still have Mookie to thank for demonstrating the effect in the first place, and providing me with a new insight and indeed a new avenue to explore.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKqs5z2DrCk

Though I have stated much of my thoughts on the Dissociation of the Water Molecule thread, I want to reiterate my thoughts here before I go into detailing my planning, designing and indeed fabricating of a new cell based on what I… think I know.

Firstly, I believe the phenomenon we are witnessing is due to cavitation, and this is what I think is happening in Mookie’s set up.

He has stainless steel electrodes in a glass jar of water doped with a small amount of KOH. This simple electrolyser is powered by a stabilised dc PSU from a PC, and is using the 12volt terminals. Close to the glass jar electrolyser he has a powerful industrial electromagnet.

When he attaches the 12v PSU, normal electrolysis takes place. When he also powers up the electromagnet, the magnetic field produced by the dc current flowing through the electrolyser interacts with the powerful magnetic field of the electromagnet.  The electromagnet, being mains powered is hence running at 50 â€" 60Hz albeit via a variac.  This 50 â€" 60Hz mains frequency causes the electrodes to oscillate at this given frequency, applying more voltage simply increases the amplitude of the oscillations. Below a certain amplitude, little or no cavitation is in evidence, but up the voltage and the effect eventually displays itself.

One minor area of contention is that Mookie says it won’t work with stainless steel electrodes that are NOT magnetic.   Well, obviously magnetic electrodes will be influenced into vibrating far easier â€" or greater - than non-magnetic electrodes, but I personally doubt that this is a critical factor.  If this were a critical factor, then cavitation and hence evolving gases would surely be evident when the electromagnet was powered up near the electrolyser, even without the electrolyser itself being powered. This does not seem to be the case.  Now, there is some visual motion of the water that suggests that the plates might indeed be oscillating via the electromagnet and without the electrolyser being powered, but not to such a degree that initiates cavitation.  However, as yet it is unclear as to whether or not the glass jar is in physical contact with the electromagnet, and if this is the case then this observation could be simply a result of the electromagnet itself physically vibrating and nothing to do with its magnetic field.

The magnetic field of the electromagnet is proportional to the current flowing through it, which itself is proportional to the applied voltage, so reducing the voltage on the variac correspondingly reduces the current and hence the magnetic field.

There is quite a lot to explore here before designs can be optimised.  We first need to know if certain frequencies are more efficient than others in this process and what works best.  What would happen if the electrolyser voltage was also pulsing? AC might not produce normal electrolysis, but would cavitation efficiency rise or reduce… would AC work at all?

If Fleming’s right hand rule is a key factor, how do we go about designing an electrolyser that best exploits this rule?

I sense some fun and interesting times lie ahead.

Edit: I keep referring to Fleming's right hand rule, but actually Fleming's left hand rule may be more applicable here. The right hand rule is known as the generator rule whereas the left hand rule is known as the motor rule. Either way I feel Fleming's rules may play an important role here. 

Last Edit: 2010-11-01, 20:27:55 by Farrah Day 

from here 
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=399.msg6213;topicseen#msg6213

[ramset]

Some more from Mookie
Mookie Quote:

As far as output I need to be cautious in what I say. This "accellerator" is based on Felix Ehrenhaft's work in the 1930's. His experiments, and those who briefly followed up on it demonstrated a tenfold to 15x increase in the electrolysis rate. I have no way to properly measure that, but can confirm from my own experiments that the increase has to be at least ten times.The effect, as I said earlier, is obvious, dramatic and ferocious.

I assure you, firsthand, that the work that those that are doing this in a much more advanced way than what I have described here
will never see the light of day.
----------------------------------

A replication is happening here

http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=399.msg6213;topicseen#msg6213

[ramset]

Another replicator [and a good one]
                "vrand"
at the same link
I believe the link I posted above may require "login"
I did not know that and will be posting a link that does not require "membership" soon.
Mean while



Re: Mookie's Electrolyser Accelerator
« Reply #8 on: Today at 15:31:17 » 

vrand
Quote: 

Thanks Farrah Day for starting this thread and thanks RAMSET for pointing to this forum. 

As you probably read over at EF I plan on reproducing Mookie's experiment and purchased the same electromagnet he used.  My first setup will be to attach steel bars to the 3 legs of the EM about 10" long.  Then attach to the steel bars 16 ga 430 ss plates, 3" x 7" in between the 3 bars.  The spacing of the 16 ga plates will be in the area of 1/16" to 1/8".  Will try to get to 1/16" spacing so as to fit as many plates as possible between the steel bars as possible.  All of this will fit inside of a GE house filter housing, 4.5" ID x 10.5" tall.  The bars will come in from the bottom of the housing as well as the DC wiring.  Will use the 068 PWM to pulse 55 amps at 12 VDC, same as the Freddy Cell setup.  Will coat the steel bars with a thin layer of epoxy to protect from the KOH electrolyte.

The GE housing is rated at 120 PSI and will test the cell to 60 PSI.  This is also my test bed for the Freddy cell and the Zach West cell designs.  That GE water fi;ter housingr is 1/2" thick wall clear acrylic so can see the bubble action as it happens.  Will do time tests to fin out how long it takes to get to 60 PSI with pulsed DC vs. pulsed DC + EM.  Will test the HHO gas in balloon float test and pop test.

The idea in this design is to move close to 100% of the EM "magnetic circuit" through the 430 ss plates.  Mookie had a gap of close to 3/8" of an inch between his plates and the EM face, because of the glass wall thickness.  That is a lot of wasted EM magnetic field.  So the idea in this test setup is to use more of that magnetic field.  Will find out if it works.

Mike R.   

[ramset]

            Link Update to replications!!  [No Login required]
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=399.msg6234


Mookies work is based on this mans work, a post from
Torano

»QuoteAnyone reseaching Felix Ehrenhaft....

1845 Luigi Palmieri used his "palmieri circle" to split water using the Earths magnetic field.
Details of his experimental set up have obviously been shelved.
Theres a paper written about him,"The scientific life of Luigi Palmieri" by L Casertano , 1999,Vol 42 No 3.  I tried the URL ,wasnt happening for me.

The book " Electricity" by Robert Ferguson ,1867 makes interesting reading if you can keep up with the Victorian language and conventional current. Takes your thinking pattern back 140 years, before the rules stepped in.

http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=RukDAAAAQAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=electrici

**you HAVE TO type in page number 200 to find the section on "Electricity induced by the magnetism of the earth" and Palmieri.
Both Faraday and Palmieri were alive at the time and these theories were accepted. This is before AC took off and all other options dumped, the 1882 edition is suited to AC,its a different book .
Palmieri predicted weather changes from measuring electrical disturbance similar to Subblefield,
His pioneer work lays foundation for alot of 'free energy' research using air core coils.

wiki has a bit of info but not much
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_electricity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luigi_Palmieri

[Gwandau]

Ramset,

Mookies results is most certainly related to a phenomenon called Ohmasa gas generation.

Proffessor Ohmasa exites the water molecules through vibration to a point were any gas bubbles becomes microscopic,
just like the white gas cloud in the Mookie vid.

Sonoluminescence ? This phenomenon is easily identified by the light emitted.
Don´t think this is S.L.

Microscopic bubbles sounds more close to it, but this does not make it less interesting,
since there is yet a lot to understand in the realm of microscopic implosion effects.

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Ohmasa_Gas_by_Japan_Techno_Co.,_Ltd.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUPE0Z9V82E


Additionally, Mookie stopped using glass jars for his cells long ago. They all got smashed
into pieces when putting the electro magnet into action. I would recommend anything but glass.

I went thru a dozen glass jars because they simply cant handle an instant start-up at 120 volts.
The magnetic force is too great. A regular properly-built (non glass) cell works just fine at instant full power.

I do not believe it matters if the vibrations are caused by sound or electromagnetic pulses,
since it is all about resonance.

Resonance is the key to every known physically observable event, since all matter is made of standing waves.

Gwandau