Practical Method for Production of Water Fuel with Piezoelectric

[petar113507]

Rad HHO, as you slowed down the frequency, the voltage went up?  I would think that you would have hit a standstill (a point which thereafter, the pizeo-electric would not respond).  I think that may be limited by your input voltage.

My thought here, is that the two are co-related.  Except with increasing the frequency, you would need more voltage to compensate.  I do not know why, but this is just the route that I would normally investigate with the wave-generators.  (Edit:  This is what e2matrix said.    Thanks for the info!  )

I have found some circut-boards.  China markets are pretty diverse, and can find a lot of stuff.  You just gotta look carefully:
http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/hainetec1/product-detailFMOQVpBKMHkI/China-Ultrasonic-Generator-Ultrasonic-PCB-.html

Thoughts there?

On the off chance that anyone can look -- why not just look into a high frequencey ultrasonic transducer?
I am finding some transducers which are of novel cost (I'd assume shipping is the kicker):
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/352922184/10w_50Khz_Ultrasonic_transducer.html

If the pizeo's do not work  (or if we cannot easily adapt the input voltage to match the frequency), then I would imagine that these kind of transducers may fit the bill.

My next questions: Do we know if we are trying to hit 43 KHZ exactly, or just above the 43 KHZ range?
Next, why are we looking for the dis-association frequencey?  How do the crystals just "help" the dis-association (does it work better at certain frequencies, or is it just the electrical oscilation of the crystal that rips water molecules apart?)

Is it not the electric force that we are breaking, through the pizeoelectric oscilations at a set frequency?  Or does this somehow infer that through sound that we can manipulate the electric nature of matter?  I would imagine "constructive intereference" to be coupling together, amplifying itself at at certain resonant frequencies to produce electric effects? 
If this is the case, this would sound like a base, in the work that keeley was associated with.

These questions are posed to everyone -- they are questions which I would normally ask myself.  In this case, I have not yet found the answers to them, so instead of reporting back with the answer, I am merely asking the question.

I hope it sparks someone else to discuss,
==Romo

[RAD-HHO]

RAD-HHO,  Thanks for your info and tests on this.  Very interesting results and not at all what I expected.  This is considerably different than what I thought based on the circuit I built many years ago. 

I think it would be great if we could get some input now from Power to Be on how to get the frequency up to the target 43-45 Khz.  If this is as different as it seems then maybe simply increasing the voltage may be a way to increase the frequency but I wouldn't want anyone to risk ruining their setup based on that assumption.  I've got a function generator that will do sawtooth so I'll try to get time to test that. 

  Also if the piezo is putting out 1.73 Mhz that is way above the 43 Khz.  How does this result in producing the apparent 30 Khz range we were told they run in?  I'm lost now...     I'm curious how you were able to read the frequency with the piezo in the circuit?  I think the electrical frequency across the piezo is not the actual frequency it vibrates at since 1.73 Mhz is way above ultrasonic frequency.  I'm guessing here but it sounds like we may need to raise that frequency to get a higher vibration output at the disk.

If you look at the last photo http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=10388.0;attach=51510;image, you can see I used jumper wires with alligator clips and a small spring to connect the piezo disc.

[petar113507]

So, the pizeo-ceramic discs:

http://www.annon.com.cn/product/PZT-atomizing.htm

The driving circut board:
http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/hainetec1/product-detailFMOQVpBKMHkI/China-Ultrasonic-Generator-Ultrasonic-PCB-.html

I would only like a clear "that should work" before I buy the units.  The pond foggers are nice trinkets, but I don't have the expertise to modify them myself.
I have since, been looking for high frequency transducers, or variable frequency humidifiers.

Written a few emails to a few companies, will wait for replies to point me towards the right product, which should 'fit the bill' for this project.

Cheers,
==Romo

[RAD-HHO]

So, the pizeo-ceramic discs:

http://www.annon.com.cn/product/PZT-atomizing.htm

The driving circut board:
http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/hainetec1/product-detailFMOQVpBKMHkI/China-Ultrasonic-Generator-Ultrasonic-PCB-.html

I would only like a clear "that should work" before I buy the units.  The pond foggers are nice trinkets, but I don't have the expertise to modify them myself.
I have since, been looking for high frequency transducers, or variable frequency humidifiers.

Written a few emails to a few companies, will wait for replies to point me towards the right product, which should 'fit the bill' for this project.

Cheers,
==Romo

Here is where I'm confused.  If you will notice all of the atomizer piezos are in the range 1.7 to 2.4 Mhz. The piezos used for cleaning are in the 43 khz range.  Can we drive the 1.7 Mhz piezo with the 43 Khz driver?  That is the question.  I'm not so sure.   

[RAD-HHO]

More testing, or more input from someone who knows is needed......