Magnetic energy and permanent magnets

[A@K]

Hello,

I am new in the area of free energy devices etc. and i was looking at perpetual motion machines by using permanent magnets. A lot of people say that these kind of machines violate the laws of thermodynamics, and to be more specific they violate the first law i.e. the conservation of energy.

Now, i start thinking and try to investigate more this subject, and i came with a question, is a permanent magnet a source of energy, i.e. a source of magnetic energy? I made this question to myself according to the first law of thermodynamics which says that the energy cannot be created nor destroyed.
Then i was thinking more and i say to myself, if it is possible to prove that a permanent magnet is a source of magnetic energy, then the inventors of perpetual motion machines by using permanent magnets are not violate the laws of thermodynamics. This is because the magnetic energy is converted into mechanical energy + heat and then to electrical energy, (but this depending of the construction of the machine).

So, is it possible to prove that a permanent magnet is a source of magnetic energy? 
Does anyone have any information about this subject?
However, i want to mention that i am not a physicist, which means my knowledge on physics is poor. 

If anyone have any good materials about this subject can you please help me?

Thanks in advance for your time.

Kind Regards
A.K

[mscoffman]

What I think I am beginning to see is that the "conservation of energy law"
is actually a myth, but a myth of great engineering utility. That is as long
as the interaction between parts of a system are simple then conservation
of energy law applies exactly. This conservation of energy law has great utility
in engineering because it stops you from searching for something you can not
have via simply interactions. But...complex physical interaction overload the
mathematics the universe uses to operate and with sufficiently complex interactions
conservation of energy laws no longer apply as in; it breaks down. So the metric
fields of "potential energy" always operate through a "zero point energy" functions
and that is what actually causes the zero point quantum foam to supplies all
dynamic energy.

It turns out that the mathematical equations are correct - but complex math
functions have multiple solutions and these functions used to be evaluated and then
the solutions selected based in conservation of energy principles. My growing feeling
ever stronger is that this application of the conservation of energy law is in error.

Now one asks "How did this happen!?"  Well back in Newton's time calculus
math was just beginning to be applied the orbit of planets via the very long
range but very weak force of gravity and it became increasing clear that
calculus applied to the planets operated exactly with many, many digits of precision.
Magnetic interactions were known and actually helped close the intuitive loop proofs
for gravity but they did not have strong neodymium magnets at the the time so
they just went for the gold and declared "Conservation of energy laws" to be true
without the appropriate scientific tests of whether it was always true or not. They
also apparently did have much insight into mathematics of equations having multiple
solutions. See, theres only a few metric forces besides gravity and I am beginning
to think that it is the cross product of conservative fields where this COE violation
occurs. So at the time, they would have no way of doing the tests with great precision
and the first order looked good, so they proposed this without testing and forgot that
about this violation of scientific protocol.

So "no" magnets do not contain energy but that doesn't matter because ZPE
supplies all energy anyhow. I'm not sure any combinations of magnets can supply
energy via this method but I suspect a combination of gravity and magnetism
can, I am also beginning to suspect mechanical interactions can too, but one needs
to look in the appropriate places where complex mathematics creates multiple
solutions.

The important thing is... I suspect that devices incorporating these ideas will begin
to be offered for sale, soon...closing the legal/financial side of proof.

This is an net amazing tale if true, but I am beginning to understand that we human are
very shorted sighted in absolute terms, where it counts.

:S:MarkSCoffman

[A@K]

Dear mscoffman,

thanks for your reply, but now the question is where does the energy goes when we magnetize a magnet?
for example, a company which constructs batteries, first creates the battery and then they charging them, and therefore we can use the battery as a source of energy i.e. electrical energy. Also, let say the same company constructs magnets. So, first they create the magnet from let say ferromagnetic materials, and then they magnetize them by using electromagnets and therefore the ferromagnetic material become "permanent magnet" . So where does the energy is stored in the magnet? OR how the magnet can store this energy?
If a magnet cannot be assumed as a source of energy, then where does the energy goes?
According to my readings up to this point, at my mind i can relate a "permanent magnet" with a battery, because a battery is getting charged and after the use is discharged. So the battery has to be recharged in order to used it again. Thus, i relate this with a magnet which is suppose to be permanent, but the "permanent magnets" at some time they loose their magnetic properties, or at least their magnetic intensity becomes weaker. So, they magnet it has to magnetize again in order to be able to use it.
However, probably is wrong that i relate the battery with a "permanent magnet" but at least i think is a very simple example.

Anw, thanks in advance for your time

Kind Regards
A.K

[nightlife]

mscoffman,  "So "no" magnets do not contain energy but that doesn't matter because ZPE
supplies all energy anyhow."

Wrong! Everything contains energy becuase everything is made up of energy.

[Tito L. Oracion]

mscoffman,  "So "no" magnets do not contain energy but that doesn't matter because ZPE
supplies all energy anyhow."

Wrong! Everything contains energy becuase everything is made up of energy.

The magnetic field of a magnet is in a balance state but it can make an inbalance to a coil being move in the vicinity of the magnet.

Wrong! Everything is made in a balance state and always seeking for balance Then to make an energy there should be a stress happening to make energy. Co'z energy can be created anywhere you want!.