Was Bessler for real?

[johnny874]

A lot of new cars still have the water pump pulley bolted on

Maybe I was being too cryptic, what the trick shows is that there is a small angle of interaction between a lever a force and a pivot with resistance where the reactionary force is in the opposite direction to what you would call normal, so push down on the lever and turn the pulley in the opposite direction to where you are applying the force from, aka push down on the left side and the left side of the pulley goes up, now when this angle is not correct then the force will move the pulley in the same direction aka push down on the left side and the left side of the pulley goes down.  With this setup it is possible to have a spring resistance at the pivot so that when you push down on the lever on the left side the pulley moves up and you load the spring resistance, then with a change in the included angles relative to the force the spring will unload and pick up the lever and apply a force that turns the pulley in the same direction as when the force was first applied, kind of like a rectifier.

This setup so far as I have played with it is not overly efficient, but I have only tinkered with it and have not tried very many ways of going about it so it may be of use or it may just be an useless curiosity.

   Lmao  . between that and Mt 20, it kind of opened my eyes to what I'm doing now.
  it's something everybody has missed. With Mt 20,
http://www.besslerwheel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Image:Mt_020.gif
if the short lever rotated counter clockwise, that is essentially what it would be doing.
What they have failed to consider is that as it rotates counter clockwise, the upward or outward force it exerts is equal to the force being applied to the lever.

                                                                             Jim

[johnny874]

Got sidetracked looking at 140 pictures.  So many of those devices actually seem to use the same force functions in the same way that they have always been used, if that worked it would of been done long before the time of Bessler.


One of the things I look at is direction of applied forces and what the actual reaction from the system is and I mean all of them including the systems reaction from an outside refrance frame view.


I know my little trick works, how well ?? but as I see things if *I* can find it, some other person smarter than me already has so the things I play with I always assume have already been done.

   Tom,
  Bessler wanted to start a school, didn't happen.
One of the difficult things to say is what Bessler actually did. In the thread, Bessler's other wheel is one way swinging weights can work. And with what we've been discussing is another way. So did he only do it one, more than 2 ways ? He was never really clear on this.
I also thought of another way scissors could be used. It's using levers that cancel each other out while performing work. Might not work though because with scissors, the more sections you have, the more resistence, etc.
What you described is a part of a system. It's getting the whole system to work is what matters.

                                                                             Jim

                                                                          Jim

[johnny874]

Indeed, something that works has value.


My gut feeling is that what Bessler understood could be transormed into using whatever was available, it was not so much a specific thing but a relationship of forces in motion, like the bootstrap idea, the methodology can vary but the goal has to be the same ie: reset the mass with the needed force by applying that force between the mass and the thing the mass is moving.

   Tom,
You know I got to thinking about something funny last night. Over at besslerwheel.com, one member did say they are their own sect and even have some of their own words.
That is one thing about Bessler, because he didn't prove his work himself, there will always be different opinions about what he did or did not do. And with engineering, levers and wheels have been around for a long time. It's the unique ways of using them that allows for people to be ingenious.

  Hope you have a nice Christmas.

                                                                          Jim

[johnny874]

Hey Jim,


I hope you have a good christmas and new years.


A commercial comes to mind where, I think it was Dow, said, that invention is important but it is innovation that makes changes

  Tom,
So true. I'm going to have to remember that 
See ya'all Monday 

                                                  Jim

  Tom, Thanx     I have promoted your idea in 12x's thread. Had a thought. If it works, then with what Vjelko has been working on could help those who need it the most. Running water that is. Not everyone has it but it is the first step in fighting disease.
                                                                                                                 Jim

[johnny874]

   Tom,
I'll post a simple diagram showing how a pendulum develops power.
What might be a thought is to let the weight drop right after it's lifted.
Then because the pendulum would swing further than it should, a
block could stop it and then let it swing back the other way. Something
like this would only need one ratchet type movement to work.

                                                                                             Jim