New guy with SMOT questions

[sknoxmn]

I've been looking at the vidoes and reading alot of sites about taking bar magnets with north south through the thickness and drawing a steel ball up an aluminum ramp and letting gravity take its course before the ball either sticks to the magnets or returns to the center section of the bar magnets.

I have seen people that say parallel the bars.  I have seen people saying to bring the upper ends of the magnets closer together to get a stronger field for the steel ball to be attracted all towards.

I have seen steel balls fall from said ramps. I have read sites where people say that the act of placing the ball from the table to the rail is providing the "Energy". To this I disagree, in that the ball sitting on any surface is merely sitting there. we don't care to split hairs over how it got there. any more than saying a sprint racer cheated by getting to his start block before the other runners, when the race has yet to start.

I take issue with the whole term SMOT since making a ball roll around a circle, from a ramp continuously may or may not be able to produce any kind of energy.  I suspect that it doesn't. So the OU portion should not be included in what people seem to be trying to create with the ramp "closing the loop".

Just because everyone uses a word, doesn't mean its being used properly. Me being new to all of this, of course I don't know most of the terminology in the first place. But from my very limited experience in this arena I can say that so far I'm not impressed by any of the "experts" that can't see to even use the basic terms appropriately.

So my question has likely been asked many many times around here. Which configuration of bar magnets with polarity through its thickness rather than down its length, makes for the more effient ramp from which to drop a steel bar.

I'd also like to know if there is anywhere around here for ideas that people have tried which failed so as to not go down that road. Drawings and such for the designs.

And I'm sure like a lot of others on this site I come in all Gung-Ho, fresh eyes and a pipe dream about how I have an idea that "No one else ever tried".  I'm sure tons have been tried. but I do have some ideas that I have not yet seen or read about on the internet or in YT videos. In fact I haven't seem these ideas discussed even in this forum.... yet.

Now as for my basic questions and my "new" ideas, they are for returning the ball to the start point without violating any laws and seem to be common sense to me.  But again, I am new to all of this. and would simply like to know if parallel seems "better" or going with the /\ ramp.

Thanks for the time and space, Flame on  :)

[happyfunball]

Bill Mehess gave it a good shot, but in the end it doesn't appear possible to loop a SMOT. Magnets cannot power anything on their own.

http://www.overunity.com/10552/smot-close-to-closing-the-loop-second-video-big-improvement/

http://www.youtube.com/user/excel60/videos

[sknoxmn]

I have seen the videos that Bill made. His setups look a lot like the ones I've been playing with. I'm checking these things out so as to not recreate what has been proven to not work.

Still leaves me with the question though.  Bar magnets in a V or parallel for better chance of a good drop or a steeper angle...?  Also with the bars, are they polarized through the thickness or end to end.

I would imagine that end to end then setting them in the V would make for a stronger pull where they are closer to each other.

What I'm thinking I'll do is set mine parallel, magnetized through the thickness rather than end to end.  I have been able to get a consistant drop with an angle of about 30 - 35 degrees.

Anyway, things we do know: You can pull a ball up a ramp - You can have the ball drop - you can roll a ball into the magnetic field to pull it up the ramp.

I guess I'll get back on building mine again to see why no one can put these few things together.

-S

[happyfunball]

Use whatever shape magnet you want, doesn't make a difference. Bill stopped because he couldn't do it, not because of skeptics.

[Low-Q]

No reason to dig into SMOTs. Devices that are suppose to be powered solely by permanent magnets will never work. The reason is because a permanent magnet is carrying potential energy that does not change over time.
In order to do work with magnets, the potential energy have to change within a given period of time so parts of it will be kinetic energy - that will not happen with permanent magnets - and ofcourse the SMOT will never be possible to loop.



Vidar.