Building a self looping "SMOT"

[Michael Q Shaw]

@Michael,
I suspect you need to have a complete looping device even if you can prove the exit point is higher than the insertion point because there is an effect that no-one seems to have mentioned yet.
I seem to remember and I could be wrong but way back when Greg Watson was building the original SMOT device he or someone else noticed that the steel ball bearing undergoes a very slight repulsion before it enters the magnetic field array that pulls it up the ramp.
I think this has something to do with the magnetic field from the array causing the ball to be slightly magnetised and creating a very slight repulsive force between itself and the array.
So by placing the ball bearing inside the magnetic field of the array, just ahead of the ramp, you have already given the ball a head start in terms of magnetic potential energy.  Therefore you need sufficient slope or momentum to get past this sticky insertion point.


All the negative views here are not stopping me from experimenting with this.
Its a good engineering challenge and hopefully within the scope of most people to be able to be built with basic tools.


Meggerman

Thanks Meggerman, I agree and will not give up as well.  In my most popular video, I successfully connected two and got the drop-off and hand-off working awesome, I just need to build them longer to obtain the height to provide the separation to keep adjoining tracks from trying to slam together.

[TinselKoala]

Never say never,  I am still actively working on it.  Even then a self looped SMOT would only have the amount of "energy" that you "built" into it, plus what is given initially by placement to begin its operation,  getting it to self loop is possible, but if you try to take much energy away from it yes, it more than likely will stop.  The only possible manner to get anything out of it would be during the portion of operation when it is driven by the magnetic fields, yes like a sling shot, at least that is how mine operate, and they release just fine.  For instance, my 1/2 inch lift track is made with enough strength to lift up to 3/4 inches, you must purposely build them stronger and extend them beyond the point of exit for a smooth disconnect.  I will one day, before life escapes me.  I honestly believe that four of my 4 foot tracks connected in a square will prove the operation best, then using clear rubber tubing curved into the starting position of the next ramp, in that manner the ball will already begin rolling in the new direction of travel of the next ramp on the downward roll -because it cannot cross the magnetic field of the adjoining ramp, hence why I made my video with a right angle, it gets stuck on it otherwise, so no after looking at drawings of 2 four foot tracks side by side or even three in a triangle may work. Yes it does work, and yes... you can successfully connect them.  I am not Mylow and I am not "faking" my results.  Thank you for the chide though, I am getting used to it by now.

So we appear to have another claim that "yes it does work"... without the slightest evidence given in support of the claim.

No, Michael, it does NOT work, and you cannot demonstrate a working triangle, or square, or circle of ramps that will self-loop. Do all the tinkering and thinking that you like, but do not make claims you cannot support. Especially claims that have been proven wrong over and over. Do you really think you are the first one to think of putting four smot ramps in a square?

If you want to state that you BELIEVE it WOULD WORK if only you can find the right configuration... that is fine, work away, tell us about your BELIEFS. But when you claim "it does work" or that "you can successfully connect them" or that it runs for three hours unattended.... unless you provide evidence, you are just another hot-air claimant, and you'll fade away in frustration like all the rest of them do.

Why aren't you, Michael, insisting that elecar prove his claim by demonstrating a self-looped system? Don't you believe him? Wouldn't it be nice if he'd tell you the complete details, so that you could build it and then there would now be TWO demonstrations of a self-looped system? But it will never happen... yes, I said never.

I didn't mean to accuse you of being another Mylow.... I brought him up because, after all, he understood what was necessary to make his motors "work": an outside source of power. Of all people, don't you think he would have made a self-runner if it were possible to do so? He had support, he was working with the allegedly "proven" Howard Johnson design... he even prayed over Howard Johnson's grave.

Feel free to PROVE ME WRONG with a credible demonstration of a self-looping system. Anyone?

If you cannot demonstrate the earth-shaking, physics-defying, thermodynamically impossible system that you are claiming to have, then you should not claim it. It is as simple as that.

[Michael Q Shaw]

So we appear to have another claim that "yes it does work"... without the slightest evidence given in support of the claim.

No, Michael, it does NOT work, and you cannot demonstrate a working triangle, or square, or circle of ramps that will self-loop. Do all the tinkering and thinking that you like, but do not make claims you cannot support. Especially claims that have been proven wrong over and over. Do you really think you are the first one to think of putting four smot ramps in a square?

If you want to state that you BELIEVE it WOULD WORK if only you can find the right configuration... that is fine, work away, tell us about your BELIEFS. But when you claim "it does work" or that "you can successfully connect them" or that it runs for three hours unattended.... unless you provide evidence, you are just another hot-air claimant, and you'll fade away in frustration like all the rest of them do.

Why aren't you, Michael, insisting that elecar prove his claim by demonstrating a self-looped system? Don't you believe him? Wouldn't it be nice if he'd tell you the complete details, so that you could build it and then there would now be TWO demonstrations of a self-looped system? But it will never happen... yes, I said never.

I didn't mean to accuse you of being another Mylow.... I brought him up because, after all, he understood what was necessary to make his motors "work": an outside source of power. Of all people, don't you think he would have made a self-runner if it were possible to do so? He had support, he was working with the allegedly "proven" Howard Johnson design... he even prayed over Howard Johnson's grave.

Feel free to PROVE ME WRONG with a credible demonstration of a self-looping system. Anyone?

If you cannot demonstrate the earth-shaking, physics-defying, thermodynamically impossible system that you are claiming to have, then you should not claim it. It is as simple as that.

Never said that I had a complete connected loop, just said my ramps work and I have found a way to connect them that works.  I am working as diligently as possible while buying parts with just the change from recycling.  I never made any wild or crazy hot-air claims and I do plan to continue to post my results every chance I get.  I wish elecar the best of luck with his designs, Yes it does work, and yes... you can successfully connect them, I have already provided my evidence and have shared what I have learned with everyone.  like I said, I will continue to work diligently and will share everything that I possibly can.  Please calm down, unless you are the site moderator or watchdog, even then, I have said nothing that should have upset you nor did I ever "claim" to have completed the holy grail.   I would love to prove you wrong, this is a thread for people working to connect a completed loop isn't it?  Not a thread for people to prove that it is not possible.  I thought at least on this thread there would at more open mindedness than what you have displayed.  If I don't get it completed fine -you can say I told you so, but if I do, I get to tell you I told you so, or even elecar may get to say it.  We all will see in the end then I may fade away in frustration like all the rest of them do or you may.

[MileHigh]

Micheal:

I had no idea you were reading the thread.  The analysis mostly was done to explain what is going on in more scientific terms.  Many people may be aware now that when a ball rolls up your ramp, it's actually going down in energy.  It's the exact opposite of what they were thinking.  It can be difficult for people to understand magnetism so I made some postings to explain your setup.

The burden of proof is on you to make a self-runner.  The problem is that when you arrange your four ramps there is not going to be any magic.  Each of your ramps does not add any energy to the ball.  Like I have explained, the ball goes down in energy, even if your eyes see it has raised in height.   You are slightly raised in height but at the bottom of a magnetic potential energy well.  That magnetic potential energy well might be invisible, but it is absolutely real and you can feel it just by picking up the ball and trying to move it.  Each ramp decreases the amount of energy in the ball.  There is just no escape from this fact.  Your attempts to build the 4-track looping system will be frustrated by Mother Nature.

MileHigh

[Michael Q Shaw]

Micheal:

I had no idea you were reading the thread.  The analysis mostly was done to explain what is going on in more scientific terms.  Many people may be aware now that when a ball rolls up your ramp, it's actually going down in energy.  It's the exact opposite of what they were thinking.  It can be difficult for people to understand magnetism so I made some postings to explain your setup.

The burden of proof is on you to make a self-runner.  The problem is that when you arrange your four ramps there is not going to be any magic.  Each of your ramps does not add any energy to the ball.  Like I have explained, the ball goes down in energy, even if your eyes see it has raised in height.   You are slightly raised in height but at the bottom of a magnetic potential energy well.  That magnetic potential energy well might be invisible, but it is absolutely real and you can feel it just by picking up the ball and trying to move it.  Each ramp decreases the amount of energy in the ball.  There is just no escape from this fact.  Your attempts to build the 4-track looping system will be frustrated by Mother Nature.

MileHigh

Cool, Thank you, yeah I spent today relaxing, and reading almost every comment, had to carve the family pumpkin for Ol' hallows eve, or harvest festival if you will, and roast the salted seeds.  I respect your analysis, I respect everyone's analysis, I still cannot hide what is actually happening with each and every subsequent build.  For instance, if you actually look at my 9 foot track, I made it when I lived in military family housing back at Sheppard AFB in Texas.  It received an input initially from a 3/4 inch downward decline, then it rolls back up and over a 3/4 inch incline, this in physics, should not be possible, if you roll anything between two equally sized hills for instance, unless you provide more force in any other particular direction somehow, that object will only roll back and forth between the two hills until it stops motionless -in the center of the valley of both hills- this is physics and this is what happens in life everywhere everyday, just like a bouncing ball loosing height and eventually stopping motionless on the ground.  Yet, I was able to make it to continue rolling on and then did it again a second time with a 3/4 inch drop back uphill then flat, flat, and even then the ball continues on for over thirteen feet of total distance traveled.  I ran this track in both directions, flipped it 180 degrees just to prove that my foundation did not have an incline so NO, it is not rolling down to a lower energy level like a roller coaster would operate.  By making the magnetic fields stretch longer and allowing for a smooth removal the ball rolls uphill with the magnetic slingshot, then rolls back downhill with gravity.  I made the last two track flat in the video to show that I could connect them on a flat plane and make them continue on, I originally had all of them uphill-downhill with all 3/4 inch lift configurations and when properly aligned, it worked every time.  I am just trying to share what I see, what my family and I are seeing and the reason why I will not give up on this.