The Magneformer-lenzless transformer ?

[Magluvin]

Hi Mags

Yes,there is no AC in the drive coil,so not sure where the AC bit is coming from. AC is alternating current-not alternating voltage.The current flow remains in 1 direction when the drive coil is switched on and off,AC is current flowing one way,and then switches and flows the other way-this never happens in the drive coil.

Hey Brad

"so not sure where the AC bit is coming from."     

It comes from "moving the goal posts" like TK said, in order to put the magnetic biased core in the realm of 'junk'.     lol

Just keep doin what you do.  Your doing fine.

Mags

[TinselKoala]

Many people are confused about what "AC" really means. But "transformer effect" doesn't depend on true alternating current in the primary of the transformer. Recall that induced voltage in a secondary is proportional to the time rate of change of... the magnetic field in the primary. And the magnetic field is proportional to the current (amp-turns). So if the current rises and falls, that's all that is needed for transformer induction effect to happen. The current doesn't have to actually reverse, it can keep going in the same direction, as long as the amplitude of the current rises and falls. This of course produces a change in the magnetic field. The secondary output will be true AC though, even if the input to the primary is pulsed DC or "AC" with enough DC offset so that the current doesn't actually reverse.
"dB/dt", the time rate of change of the B field, can be thought of as the instantaneous slope of the curve describing the B field strength over time. So while the B field is increasing, dB/dt is positive, and when the B field peaks dB/dt is zero, and when the B field is decreasing, dB/dt is negative. So the induced voltage in the secondary flips sign at the peaks (and valleys) of the current which is causing the primary B field to wax and wane.

[tinman]

Hi Tinman,

agreed that you will have a bigger current in that time-period of 48 µ sec. Now how come that your scope shows 13,2 V when you drive your circuit with 12 Volt ? Anyway. lets assume 12 Volt , but than you can not use the 12 Volt as driving voltage over the full cycle of 304 µ sec. as the 12 volts are only swiched on and driving the unknown high current for 48 µ sec  , you need the average voltage ( ever lower 1.89  Volt ) which is related to one cycle ( since you do not have the surge-current in that 48 µ sec window9  and multiplying it with the average current you have measured because you only have the average current of 11 mA.. see ?

Your scope shows the false rms-voltage at the top, it does calculate the high value-distribution ( 13,2 V  and this value is wrong also ) ,  which is mainly composed out of the mosfet-off-state. It wrongly calculates 13.2 V related to the 304 - 48 µ sec = 256 µ sec.
You always have to relate the short on-time-voltage to the full cycle.

So again I insist: it looks good...at least not bad

Regards

Kator01

Hi Kator
If you look at the scope shot,you will see that the 13.1 volt peak is from the inductive kickback spike.But you will also see that it is quickly brought down by the cap and battery-more so the battery,as its internal resistance would only be around 1-1.5 ohms-provideing its a healthy battery.
You can see in the rest phase ,that the supply voltage is indeed 12 volts.
If we look at the scope shot,we can see that the efficiency is quite good-as far as the inductive kick back charging go's.
But as far as our tank circuit go's,well thats no so exciting. From that part of the circuit,we have only around .033 watts-but every bit helps.

[tinman]

Hey Brad

"so not sure where the AC bit is coming from."     

It comes from "moving the goal posts" like TK said, in order to put the magnetic biased core in the realm of 'junk'.     lol

Just keep doin what you do.  Your doing fine.

Mags

Experimenting is never junk Mag's lol.
Here is a good example,and it seems that his results are the same as what i get with the setup i posted in a previous post.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kosQIrDCWM

[MileHigh]

Tinman:

I can assure you that your transformer input is being excited by "AC."  That is a generic term used in electronics.  It means "changing with respect to time."  If there was no AC input to your transformer then the output wound be dead and the RLC circuit would be dead.  Talking about "moving the goalposts" with respect to the standard definitions for electronics terms is a non-starter.  I am asking you to not go there because that would be another "contest."  I won't even argue the point beyond what I just stated because it would be silly.

With respect to the "other" moving of the goal posts, I already covered that earlier.  The moving is done when you make a general statement about something that relates directly to your setup, and then someone else responds stating "not true" because special case XYZ is not true.  That's the real moving of the goal posts.  I discussed your particular setup and what you are doing and my explanation about the futility of the permanent magnet core is because that's where you start - at the beginning - within the context of your actual experiment.  You learn that non-moving magnets have no affect on transformers because there is no changing magnetic flux with respect to time.  Then you go on the bench and view and measure it for real and confirm it for yourself.  These are the basic building blocks of electronics.  You don't believe me?  That's fine, feel free to do some bench experiments and prove it for yourself.  Also, don't make the mistake of alleging that I am "all theory" because I have done all of this stuff on the bench for real.

From my perspective you are playing with a transformer setup where your excitation is a switching transistor.  That bangs the primary coil with a regular stream of pulses (which is AC) and that excitation is at the resonant frequency for your RLC circuit.  The fact that your core is a magnet has zero affect on your setup.  If you don't believe me then why not put in an equivalent non magnetized core and compare waveforms and make some good measurements?  It would be blind faith on your part to believe that the magnetized core of your transformer does something useful, because it doesn't.  Nor are the magnets doing any work, they are as dead as proverbial doornails.  That's more blind faith on your part, "One day someone will prove that magnets are a source of energy," it will never happen.

That's the real deal Tinman.  If you are going to make measurements on the input and all of the outputs and compare total input power to total output power that would be great.  You won't find anything special but you will deserve a lot of credit for making good measurements.

The thing that may be throwing you off is that the magnetic core does nothing.  It's a fact.  The best thing that you could do for yourself is do the research and create some good test procedures to prove it for yourself.  That's the challenge, find the real truth.  If you refuse and just "want to believe" that the magnetized core does something beneficial and the "magnets are doing work" then it would be a shame and you won't benefit from the project.  I'll put it another way, if you do the project and intentionally hunt for something to confirm your beliefs and prejudices and expectations, then you are just cheating yourself to your own detriment.

So it's up to you.  You can increase your knowledge and look for the truth or just look for confirmation of your preconceptions in your measurements.

MileHigh