Mathematical Analysis of an Ideal ZED

[mondrasek]

Mondrasek, take two columns and connect them with a pipe at the bottom.  For the moment we will use identical cross-sections only for simplicity of the illustration.  Now, fill each of the columns to a height H1 and calculate the stored energy:

No, MarkE.  I will only discuss the Analysis of the unique construction of the ZED that you have participated in so kindly so far.

M.

[MarkE]

Right you are - my bad for the inclusion..

You have a one track mind - what you think the end is going to be..........

Get to the end of the Math - show the errors - everyone is appreciative.

The end is a three layer dual ZED system - Net Energy.

There is not and never was net energy.  You can tell that lie all you want.  It has never had any evidentiary support.  It is a bald-faced lie.

The new end of discussion will be; What is the Difference between a Non conservative Net Energy system and O/U.

They are both figments of the imagination.

That difference is what required our engineers to rethink of the black box.

Any engineer who believes your lies needs to go back to school.

We let people call it what they understand - for now.

Hey maybe Bubba will be calling you something else in a cozy 6'x9' for two.  Only time will tell.

Wayne

[MarkE]

No, MarkE.  I will only discuss the Analysis of the unique construction of the ZED that you have participated in so kindly so far.

M.

Do I understand you to be saying that you refuse to discuss basic physics as it directly applies to your example?  Your example in going from State 2 to State 3 moves the water columns towards equalization, does it not?  The same physics applies to each pair of annular rings divided by a riser wall as it does to my example, does it not?

[minnie]

  Hi,
      thank you mrwayne for answering my question- by not answering!
   Now I feel I have enough information from Mondrasek and MarkE
   to be able to have a crack at the maths myself. It'll take me some
   time but between us we'll get to the bottom of it in the end.
                    John

[LibreEnergia]

Let us presume for a while that the mathematical analysis as presented by LarryC is correct, in that it shows an energy increase or identically speaking a 'reduction in input' over a full cycle.

1. The first point would be to qualify that 'an energy increase' is in fact the same as a 'reduction in input', and simply a matter of semantics as to where you consider the lowest energy state of the cycle to be.  I'd be interested in Wayne or LarryC's comment to that.

If the above is agreed, then question then becomes, where did this energy increase during the cycle come from? It must be transferred from somewhere, unless you are going to challenge the first Law that states energy cannot be created or destroyed.

Nowhere have I seen a coherent explanation of this process.

We have claims of non-conservative gravity. This would imply lifting some mass was somehow easier when inside a ZED compared with outside of it. Certainly one can use levers to achieve lower force requirement but this is at the expense of displacement so we would expect in a conservative field such as gravity that the energy requirement remains constant.

If it works, then the ZED must break that symmetry. No where have I seen coherent explanation as to how this occurs within the ZED.

Does it somehow 'modify gravity' locally?  From all accounts the machine doesn't becoming  lighter while working, the workers are not floating away while working on it and I don't think Wayne is claiming that this is the working principle, so we can discount this.

So, from the agreed starting point given in point 1.  I'd like LarryC or Wayne to provide a coherent explanation of  how that happens.  The description must explicitly state how and where the energy increase occurs. It cannot contain reference to  time-based quantities such as power, as that is only valid when certain conditions are true that cause time to be eliminated from the math.

Perhaps, when this explanation is offered, we can then use mathematics to model JUST that process, as it is the only interesting part of the machine cycle.