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Overunity Machines Forum



Magnet Myths and Misconceptions

Started by hartiberlin, September 27, 2014, 05:54:29 PM

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0 Members and 53 Guests are viewing this topic.

tinman

Quote from: MarkE on January 10, 2015, 04:55:39 AM
Of all of those, the only statement that is correc is that the field around a magnet changes over distance from pole to pole.  It has been shown to you but for some reason you choose to ignore it that the flux density perpendicular to a dipole goes to zero midway between the poles.  The flux density parallel to the dipole axis does not go to zero anywhere.  It just gets smaller and smaller the further one moves from the dipole.  It does so at a 1/r3 rate.I have not told TK not to perform any experiment.Now why would it fall to 0 if there is a field there?there is a field there, but at the midpoint the flux is all oriented parallel to the magnet and none perpendicular to the magnet.Whatever it may sound like to you, at any point where the flux density is zero in some direction is no different than standing on a surface that is flat in one direction, such as a level ramp.  Gravity does not apply any force along the horizontal axis.A Hall effect sensor detects flux density that runs perpendicular to the sensor surface.  Just as a weigh scale must be oriented horizontally to find the force of gravity acting on some mass, a Hall effect sensor's plane must be oriented perpendicular to the direction of flux that you would like to detect with it.  If one wants to detect the flux density running perpendicular to a magnet the sensor's plane must be oriented parallel to the magnet.  If one wants to detect the flux density running parallel to a magnte the sensor's plane must be perpendicular to the magnet.I don't know what has got you all tied up in the knots that you are in.  But you keep compounding one wrong assertion on top of another.The flux density of a dipole magnet is highest at the poles.  That should be self-evident.  The field contour of a dipole magnet is continuous from pole to pole.I have performed many tests.  What specifically would you like to see?
You are talking about fields of dreams Mark. It is clear that you and i have a difference of opinion when it comes to magnetic field's. A magnetic field to me is something that can do work when in motion,and induce flux into feromagnetic materials,where as your field at the center can do no work when in motion,nor can it induce flux into feromagnetic materials. The field at the center of a dipole is a mixture of two different forces that are equal in strength and opposite in direction,and the net resultant force is 0.
An engine that dosnt run is nothing more than a show piece,and has no pratical use.

Quote: Gravity does not apply any force along the horizontal axis.
It applies a force at right angles to the horizontal plane.

MarkE

Quote from: tinman on January 10, 2015, 05:16:56 AM
You are talking about fields of dreams Mark. It is clear that you and i have a difference of opinion when it comes to magnetic field's. A magnetic field to me is something that can do work when in motion,and induce flux into feromagnetic materials,where as your field at the center can do no work when in motion,nor can it induce flux into feromagnetic materials.
Where have I said such things? I think you have conflated concepts of:  field, potential, flux, and flux density.
QuoteThe field at the center of a dipole is a mixture of two different forces that are equal in strength and opposite in direction,and the net resultant force is 0.
Here again you have mixed different concepts together.  Since you seem impervious to anything that I have to say, go spend a couple of dollars on a Hall effect sensor and see if you can find some enlightenment about what flux density looks like at different points and orientations within the magnetic field of a dipole.  Just keep in your mind what the sensor measures:  average flux density that penetrates, IE is perpendicular to the sensor surface.
Quote
An engine that dosnt run is nothing more than a show piece,and has no pratical use.

QuoteQuote: Gravity does not apply any force along the horizontal axis.
It applies a force at right angles to the horizontal plane.
Which is to say it does not apply any force along the horizontal axis.  It is rather convenient or we would have to hold on for dear life just to remain seated in a chair.

tinman

Quote from: MarkE on January 10, 2015, 05:26:47 AM
Which is to say it does not apply any force along the horizontal axis.  It is rather convenient or we would have to hold on for dear life just to remain seated in a chair.
Are we doing 101 on gravitational fields now?

Quote:  It is rather convenient or we would have to hold on for dear life just to remain seated in a chair.
Or the chair would just come along for the ride.
Wouldnt it be a hoot if we could go into gravitational repulsion mode-just like we can with magnet's. Food for thought ;)

NoBull

Quote from: TinselKoala on January 09, 2015, 11:49:19 PM
A normal reed switch is not biased, it is just like a bit of iron: Its contacts are attracted by either pole of a magnet. In the central portion of your test, the reed contacts are equally attracted to both poles of the magnet so they don't move. This does _not_ mean that there is no magnetic field present!
Yes, a reed switch is not a B field detector in the perpendicular direction like the Hall sensor, rather the reed switch is a B gradient detector just like any blob of a ferromagnetic material experiencing attraction in a vicinity of a magnet.

People really need to be on alert for this difference!

NoBull

Quote from: DreamThinkBuild on January 10, 2015, 12:43:07 AM
This will also show the polarity flip from the top half(N) to bottom half(S).
Magnetic field B has a direction - not polarity. 
The direction of the B field does not switch the N-S direction around the midpoint of a magnet.

What he calls N-S Polarity in this case is a manifestation of force acting on some ferromagnetic test object, which is related to the gradient of B - not its direction, nor magnitude. 
Indeed the direction of this force switches the N-S direction around the midpoint of a magnet.

Again a guy is confusing the force on a ferromagnetic blob (related to the gradient of B) with the direction and intensity of a magnetic field B.

The same mistake, over and over...