Lenz free generator + a different pulse motor!

[Magluvin]

Mag's
If the inductor become's open circuit(power interupted),and the inductive kickback has no where to go,then there will be no current flow(or an extreem small amount),and the magnetic field will collap's almost instantly. Current cannot reverse direction if there is no current,and it is current that creat's the magnetic field-not voltage.Only the voltage reverses polarity,not the current when the power supply is disconected from the inductor-->this is the very reason the negative terminal of the charge battery is hooked to the positive terminal of the run battery in the SSG circuit.

Hey Tin

There is capacitance within the coil. The coil itself can have a resonant freq. It can oscillate when pulsed. It is a very tiny capacitance. So with the coil completely isolated from being able to discharge in the forward direction during field collapse, the charge is within the coils capacitance. Once the field collapses all the way, the charge across the coil will be peaked out. Once the charge begins to reverse, and we allow a path in reverse(back to battery, source) using a diode across the switch, then the field in the coil builds(because of current flow ) in the opposite polarity and the discharge goes back to source. The key is the switch, One that when turned of, will not allow the forward current. Like the spark in a reed of a pulse motor, the spark or blue glow is the switch leaking forward discharge from the coil, so no reversal of current or field.
It works in sim also.


Mags

[gyulasun]

....
But do you see any problems in the generator side? If yes, could you please be kind and tell me about those as well? I just wanna learn and I appreciate any guidance and help very much
....

Hi Sam,

I took a snapshot from your video on the generator and indicated flux directions with two black and one red arrow. When any of the rotor magnets enters the airgap on the left (open) side of the C core, flux from the rotor magnet will choose two directions (trying to make a closed magnetic path) as the two black arrows indicate, first suppose there is no load and no capacitor on the output coil.
I assume the two cross sections of core path A and core path B are equal as are the permeabilities, and I know that path B may be a little longer than path A.

You can consider the two flux directions A and B as two low value resistors in parallel i.e. good flux conductors and an input current (the flux from the rotor magnet) flows through both of them when you connect a battery across them i.e. the flux entering from the magnet is shared more or less equally by the two pathes: Phi_total=Phi_A + Phi_B where Phi_total is the flux from any one entering magnet. 
This means that path B shunts path A (and vice versa of course) and roughly half of the input flux of a rotor magnet will participate in induction from the output coil point of view. This is bad news...

Now suppose you use a load resistor across the output coil (and no tuning capacitor yet). The red arrow indicates this counter flux what you mention and label as N2 in the video. This counter flux as you mention will close its magnetic circuit to S2 via path B.
You mentioned flux N2 can close its magnetic circuit via path B to S2, I agree.

Now if you use a tuning capacitor across the output coil to get resonance with the rotating magnets speed, two things may happen: one is that the induced voltage will be enhanced in amplitude by the Q quality factor of the RLC parallel resonant circuit and the other thing is that the resonant current in the coil (which is not present in the untuned case) may cause a drag to the rotor.
I do not think the output power will be higher by the mere application of a tuned circuit for the generator output, perhaps matching the load to this RLC circuit can optimize the output with respect to an untuned case (but of course a partial matching can also be done in the untuned case).
Regarding your further idea on increasing the output power by using further C cores: I do not think they would work and do what you expect them to do, (see my bad news above),  each added C core is bound to shunt each other, flux will be divided to as many pathes as the number of C cores.

I would draw your attention to John Bedini's almost similar setup where he also used rotor magnets embedded in a disk that enter and leave the (magnet biased) stator cores, see here his patent and the differences:
https://www.google.com/patents/US6392370

If you are lucky, then member erfinder may read this thread and perhaps will make some good pieces of advice on the Bedini setup because erfinder studied it deeply if I am not mistaken. 

Hope this helps.  If you have questions, I'll answer if I can 

Merry Xmas to you all.

Gyula

[life is illusion]

I took a snapshot from your video on the generator and indicated flux directions with two black and one red arrow. When any of the rotor magnets enters the airgap on the left (open) side of the C core, flux from the rotor magnet will choose two directions (trying to make a closed magnetic path) as the two black arrows indicate, first suppose there is no load and no capacitor on the output coil.

Gyula

Dear Gyula,
Thank you for explaining all that, I appreciate it
I agree with everything you mentioned, at least with everything I understood So I decided to make a small change in the shape of the core. Would you please let me know what you think about this one? In the picture we can see the same solenoid in different stages of construction. First I think we can make the central core and wind the mag wire around it. Then we could do the rest of the casting and add the iron oxide glue mixture to the sides of the central core to dry. By doing so, the N1 will have to go through the solenoid regardless of N2 pushing it away or not. I mean the N1 will cut the solenoid and induce current on the solenoid and when N2 is generated it will take the path of bypass and move away from the rotor. N1 has 3 options:

1_ Go back to the rotor and fight the incoming magnets.
2_ Go through the central core and find S1
3_ Go through the bypass along N2.

Do you think this "modification" will helps us in here at all?

BR
Sam

P.S Merry Christmas to all

[gyulasun]

Hi Sam,

If I got it correctly, the difference in your above drawing and the one in the video is that the ends of the generator coil (i.e. the winding) are extended to be in the incoming flux path, before the incoming flux is just about to branch.
However this is but a few percent more flux to have it participate in induction because the total length of the coil is still placed on the I core where still nearly half of the incoming flux is available for induction only.

So I can see a trifle difference in the possible operation between the two setups of the two drawings, I think they are quasi identical, hence the incoming magnet flux is still divided into path A and path B as my arrows showed.

You drew a dotted arrow for N1 towards path B and you drew a solid arrow for N1 towards path A: what makes you think that N1 would not go towards path B when entering the modified setup?

There would be a possibility to insure that flux N1 should not choose path B: letting some air gap between the I core of the solenoid and the C core on the right hand side. This way you would have a means of controlling the magnetic reluctance of the magnetic path and you could steer almost all the incoming flux towards the I core of the solenoid and only a little flux towards the C core on the right.

However, this air gap will also be present when the counter flux N2 appears (and it does appear in the very moment you attach a load resistor across the generator coil) so that the reluctance introduced will be there for N2 too.

However, the fact that the air gap can be chosen much smaller between the I and right hand side C core than the gap on the left side where the rotor magnets enter, you have a means for a trade-off how much part of the input flux participate in the desired induction in the I core and how much counterflux you let towards the right hand side C core.

And it still remains to be seen whether such air-gapped setup would produce more output power than it is needed for maintaining the rotation of the rotor magnets...   
Only carefully building it with minimal cogging to ultimately reduce input power and correct measuring can answer this. And, unfortunately, nobody has come along with positive results... (positive=more output than input) 
And of course this may mean two things: it is not possible to get more out than in with such setup, or those who did get more out than in keep silence... 

One notice, you wrote this:  "By doing so, the N1 will have to go through the solenoid regardless of N2 pushing it away or not. I mean the N1 will cut the solenoid and induce current on the solenoid and when N2 is generated it will take the path of bypass and move away from the rotor."

As per Lenz law, it is not possible in your setup that flux N2 (i.e. the counter flux) should not fight against N1 in the I core too which is part of the core path for the solenoid. Because the source of flux N2 is the solenoid itself, when you attach a load to it, you immediately create and launch a second "rotor magnet" which ruins almost everything, showers most of the sunshine away...

Gyula

[kEhYo77]

Hi guyz.
In the attachment you can find a good solution to this. It is a frame from a guy's YT vid from a while back.
I works like this:
A magnet has to be strong enough to almost saturate the thin, front part of the core.
The center part, where the coil is has to be twice as thick as the front part to make some room for the CEMF flux from the loaded
generator coil which is being looped by the back keeper part of the core assembly. So the CEMF flux is effectively decoupled from the source
and does not influence EMF flux and thus the moving magnet.


@Gyula
I disagree with you on that, that the flux from the magnet will go through both legs of the core. If the permeability of the center core is high enough
the flux will take the shortest route leaving the back 'CEMF keeper' part of the core unaffected, ready to receive the flux from the generator coil.

Now we just have to organize the geometry around the rotor as in Muller ODD/EVEN no magnets/coils and we have ourselves an excellent OU generator
kEhYo