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Overunity Machines Forum



Skycollection's "Pentafilar Pancake" inductively coupled "Overunity Potential".

Started by synchro1, February 24, 2015, 04:12:38 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

MarkE

Quote from: Void on March 05, 2015, 09:05:00 PM
Hi Skycollection, an oscilloscope is useful if you want to look at the waveform shapes, but not essential
for what you are doing. It will probably be more useful and simpler for you to place a current meter (ammeter) in one of the
battery wires to measure the DC current coming from your batteries (or from your super capacitors). You can then multiply
the current you measure from the battery times the battery terminal voltage to get a fairly good idea of your input power.
Without making this measurement you just don't know how your circuit is performing at all. This is easy to do and would be a
good start if you are interested in trying to see how you circuit is really performing. Your circuit is working well, but LED lights can be
quite deceiving. The LED lights could be running at half power or less, and the LED lights can still glow quite brightly.
All the best...
In low power circuits, the burden voltage of a DMM's current measuring circuit can be a problem.  Additionally, while high quality meters have low inducatnce current sense resistors, that is not universally true.  The result is that for spikey signals, you can get inaccurate averages.  The burden voltage is specified for most meters. 

The preferred way to measure current is using a current shunt that is in the circuit and that has a sufficiently low inductance that it will not cause serious measurement distortion.  For that, a low inductance resistor, preferably a four wire Kelvin resistor is the way to go.  You can make a poor man's Kelvin resistor by soldering wires to a low inductance sense resistor right at the body.  Or you can pay more and just buy four wire sense resistors.  The lower the value of the current sense resistor, and the faster the current rise time and fall times, the more important it is to sense with a very low inductance shunt.   These sorts of shunts are available for about $1.00 each from Digikey for the two terminal types and $2 - $6 each for the four terminal types depending on wattage.  TK shows some of the two terminal types in some of his videos.  In one video in particular he demonstrates the huge difference between measurements made across a low inductance shunt and an ordinary cement wire-wound power resistor.








MarkE

Quote from: Vortex1 on March 05, 2015, 06:58:11 PM
Hi Jorge

You mentioned wanting to eliminate your rotor magnet.

Try this "old school" multi-vibrator circuit. It is one of my favorites.

It uses the same transistors you are now using in a slightly different configuration.

You may have to experiment with the values for C1 and R1, and if you can measure the inductance of your driving coil, I can approximate better values for C1, R1.

As the circuit  stands it charges the inductor about every 8 milliseconds and discharges in 2 milliseconds, with a burst of high current pulses into the LED.

The scopeshot shows the inductor ramp up and discharge current (white), during the inductor discharge, you can see the LED current pulses in blue'

It should be self starting. You can use a potentiometer in series with R1 to adjust the firing rate and brightness.

It might also help to add a ferrite rod through your coils to raise the inductance. It will also allow the circuit to operate at a lower frequency, so switching loss will not be a big problem.

When everything is properly tuned to your coils, you will be amazed what this little circuit can do.

There are many additional refinements that can be added to the circuit to increase its efficiency, but this is a good starting point for you.

Kind Regards
Vorex1 / ION
A modest capacitor across the LED should improve the circuit efficiency quite a bit.  Alternatively, remove the Schottky diode and you have something similar to your basic garden stick light.

Vortex1

Quote from: MarkE on March 05, 2015, 11:31:50 PM
A modest capacitor across the LED should improve the circuit efficiency quite a bit.  Alternatively, remove the Schottky diode and you have something similar to your basic garden stick light.

Yes, agreed

You can also eliminate C1 and use a 220k resistor  in it's place to eliminate the burst firing effect. The Schottky diode is not really needed as the reverse voltage is not that high.

As I said, this is the most basic circuit, there are considerable enhancements that can be implemented, I have not included them to keep it simple.

Void

@MarkE:  The method I mentioned for measuring the DC input current from the battery using any sort of half decent
quality ammeter should give a fairly reasonably accurate current measurement for the type of circuit that Jorge is using.
That is all Jorge really needs at this point, so that he can get a half decent idea how his circuit is performing, if he is interested.

@Skycollection: When you say bifilar, trifilar, pentafilar, etc., for your primary pancake coil, do you mean as in the way Arto shows it?
Also, what capacitance value are your two super capacitors?

All the best...



MarkE

Quote from: Void on March 06, 2015, 03:55:01 AM
@MarkE:  The method I mentioned for measuring the DC input current from the battery using any sort of half decent
quality ammeter should give a fairly reasonably accurate current measurement for the type of circuit that Jorge is using.
That is all Jorge really needs at this point, so that he can get a half decent idea how his circuit is performing, if he is interested.

@Skycollection: When you say bifilar, trifilar, pentafilar, etc., for your primary pancake coil, do you mean as in the way Arto shows it?
Also, what capacitance value are your two super capacitors?

All the best...
If a decent decoupling network is placed on the load side of the DMM, then the DMM can read average current well without question.  If there are pulse currents, then it depends on:  frequency, duty-cycle, and rise-time.  Poynt99 and others have demonstrated that DMMs do a surprisingly good job of averaging AC voltages measured across current sense resistors  going through the DMM carries the caveats that I mentioned.