A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?

[MagnaProp]

...No...The triphene cap is real...

Sounds good. Thanks for all the info on it. You do some of, if not the best, work around here. I respect your decision to give the triphene mix to those you have chosen and thank you for the info you do provide to us on your designs.

[Nink]

The triphene cap is real,but not without it's problems that i cant seem to solve-like the low amount of charge cycles i can get before the cap just fails,and the fact that the two plates have to be squeezed hard together for best performance. So i have passed the mix on to a few people,and i believe they are still experimenting with it.

Hi Tinman

Sounds like you have a lot going on with your triphene cap. I don't know the 11 secret herbs and spices but you mention that one of them is some type of crystal structure (epson salt or  Rochelle salt etc)  and the required pressure as well as the self charging aspect all reminds me of the crystal cells we all made a few years ago. perhaps you have a galvanic reaction between two metals (graphite is metal)  with a salt compound under a lot of pressure.  With the crystal cells if your plates were not thick enough corrosion would create a hole in the metal, If it was not under pressure it stopped working, two much pressure they cracked and stopped working, discharge them they charge back up again.

If I didn't know better I believe what you have invented is a  combo crystal battery  and super capacitor  (graphene, dielectric separator and an electrolyte)

[MileHigh]

The measurement issue for Brad's capacitor and RMS's capacitor claim is equally important as the issue just covered for the battery.  Simple demonstrations where a capacitor will power a small DC motor powering a fan or extrapolations from some other set of data will not cut it.

In this RMS video he claims that he has made a supercapacitor the size of a credit card that's 2000 Farads:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mno-XDP2o2c

Yet he makes no measurements to back up the claim.

Here is what I said to him on that clip:

<<<
It all sounds pretty amazing.  In theory you could use solar panels to pulse charge the supercapacitor bank and at the same time have a boost converter/inverter to draw power from the capacitor bank to produce mains power to power your house.  You could have a battery bank to tap into as a last resort when the energy in the capacitor bank gets too low.

I haven't watched many of your videos, but if I could make one request it would be to do some clips where you make serious measurements on the size of your supercapacitors.  Something like a resistor to discharge the supercap and then record voltages and times and then crunch the numbers to determine the capacitance.  Anecdotal demonstrations where you power a motor can only go so far.

Honestly, I think it would be amazing if a solar panel/supercap/inverter system could meet the needs of say 90% or more of a typical home's energy requirements.  If we drastically reduce the need for chemical batteries and the problems of disposing of chemical batteries it would make for a cleaner renewable domestic energy system.
>>>

After a second request he started to balk and get upset and then he lost his cool and started calling me nasty names.  Then he presumably regained his composure and deleted all of his comments.  This was on a Laserssaber supercapacitor clip.

Here is the main comment I made to him:

<<<
+Robert Murray-Smith What I know is that I asked you on your channel to make measurements of the capacitance to back up your claims and you flinched there also just like you are flinching here.  You made a serious technical mistake with your tap charging of your supercapacitors and you would not admit to it and instead of thanking me for politely pointing out the issue to you,  you denied it and subsequently deleted all of my comments.  So you seem to have some issues.

A Maxwell K2Series BCAP 2000 Farad ultracapacitor is in a can that is 10 cm long x 6 cm in diameter.  In one of your clips you claim that you made a home-brew 2000 Farad capacitor that is roughly the size of a credit card.  Let us be conservative and say that you are claiming 10X the energy density by volume with your credit card sized capacitor that you claim is 2000 Farads.

The onus is on you to prove that is true - that your credit-card-sized capacitor is 2000 Farads because right now I do not believe it.

Apparently you are making the assumption that people don't want to see you make measurements to back up your rather fantastic claims on YouTube.  I can assure you that many people do indeed want to see you back up your claims with measurements.

You attract attention from free energy enthusiasts and that field is rife with people making fake claims and enthusiasts that almost never ask the basic questions that should be asked.  2000 Farads in a form factor roughly the size of a credit card does not smell right to me so I am asking you to back up your claims with credible, honest, and open measurements.  Yet you are flinching and trying to be dismissive of my perfectly legitimate request and also trying to use deflection by trying to impugn my character.  Why don't you just make measurements and back up your claims like any person building supercapacitors should be happy to do?
>>>

Anyone making home-brew supercapacitors needs to make a serious attempt to make a measurement of the capacitance.  It would be nice to see people do this with a bare minimum of diligence, like for example making three measurements and then averaging out the results.  What would be much more impressive would be to see people make measurements on their capacitor by two or even three different ways.  Also, the "ESR," the equivalent series resistance, for any capacitor is extremely important and they should try to measure that also.

MileHigh

[Jimboot]

Did you copy the whole conversation? Or just those couple of comments? It would be good to see the whole thing in context.

[MileHigh]

I can only show half of the conversation:

Me:  <<< +Robert Murray-Smith What Lasersaber, Tinman, and you need to do is make credible measurements of the capacitance of your home-made supercapacitors.  Are you competitive with what is commercially available or not?  Is your energy density competitive with what is commercially available or not?  I looked at one of Tinman's clips and his claimed Farad capacity and what was shown in the clip was not credible. You three gentlemen need to make open, honest, and credible clips where you precisely measure the capacitance of your capacitors.  Are you guys really onto something, or can anybody go onto Digikey and order supercapacitors that outperform your home-brew supercapacitors? We are talking about the difference between anecdotal demonstrations of what the supercapacitors can do vs. getting serious and making real measurements.  >>>

RMS deleted comment:  <<<...>>>

Me:  <<< +Robert Murray-Smith It's not about convincing me, rather it's about convincing yourself that you are onto something.  There are several ways to measure the value of a capacitor.  I suggest that you research them and then make a clip showing your measurements.  Building a capacitor and measuring the value of the capacitor go hand in hand.  It does not have to be a scientific paper, just a good informative clip so that your viewers will benefit from it. >>>

RMS deleted comment:  <<<...>>>

Me:  <<< +Robert Murray-Smith No Robert, it's a perfectly sensible thing to say.  You are building a capacitor, and you should make a measurement of your device.  It's as plain as day.  I am sensing that you might not know how to do it.  Just Google it, learn about how to go about it, and then do some experiments.  >>>

RMS deleted comment:  <<<...>>>

Me:  <<< +Robert Murray-Smith What I know is that I asked you on your channel to make measurements of the capacitance to back up your claims and you flinched there also just like you are flinching here.  You made a serious technical mistake with your tap charging of your supercapacitors and you would not admit to it and instead of thanking me for politely pointing out the issue to you,  you denied it and subsequently deleted all of my comments.  So you seem to have some issues. A Maxwell K2Series BCAP 2000 Farad ultracapacitor is in a can that is 10 cm long x 6 cm in diameter.  In one of your clips you claim that you made a home-brew 2000 Farad capacitor that is roughly the size of a credit card.  Let us be conservative and say that you are claiming 10X the energy density by volume with your credit card sized capacitor that you claim is 2000 Farads. The onus is on you to prove that is true - that your credit-card-sized capacitor is 2000 Farads because right now I do not believe it. Apparently you are making the assumption that people don't want to see you make measurements to back up your rather fantastic claims on YouTube.  I can assure you that many people do indeed want to see you back up your claims with measurements. You attract attention from free energy enthusiasts and that field is rife with people making fake claims and enthusiasts that almost never ask the basic questions that should be asked.  2000 Farads in a form factor roughly the size of a credit card does not smell right to me so I am asking you to back up your claims with credible, honest, and open measurements.  Yet you are flinching and trying to be dismissive of my perfectly legitimate request and also trying to use deflection by trying to impugn my character.  Why don't you just make measurements and back up your claims like any person building supercapacitors should be happy to do? >>>

RMS deleted comment:  <<<...>>>

Me:  <<< +Robert Murray-Smith You are collapsing under your own weight and your obvious phony pretense - if you were real you would be pleased to make a credible, honest measurement of the capacitance of your devices.  >>>

His last comment was quite nasty, so presumably afterwards he regained his composure and then deleted all of his comments.  I questioned his ability to make the capacitance measurement because in his "tap charging" clip he "tap charges" his sample supercapacitors, which presumably have a maximum voltage of under three volts, by connecting them directly to a bench power supply set to something like 18 volts.  One more time, that is an almost insane thing to do if you are supposedly technically competent.  I politely told him that he might damage his samples like that and "punch a hole" through them because of the serious potential to over-voltage them and he balked and refused to acknowledge that there could be a problem.  This discussion was also deleted shortly afterwards by RMS.