MH's ideal coil and voltage question

[MileHigh]

PW:

I can try to find something later.

If you have a battery EMF source facing an equal battery CEMF source then obviously no current flows.  The same thing would apply if you had a capacitor.

However, if you have a battery EMF source facing a resistor or an inductor acting as a CEMF source then current flows.

There are four cases stated above.  In all four cases if you walk around the loop with your voltmeter, you see the EMF source, and then you move your probes and you see the voltage drop associated with the CEMF source.

You can't tell just with your voltage probes if the source of the CEMF is a battery, a capacitor, a resistor, or an inductor.  The only thing that you know is that your voltage probes are detecting the presence of a CEMF source.

Note that you have no interest at all to find out if current is flowing or not, you are just looking for the presence of a device that manifests CEMF.  Indeed, some components stop the current flow when the CEMF is equal to the EMF.  But others do not stop the current flow, even though they manifest equal and opposite CEMF.

Yes, it's a "black box type" of discussion, but usually that's how concepts are introduced at a very basic level.

[MileHigh]

PW:

When current flows through a resistor, is there an electric field inside that resistor?

The answer of course is there is an electric field inside the resistor.  When we do a line integral on the electric field from one end to the other end of the resistor we get an EMF.

There is no rule that says that the EMF being generated by the resistor cannot be called a CEMF.

MileHigh

[MileHigh]

Surfing the web I found an MIT pdf covering Faraday's Law.

http://web.mit.edu/8.02t/www/materials/StudyGuide/guide10.pdf

Look at the attached page capture.  Look familiar?  How absolutely mind-blowing, the B field changes in time and has a trapezoidal waveform.  They must be breaking the rules.

[MileHigh]

PW:

Okay I tried for a while and I could not find anyone using "CEMF" nomenclature for the voltage drop across a resistor in a loop.  I found multiple references where you had an EMF source driving the loop and the resistors or whatever had a "potential difference" across them equal and opposite to the EMF.

In the overall scheme of things we are just talking about voltage.  So I don't mind if for a resistor you use the term "potential difference" or "PD" instead of "CEMF."

Here is a nice short clip showing a KVL loop with multiple voltage sources and multiple resistors.  The presenter's discussion is voltage-centric, he calls the resistors voltage elements instead of resistors.  That might give some readers the feel for how you can look at a loop and focus on the voltage gains and voltage drops in the loop.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjNwqX-DB2w

MileHigh

[MileHigh]

Brad:

I can see you reacting to my previous posting to PW with a lot of nonsensical trash talk about me.  Let me save you the trouble and let's look at a nice chunk of it:

<<<
And to think,you thought you had the smarts to give EMJ a hard time on his understandings about inductors and coils--and me for that matter.   <-- This one sounds like a rude insult.
I dont know what planet you are on,or if you fell into a drum of coolaid,and drank your way out,but if the CEMF was equal and opposite to the EMF,then the total voltage across the inductors terminals would be 0v,and no current would flow.
You have yourself a great time MH,but i am done with your repeated stupidity,and re-writing of physics.  <-- this one sounds like a rude insult
I think you are a little lost when it comes to understanding what CEMF is in an inductor-or anything for that matter.   <-- This one sounds like a rude insult
You do know that  CEMF is a function of reactance, not of resistance,and so i do not know what all that garble about CEMF across a resistor was all about
Gee MH,you attack anyone that dose not agree with you.
Yep-you have finally lost your marbles.  <-- This one sounds like a rude insult
MH is just lost again.  <-- This one sounds like a rude insult
i think MH is having a bad day.
You are lost when you think that the total EMF is going to be converted only to a CEMF.
I think the agony here,is having to keep going over the same stuff an endless amount of times with you.
>>>

So there you go Brad, I have done your trash talking for you.

Now, let's get down to some serious business.

There are three quotes of yours below.  They are mind-blowing because they show that you sometimes still cannot master the most basic basics when it comes to electronics.  It's actually shocking to read your quotes below.  Sadly, these things seem to happen on a fairly consistent basis with you.  What's the point of trying to teach you stuff or discuss circuits with you when sometimes it looks like you missed the first eight weeks of your very first course in electronics, Electronics 001?

The fact that you made the statements below is indicating that you have some serious problems understanding and conceptualizing basic electronics concepts.

You are a moderate electronics hobbyist, and you like doing this stuff?  Then look at your quotes below and do whatever it takes to fix yourself and get yourself in shape so that you can talk sensibly and intelligently with your peers about electronics.  The onus is on you to do what it takes so that you at least have a mastery of all of the basic electronics concepts.

-------------------------------------

1a) There is no drop in voltage at all across the resistor,as the potential difference across the resistor is the very same as that supplied from the source--no drop in voltage.

1b) Using the word !voltage drop! across a single resistor with a voltage of 1 volt placed across it from a voltage source,is just bollocks talk.

2) Yea--good one MH--only we do not have a loop,we have a coil attached to a voltage supply.