An Electric-Motor Turning An Electric-Generator Which Powers The Same Motor ?

[Magluvin]

Back in the early days of DC motors, the stators were coils along with the armature. This creates a situation where the input polarity did not matter as the stators would produce opposite fields along with the armature, so either polarity of DC input and the motor would turn the same direction. So the DC motors of that kind can run off of AC input also. So an old DC motor connected shaft to shaft with an AC gen could work if the AC gen can provide output more efficiently out at given rpm to the old DC motor. Been thinking on these things for many years and come up with more possibilities along the way. They didnt have electronic parts back then that in my thoughts could have been in the switch box to make the thing special. It would need to be something different in 1 or both motors.

Would probably be good to look into or even build some of Teslas AC gen/motors to see if there is anything more efficient about them.

Just thoughts of the day.

Mags

[forest]

Mags


Maybe you simply need to find a DC motor having more torque then others with the same input power , due to permanent magnets used  ? Try to find the difference. Test shaft in both cases. If shaft can be magnetized/demagnetized quickly and strongly then it can allow some tricks , don't you think ?

[Magluvin]

Mags


Maybe you simply need to find a DC motor having more torque then others with the same input power , due to permanent magnets used  ? Try to find the difference. Test shaft in both cases. If shaft can be magnetized/demagnetized quickly and strongly then it can allow some tricks , don't you think ?

Hey Forest

If we choose motors, one as a driver and one as a gen, we have to look at operating parameters to try and get the right ingredients for go. But then if we look at the efficiency of each, we are still below 100%.  Hard to say for sure. I would agree that the motor and gen need to be different from each other somehow.

Like I said before, some may put identical motors together showing losing results and that is that.  So this is what Im trying to point out, no, I dont think that is that, yet.

Some of these EV conversion DC motors have brush adjustments to change performance. So that is something to be considered. The idea that one particular brush setting is not the end all of settings. One setting performs good this way and another setting performs better in other ways. Otherwise why have the settings at all?    This would also indicate that one direction may work differently than the other if there is a  brush setting offset. Like dc motors that need to operate in either direction have brushes basically centered in order to do so equally in either direction. Other motors that are only needed to operate in one direction ever, probably have a brush offset that complements the output of that predestined rotation direction.

I keep leaning toward the possibility of an AC gen and an appropriately designed DC motor with AC phase timing in mind. Possibly. Like for every AC phase peak, the DC motor is in an optimal position to use that  in the most efficient way, eliminating waste. This would most likely be a dc motor using windings instead of perm mags. Just ideas that havnt formed a complete picture for me, yet.

Mags

[guest1289]

A long time ago I discovered that if I brought a magnet close to a running motor,  it dramatically increased it's speed.   Free-energy ?
- As far as I remember it was a DC power source powering a DC-Motor out of a model-kit or slot-car.
- I just assume that was was occurring was that when I brought my handheld magnet close to the motor, that it's magnetic-field strengthened the magnetic-fields of the magnets already in the motor,  and therefore increased it's speed.
   (  There were probably knobs or buttons on the power supply that had settings that I didn't understand enough about,  so that,  and possibly the specific angle at which I brought the magnet close to the motor,  means that it would be too difficult to replicate  )
(  I don't know if this discovery is just a commonly known scientific fact,  or a discovery )

- I only discovered one other person on the internet that made the same accidental-discovery, they posted that discovery in very recent years,  and finding that persons research( webpage ) was so hard to find, that I have not been able to re-find it since  ) 
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A No Friction Generator,  On The Same Shaft As The Motor
- Say you have a motor comprised of a single-wire which causes a magnetic-disk( or a hollow-cylinder-magnet ) to rotate ( a homopolar-motor ),   OR,  a stationary-magnet which causes a current-carrying-wire-ring to rotate( also a homopolar-motor ),   and also on the same-shaft,   you have another identical-motor to the first,  to use as the generator.
    The Reason I chose this generator is because it has no friction in terms of windings, since it's a homopolar-generator.
      Now,  What About if you multiply the diameter/radius of the generator by 2 or 3 times,  and yet somehow not increase the weight ( torque ) of the generator at all,  maybe by using kevlar-arms to increase the diameter/radius,   Would This Be Power Amplification ?

------------------------------

   Also, I still don't understand why Faraday used a mercury-filled( today they use brine ) bowl for his Faraday-motor,  since he could just have just induced a disc-magnet to spin( maybe not available back then ), or induced a current-carrying hollow-disk to spin etc,   and why it's still often commonly replicated today,  using the liquid.
    I assume,  that it's because it was the first discovery/version of a motor.

     But now I see these popular DIY very-simple Homopolar-motors made of a single battery, a single small-flat-disc-magnet,  and a piece of wire.
      HOWEVER,  The Thing I don't understand is why they run the current through the permanent-magnet( small-flat-disc-magnet ),  I don't get why you run current through a permanent-magnet,  which I think also occurs in the original Faraday-Motor,  it seems like a very strange thing to do.
-----------------------

   I don't know why people use anything other than DC-curent ( as smooth as possible, as similar to from a battery as possible ) for their research for any devices on this site, it makes little sense to use anything else.   
      -  I guess there may be some applications where AC is appropriate.
         But specifically, I refer to devices like the Figuera-Device.

[Magluvin]

A long time ago I discovered that if I brought a magnet close to a running motor,  it dramatically increased it's speed.   Free-energy ?
- As far as I remember it was a DC power source powering a DC-Motor out of a model-kit or slot-car.
- I just assume that was was occurring was that when I brought my handheld magnet close to the motor, that it's magnetic-field strengthened the magnetic-fields of the magnets already in the motor,  and therefore increased it's speed.
   (  There were probably knobs or buttons on the power supply that had settings that I didn't understand enough about,  so that,  and possibly the specific angle at which I brought the magnet close to the motor,  means that it would be too difficult to replicate  )
(  I don't know if this discovery is just a commonly known scientific fact,  or a discovery )

- I only discovered one other person on the internet that made the same accidental-discovery, they posted that discovery in very recent years,  and finding that persons research( webpage ) was so hard to find, that I have not been able to re-find it since  ) 
-------------------------------

A No Friction Generator,  On The Same Shaft As The Motor
- Say you have a motor comprised of a single-wire which causes a magnetic-disk( or a hollow-cylinder-magnet ) to rotate ( a homopolar-motor ),   OR,  a stationary-magnet which causes a current-carrying-wire-ring to rotate( also a homopolar-motor ),   and also on the same-shaft,   you have another identical-motor to the first,  to use as the generator.
    The Reason I chose this generator is because it has no friction in terms of windings, since it's a homopolar-generator.
      Now,  What About if you multiply the diameter/radius of the generator by 2 or 3 times,  and yet somehow not increase the weight ( torque ) of the generator at all,  maybe by using kevlar-arms to increase the diameter/radius,   Would This Be Power Amplification ?

------------------------------

   Also, I still don't understand why Faraday used a mercury-filled( today they use brine ) bowl for his Faraday-motor,  since he could just have just induced a disc-magnet to spin( maybe not available back then ), or induced a current-carrying hollow-disk to spin etc,   and why it's still often commonly replicated today,  using the liquid.
    I assume,  that it's because it was the first discovery/version of a motor.

     But now I see these popular DIY very-simple Homopolar-motors made of a single battery, a single small-flat-disc-magnet,  and a piece of wire.
      HOWEVER,  The Thing I don't understand is why they run the current through the permanent-magnet( small-flat-disc-magnet ),  I don't get why you run current through a permanent-magnet,  which I think also occurs in the original Faraday-Motor,  it seems like a very strange thing to do.
-----------------------

   I don't know why people use anything other than DC-curent ( as smooth as possible, as similar to from a battery as possible ) for their research for any devices on this site, it makes little sense to use anything else.   
      -  I guess there may be some applications where AC is appropriate.
         But specifically, I refer to devices like the Figuera-Device.

Adding the magnet to the motor does increase the stator magnet field, and if you flip the magnet over to the other pole it should slow some.  As far as I know the stronger the permanent mags in a motor, the more physical output per input to the armature. Which is logical, as if the internal magnets were replaced with very weak mags, the output will diminish while the input remains the same as before. So there should be an efficiency increase using larger/stronger mags.

The mercury was used to replace the brushes on the outer edge of the disk. Reduction of wear on the rotor edge and lower friction as the brushes needed to be tight against the rotor due to high currents produced and the necessity of very low resistance at the connection. And the brushes on the outer edge has more friction braking power at the outer edge of the disk.  I wouldnt feel comfortable using mercury unless it were a sealed unit that did not allow any to get out of the casing, None.

Mags