Muller Dynamo

[konehead]

hi all
Last night I was holding a stack of seven 1/4" thick 1" wide grade 42 ring- magnets in my left hand, and putting them in place behind a motor coil in my "Romero-vairant" machine that has the big speed up when it has magnets behind the cores same machine same setup and same stack of magnets like shown in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlgEaZ8Ppc0&feature=related
There is flat ferrous-steel washer behind the motor coil too..
draw was about 200ma and 12V to the motor....was using jsut one motor coil to power it to see what happens like that instead of two facing it, sodraw was higher than usual and the other motor coil facing it on other plate became a genrator-coil for some testing...
anyways I got a big sharp spike of voltage that went up my left arm when I touched to magnet-stack to the flat washer behind the motor coils (ferrite core inside motor coil)...It "felt" like a backemf-spike which some of you know can give you quite a jolt if you touch mosfets at certin points even if running on only 12V and 100ma or so...
but here I was was only touching the long stack magnets to flat washer...so it could of only been a "magnetic-spike" - perhaps with a "voltage-carrier to it ""?? (my theory)
I dont know - it happened to me twice really hurt the 2nd time too...somthign is going on here I dont know about - so its rubber gloves from now on....
someone told me once that it is "inherent" that whenever you have magnetic field you have elelctical field, and some sort of heat too...or cold if negative?)..and whenver you have electrical field you have an inherent magnetic field and heat,
anand henever you have heat, you have an inherent electical field and its magnetic field, so maybe the very strong magnetic field situated behind the coil is pikcup up the backemf spikes to be runnnign through it?
And "these" backemf spike dont need any wires to carry it along - just the magnetic field to carry it?
and the nickel plating of the magnets becomes a wire attached to my arm??

[konehead]

Hi Mariu
that is great that you got some speed up and much less draw with backing magnets behind the MOTOR coils.....you should try more and more stacked there on top for stronger field until the field is too strong an dit slows (find the balance)  - If those are weak ferrites, you should not affect your halls...I had sort of breakthrough on backing magnets behind genrator coils - read post below I put up on it..I think you should short each of your gernator coils one by one, and put same backing-magnet "strength" to them, as what yoru motor coils like too, and then hopefully shorting your generator coils leads together in dead short wont slow the rotor - maybe will give it some exponential speed up at higher rpms if lucky...

[konehead]

hi all
with same motor as seen in video, and same stack of seven magnets as shown (same ones that gave me shock behind motor coil)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlgEaZ8Ppc0&feature=related
I was pulsing jsut one of the motor coils, the bottom one, and using the top facing one as a generator coil as simple experiment.
Motor was only going a slow 550rpm...draw to the single motor was around 250ma and 12V this time - sort of high draw but not worried about it just testing..

Anyways, I shorted the genrator coil's leads together in a dead-short....rotor slows down in dramatic LUGGING...as you would expect...this with NO magnets behind the gernator coil...
then I stacked one magnet at a time behind the generator as a test, to see what magnets to the generator-coil part of it - the magnets are sitting on top of the flat steel washer behind the core and coil...
When I got to 3 or 4 magnet stacked up, I noticed that the motor didnt lug as much when coil was dead-shorted - when I finally reached point of 7 magnets stacked behind the generator coils (also what the motor coils seem to like - the length of 7 magnets stacked) then there was NO lug to the spin of rotor, and no extra amperage either to the draw (so NO LENZ)
I checked the voltage into a 220uf DC cap after FWBR off generator coil - and in three seconds, WITHOUT magnet behind core of generator coil, it fills to 4.4 VDC...WITH magnet behind core, it fills slower, now to 3.5VDC in three seconds, BUT: NO LENZ LUGGING with magnets in place....if I wait tens seconds or so for cap to fill up as high as possible, without magnet is was 10V with NO magnet, and  it was 5V WITH magnet, so there is drop in total voltage using magnet behind core, but when looking at the speed of filling the cap its not so signifigant drop of voltage...
SO - conclusion is you cna really cut lenz lugging down by putting magnets bheind the cores....you need to find proper strength of magnets however to really "null" (?) the core...

[gyulasun]

...
SO - conclusion is you cna really cut lenz lugging down by putting magnets bheind the cores....you need to find proper strength of magnets however to really "null" (?) the core...

Hi Doug,

well,  Putting the magnets behind the cores their effect is bringing the cores gradually towards the saturation region, effectively reducing the coil's original self inductance.  Induced voltage is proportional to coil's L inductance, if you experienced half as many induced voltage from it vs the no magnet case, then the coil's L value got reduced to half of its original value too. 
And if this is true (very likely), then this could explain the reduced Lenz effect too, unfortunately...  I think  because those strong magnets may make the gen coil eventually look like almost an air cored coil  but you know, even an air cored coil has Lenz effect, but due to its much less self inductance the drag is also less.   Perhaps connecting more gen coils into your setup and also using magnets behind their cores, the overall drag effect even if it is small could be seen more pronounced, and the eventual benefit of using magnets behind the cores in this setup as shown may turn out.  (I do not doubt there may be any advantage, only I say conventional physics can explain the less Lenz drag, unfortunately.)

Greetings, Gyula

[Scorch]

Just another minor update.

I keep making changes as I progress on this work in progress.

I decided to start with bifiler coils first because these give more options so, rather than build another set of bobbins, I made a simple jig to unwind the existing coils then simply doubled the wire, twisted them together and rewound the coils. Actually easier to wind because it's half as many turns and can only fit about 21 feet of wire on each coil.

Also going to try working with regular switching versus solid state devices.

And I have compiled what I THINK I know about this Bill Muller/Phil Wood/RomeroUK device-

-Using offset number of coils, to rotor magnets, helps to significantly reduce cogging.
-Using both, North & South, sides of the magnets doubles number of coils that may be used.
-Using Bias magnets also helps to reduce cogging.
-Bias magnets change position of magnetic “blok wall” and significantly change the conductance of the coil.
-May not be necessary to operate as a high speed, “resonant” system.
-Coil cores should be constructed of high permeability, low hysteresis, materials such as ferrite or iron dust.
-Coil cores should be well insulated from windings.
-High current-low voltage may be preferred over low current-high voltage.
-Both Carmen Muller and RomeroUK demonstrated different, self-running, closed loop systems.
-Youtube also user-PMMG4HYBRID also demonstrates a self-running, closed-loop, system based on a combination of Howard Johnson style magnetic gates, super-efficient PM motor, high & low microfarad capacitors, low, or no, cogging alternator, and Back Electro-Magnetic Field (BEMF) coil and switching.
-There may be an advantage, such as less cogging and stronger AC currents, by off-setting stator plates.
-Bias magnet washers may serve to “focus” magnetic flux on the coil core therefore different size ID washers may have different effects.
-Bifiler wound coils offer many advantages including options to wire for high current or high voltage or collection of BEMF energy.
-Twisted or “Litz” wire increases exposure of surface areas to magnetic vortexes and keeps conductors extremely close to each other which may be beneficial for BEMF systems.
-BEMF recovery is best with “hard” switching, such as a straight switch, as opposed to solid state systems.
-A common ignition system switch known as “Breaker Points” or “Contact Points”, such as part #2-2008, is specifically designed to operate in high load, high temperature, high speed conditions and may have a convenient adjustment for “dwell” or length of “on time”. And I prefer the name “Breaker points” because that is where the work is accomplished, not when the switch closes but when the switch OPENS and BREAKS the circuit resulting in a collapse of the magnetic field.
-A 0.25 electrolytic capacitor, such as an old-school “condenser”, such as part #2-2203, aids in a “rapid collapse” of the magnetic field in a coil and significantly reduces arcing and deterioration of the breaker points.
-Typical ball bearings have less friction, and chatter, when used for horizontal shaft versus vertical shaft.
-Storage capacitors and energy converters, such as a DC-DC converter may be necessary to accomplish self-running configuration and protect motor-generator coils.
-Laser cut rotors are not perfect.
-My rotor is eight magnets therefore an eight lobe, ignition distributor, cam will work perfectly to operate my switching.
-Use non-ferrous materials such as plastics, brass, and 316 stainless steel, for the primary structure.
-My current coils are bifilar wound, #20 AWG, twisted to 4-5 turns per inch. Approximately 21 feet wound into 10mm ferrite bobbins with 1 3/16” OD and 3/4” inside width.
-My bearings are cheap, flange mount, sealed ball bearings with 5/8” OD X 1/4” ID.


And here is the latest photograph of the frame with switch plate and mock-up cam.
High resolution version is here:
http://www.rodscontracts.ws/images/projects/muller/MullerParts2.jpg


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