Roll on the 20th June

[DarkStar_DS9]

"leverage" = torque

And no, this doesnt work. The extension does not provide more torque, so it does not provide more leverage.

You are saying that if I shift the rod to one side, I will not have more torque?? Because clearly we ARE going to shift the rod, so if you say that it doesn't work while the rod is centered I fail to see how this is relevant to the task at hand.

Regards,

Rainer

[dirt diggler]

I cannot see how after typing what you yourself typed, you don't get it. I love the human mind.

Ok:

The long end does not weigh "nothing" Dirt.

If there are no weights attached, the long end is on the ground because it is heavier. Lets call that weight "H"

Now, on the short end, I'm to put a weight. Adding this weight will make that side weigh more. lets make it weigh H+.5

Lets give H a value of "20kilos"
now...if you do simple math...H is 20 kilos. this is our long end.

What happens, Dirt, if I add "1Kilo" to "H"?

"21kilos"...which is heavier than "20.5kilos".

No magic. None. Zero.

I'm not "holding 20kilos in the air with 1kilo, which is of course "impossible"...I'm holding "20kilos in the air with 21kilos"

This is an over simplification but essentially what is going on; the small weight + the weight of the long side is the real weight. the fact that it is small is not relevant; it is enough. It is completely normal in every way. It is unremarkable, the lever itself.

The circular logic in the explanation doesn't change the actual weights in any way If you made a little one of these for yourself attached like a spring scale or postal gravity scale to the long end it just seems to me that it would be really, really obvious...so much so that I can't see anyone needed to make a model to see this.

*shrug*

I am not stupid. of coarse I realize this, that is how a lever works when it is unbalanced.
I'm talking about the EXTRA 5.3KG that is added on to the short end. so now using yours and Pure powers numbers we have: our H= .5 as you said PLUS we have 5.3KG, which with my math says we have 5.8KG being lifted by the same 1KG on the other end. 
please explain this.
watch the vids again if you have to.
1 kg lifts at least 5.8 kg on an unbalance, short end heavy (by somewhere around .5-2kg) 5:1 fulcrum
please don't try to tell me it's because the short end is only "slightly" heavier.
I KNOW THIS, THATS MY POINT!!!!
if the short end is even 1 ounce heavier than the long end, which we know it has to be, as it is down and the long is up, than we have a problem with your explaination.
again, still waiting for a PROPER analysis.

ciao, Dirt

[arXiv76]

Nice red box, but you've lost me. WTF are you talking about.
Are you just showing us what your going to do with the wheel or lever once working, or are you creating something new?
Again sorry, your posts lost me with your personal direction pertaining to Archers devices.

BATMAN LOVES BATGIRL........And Reads books over 18,000 books in the BATCAVE.

I think he makes love with the BatGirl........got that right !!!

BATMAN IS PUTTING a P.M. motor Into a car.

Stay tune.........BATMAN.........where is BATGIRL .....i know she is in the BATCAVE  instailling "big cap's in the bat car.................Gotto go.....BATMAN !!!

[dirt diggler]

No problems. I said if anyone still had questions I will still provide my input. Im just not going to go there myself...

Okay, its like this. Im going to use archaic Archurian math here, not dealing with torque, energy, or anything of the sort. Everything will be described in "kilos" even if it is not mass...

We have a small mass(1 kilo) a large mass (20 kilo) and a lever (15.5 kilo advantage towards the extended end).

Okay, so with the no mass on, the lever would fall to the extended end with 15.5 kilos. Now we add the heavy 20 kilo mass. Now the lever would fall to the short end with 4.5 kilos. Still with me? Good...

This is how the lever is weighted towards the long end, but it is still up in the video.

Now we add the 1 kilo to the 5:1 lever. This means we are getting 5 kilos lift at the short end. Since the short end is only down because of 4.5 kilos, the 1 kilo would easily fall to the round, lifting the 20 kilo mass.

Still believe in magic?

-PurePower

(Wow, I just realized I can prove this thing a freud fake using Newtonian or Archurian analysis...)

Pure Power:
now lets use your numbers shall we?
first of all, I comletely understand this part of the function, it is what allows te lever to drop to the short side only "just".
got it no problem there, does exactly what it was designed to do, return an empty lever to the short down, long high position. which it does.
so the lever is sitting with the short side down with a load of 4.5KG on it, which obviously would be lifted easily with 1KG on the long end(with about .5 KG to spare)
no problem there.  I understand.
then we add 5.3 MORE KG's to the short end, so now we have 4.5kg + 5.3kg =9.8kg "downforce" on the short end of the lever.  Right?
ok, now we put 1kg on the long end, and it drops. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
so we have 9.8 kg being lifted by 1kg on a 5:1 lever, that YOU admited was balanced to the short end by 4.5KG.
we know that the 1 kg lifted the 4.5 with .5 to spare, as per your numbers, so what exactly is lifting the other 5.3KG.

thanks for taking the time with me PurePower, please read my posts, slowly, and watch the vids again.
I know how a lever is supposed to work, but I'm seeing something diferent happen here, and I 'm trying to find out why.

ciao,  Dirt

[Rusty_Springs]

I am not stupid. of coarse I realize this, that is how a lever works when it is unbalanced.
I'm talking about the EXTRA 5.3KG that is added on to the short end. so now using yours and Pure powers numbers we have: our H= .5 as you said PLUS we have 5.3KG, which with my math says we have 5.8KG being lifted by the same 1KG on the other end. 
please explain this.
watch the vids again if you have to.
1 kg lifts at least 5.8 kg on an unbalance, short end heavy (by somewhere around .5-2kg) 5:1 fulcrum
please don't try to tell me it's because the short end is only "slightly" heavier.
I KNOW THIS, THATS MY POINT!!!!
if the short end is even 1 ounce heavier than the long end, which we know it has to be, as it is down and the long is up, than we have a problem with your explaination.
again, still waiting for a PROPER analysis.

ciao, Dirt

Hi Dirt
Whats your point are you saying the short end lifts with no weight on the long end, I could be wrong but didn't he take the weight off the short end before doing that test.
The question you should be asking is how much weight is really in the drum as I see it with the 5k weight he put on the short end plus whats in the drum the beam is balanced.
Then the 1k makes the long end drop, then he takes the 1k off and everything is balanced again, then he moves over again and takes the weight off the short end making the long end because of the weight of the beam heavier and it drops lifting the short end.
I hope I explaned that right because this lever is boring me and its dead in the water so to speak.
Take care Dirt
Graham

PS: moral of the lever = no free energy explaned 1000 times by how many different people in how many different way, put it to bed and move on to the wheel.