Roll on the 20th June

[queue]

Archer Quinn's Mayernik Array . ..

i hope Archer finishes his wheel soon. i have spent MANY hours playing with this array and to date have no luck closing the loop. I made a last video replicating AQ's lift from 10 to 12 over the wall and break out after gaining some momentum from gravity. Many have noted that with more magnets Archer could have lifted from 6 instead of 10 to be able to then close the loop.
Well i have more magnets .. i have many magnets :-)

The wheel and magnetic array in this test does both lifts .. from 6 to 12 over the top ..
AND
10 to 12 over the top and break the wall with seemingly lots of extra energy ..

The damn frustrating thing about this array and working/playing with it is that it always seems to be JUST ABOUT to work .. a little more energy needed, more mags , more powerful mags .. whatever .. always the same story .. little bit short to be able retstart the cycle and self perpetuate. I would happily buff and shine each and every magnet i have or own .. if i thought it would provide that extra . .gleam in the array's eye..

Trying to get a restart cycle .. using this array is just not happening .. IMO that is .
Prove me wrong .. someone .. anyone .. 
Archer Quinn.

i started prototyping arrays to appease my own curiosity and to know if what Archer was building might work.
i am still waiting for his wheel and i did purchase his plans so i guess eventually that chapter will tell.

As magnetic arrays go .. this one was fun to play with.
My fingers hurt :-)

Heres the movie from my server
http://relativity.ca/AQuinnwheel/aqwheel3.wmv

Heres the URL @ YouTUbe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjwK2WeLzWQ

C Ya
Q

Heres a pic of the current array config ..

[Fred Flintstone]

I built a test setup similar to Archer's. Sorry no pictures. It is toy size, only about 5" diameter. I have a track of neo mags around the perimeter and I have a single arm. I am getting the exact same results as Exx and Queue. Here are the results of my experiments.

1. There is no wall going in.
2. There is a wall going out.
3. I can reproduce Archer's results exactly by breaking the wall.
4. I cannot close the loop even though I have plenty of neodymium magnets.
5. If you extend the track down to 6:00 then the magnet enters the track and stops at the wall going out.

The magnet going in accelerates quickly and then slowly decelerates as it is riding down the track. It is almost impossible to see or detect with the naked eye the speed decrease. The longer the track, the slower it gets at the end and the more likely it is for the end wall to stop it. Add more weight to the arm and it won't lift. Take more weight off the arm and it stops at the exit. Make the track shorter and it will break the wall at around 2-3:00 but does not have enough track to pick it back up at the bottom.  I am very intrigued by this. It seems like there is a way to make this work. It seems almost impossible to me that the laws of physics (Newton) is preventing me from closing the loop. We just need to find a different magnet array arrangement. To me, the primary problem is that it is so difficult to build the tracks and experiment with the results. It took me two hours to build my track of almost 100 small neo mags.

Freddy

[shakman]

Apologies in advance if I'm repeating anyone or this is outdated, I'm at work and started typing this over an hour ago...

Okay, so it looks like we're all getting stuck at the wall coming out of the Mayernik Array.
(I use the term "we're" lightly, I'm still waiting for some bits and pieces and haven't personally done these tests yet).

But with enough force, can you push the roller past the sticky spot?
Sounds like a dumb question, but stick with me (excuse the pun).

Can your roller carry a load of any type other than its own weight through the Mayernik Array?

If you answered "yes" to these questions, think back to the original concept for a minute. The idea was to use leverage on opposing arms to overbalance the wheel by suspending a weight out on the falling side and retracting it on the rising side. If this weight is able to apply sufficient force to the arm to force a magnet out of a sticky spot at the end of the Mayernik Array and back to the point of entry, but not be too heavy (EDIT: when retracted) so as to create too much of a load to allow the action to repeat on re-entry to the Mayernik Array then you've broken the wall and created OU.

I believe this is the direction Archer is headed, although I'm not sure exactly what configuration he intends to use yet. It might be an idea for us to start playing with this idea....?

shakman

EDIT: I just noticed when typing that I only posed two questions, the first comment was a statement. I've corrected my grammatical error.

[shakman]

Another idea....
What if the plate/wheel was angled away from the array so that it is physically further away (more gap) near the exit point?

This might just change the location of the wall, but I was thinking that as the roller/arm gets closer to the sticky spot the magnetic attraction is reduced.

I will try to illustrate this when I get a chance for those that don't follow what I mean.

Sorry for just throwing ideas out there willy-nilly. I promise I'll be able to perform some experiments of my own soon. I currently have a few magnets on the way from the good old U.S. of A. It worked out cheaper for some bizarre reason, unless someone can point me to a good, cheap local distributor (I'm in Australia, near Sydney).

shakman

[kude]

I built a test setup similar to Archer's. Sorry no pictures. It is toy size, only about 5" diameter. I have a track of neo mags around the perimeter and I have a single arm. I am getting the exact same results as Exx and Queue. Here are the results of my experiments.

1. There is no wall going in.
2. There is a wall going out.
3. I can reproduce Archer's results exactly by breaking the wall.
4. I cannot close the loop even though I have plenty of neodymium magnets.
5. If you extend the track down to 6:00 then the magnet enters the track and stops at the wall going out.

The magnet going in accelerates quickly and then slowly decelerates as it is riding down the track. It is almost impossible to see or detect with the naked eye the speed decrease. The longer the track, the slower it gets at the end and the more likely it is for the end wall to stop it. Add more weight to the arm and it won't lift. Take more weight off the arm and it stops at the exit. Make the track shorter and it will break the wall at around 2-3:00 but does not have enough track to pick it back up at the bottom.  I am very intrigued by this. It seems like there is a way to make this work. It seems almost impossible to me that the laws of physics (Newton) is preventing me from closing the loop. We just need to find a different magnet array arrangement. To me, the primary problem is that it is so difficult to build the tracks and experiment with the results. It took me two hours to build my track of almost 100 small neo mags.

Freddy

@freddy and exx,
It looks like you guys made a horseshoe magnet with the attracting force equals the repelling force at the end. So the traveling magnet dutifully goes from the start end to the end end. It seems you need the acceleration of the attraction side and want to get rid of the stop/repulsion side. So instead of thinking 2 dimensionally think 3. As your track goes to the 1 o'clock it is countersunk deeper into the backboard. If the force is reduced 1/4 by distance, the deeper the track sinks away from the traveling magnet, the less the stopping force. So when the stop end approaches the start end the forces are not equal. The stop end is way below the force of the start end, and the cycle can restart. Exx think ramping down the gravity side of the clock face. The traveling magnet stays in the plane but the magnets under the track move away from the plane until the stopping force is very very small.

I don't have the magnets to play with for this track/traveller setup, but maybe you guys can try it.