HHO Cell - Stan Meyer Design.

[supermuble]

You brought up a good point just now. A capacitor that fails goes into a "dead short" and drains all the current in one burst across the plates, through the electrolyte. If using a water capacitor, then it stands to reason that Stan charged it up, then waited for a catastrophic failure to occur (capacitor failure) and when the short circuit was detected, the process was shut down.. This cycle repeats, though the capacitor failure must be quelled because the water restricts amps, so the plates don't arc too bad, otherwise they would burn. This doesn't happen since we are using plain tap water with high resistance, hence the orange glow and the appearance of sparks under the water is really a capacitor failure, recurring in quick cycles.

[OscarMeyer]

You brought up a good point just now. A capacitor that fails goes into a "dead short" and drains all the current in one burst across the plates, through the electrolyte. If using a water capacitor, then it stands to reason that Stan charged it up, then waited for a catastrophic failure to occur (capacitor failure) and when the short circuit was detected, the process was shut down.. This cycle repeats, though the capacitor failure must be quelled because the water restricts amps, so the plates don't arc too bad, otherwise they would burn. This doesn't happen since we are using plain tap water with high resistance, hence the orange glow and the appearance of sparks under the water is really a capacitor failure, recurring in quick cycles.

Bingo!!!

[Farrah Day]

Farrah Day,

We both agree on the fact that current flow through a resistive medium causes heat

Do we? Not according to your earlier statement:

But high voltage alone does not add up as there would be constant temperature rise â€" increasing temperature in the water over extended periods of time

You also said this:

To say that the electrodes don’t need to be actually in the water in order for varying voltage frequency to work is like saying wires do not need to be hooked up to a motor in order for a varidrive to alter its speed when it changes voltage frequency.

You're completely wrong with this statement, this is the very principle by which a true capacitor operates. Either you are not properly reading what I'm saying or you're not understanding what I'm saying, but it is very basic science and electronics. When I said the electrodes would not need to be actually in the water if voltage alone was able to produce gas, I was of course inferring that they would not actually need to be in contact with the water, ie they could be insulated from it. For example, the outer electrode could simply be aluminium foil wrapped around the cell container, so not in contact with the water. Whilst the other electrode could be sitting within the water, with or without insulation - it wouldn't matter.

You guys seem to be struggling with a few basic facts here... and I'm really at a loss as to why.

Firstly, as we've discussed numerous times, tap water is not high resistance - it readily conducts. I'm not sure from where you are getting the misconception that it is some phenomenal dielectric.

In fact given it will conduct from around just 2 volts, how do you expect a high voltage to build up on the ss electrodes.  You talk about the water as a dielectric breaking down, well it's not a dielectric at all is it if it effectively breaks down with around just 2 volts!! How can you possibly conceive of charging the electrodes up to apparently thousands of volts when just applying a mere 2 volts will cause the water to conduct!  Think about it - please consider ohms law for a moment.

It's like trying to fill a bucket up from a tap, when the bucket has a great big hole in it, as fast as the water goes in, it comes out of the hole - you can never fill the bucket up.

Capacitors will block dc, our tap water cell won't!  Surely you can see this?

I don't expect everyone to take everything I say as a given, but most of what I'm saying is quite easy to verify.  However, for some reason or another you seem to simply choose to ignore it altogether.

If you guys really think that tap water is such a good insulator, why do you think that bathrooms have pull cord light and shower switches rather than wall plate switches?  Why are shavers plugged into dedicated shaver sockets in a bathroom... why isn't there a standard 3-pin mains socket in there?

[WilbyInebriated]

When I said the electrodes would not need to be actually in the water if voltage alone was able to produce gas, I was of course inferring that they would not actually need to be in contact with the water, ie they could be insulated from it. For example, the outer electrode could simply be aluminium foil wrapped around the cell container, so not in contact with the water. Whilst the other electrode could be sitting within the water, with or without insulation - it wouldn't matter.

is this proven?

stiffler has some very creative ways to evolve gas that aren't the norm.
single wire electrolysis.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuMMp3KK9gI&feature=channel
one electrode electrolysis http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_yOSDVJ1vY&feature=channel_page
heavy oxygen, no can't be  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktHaAIKPOCo&feature=channel
not much gas evolution but principle is proven.

[newbie123]

heavy oxygen, no can't be  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktHaAIKPOCo&feature=channel
not much gas evolution but principle is proven.

He says that oxygen isn't forming, but that isn't accurate (and in reality impossible)......   Oxygen is forming but instead of bubbling up, it is most likely forming an oxide layer on the electrode, then falling off....        Stifler seems quick to jump to conclusions at times.    Cool experiment though.