HHO Cell - Stan Meyer Design.

[Farrah Day]

Well you have me confused there SM

You initially seem to be saying, 'yes' it can be done, and then by way of your own experiments say that 'no' it can't - or least you couldn't achieve it. So I'm a bit mystified by your post.  When I was talking about 'work' I was referring to voltage doing the work of evolving gases.

Anyway, the most obvious, in-your-face problem is of course that normal tap water conducts from just a very low voltage. There is not much of a dielectric to break down is there... it's a good conductor.

Furthermore if it was simply about voltage pulling the water molecule apart then, yes, all we would need to do would be to insulate one electrode from the water itself.  This way you could build very high potentials up on the plates. But we both know this does not work. Voltage alone will not cause the water molecule to split and reform into H and O.

That said, I do believe that fluctuating electric fields will encourage the water to ionise into OH- and H+ (no free floating electrons).

The real question is where do you go from there?  How and where do you get the resulting H3O+ and OH- to exchange charges to become H and O?

Answer: You need a current flow between the electrodes.

Peter, I'm curious as to why you would want to 'soften' the pulses.  You seem convinced voltage alone will work, in fact you state, 'work it actually does'. I must say, I admire your optimism - I just hope you're not putting too much faith in Meyer's Technical Brief, as like many you might find yourself coming down to earth with a bit of a bump in the near future.

Don't get me wrong though, my apparent negativity is not aimed a WFC technology itself, but rather the credibility of Meyer and his Technical Briefs.

[supermuble]

I understand the basic principles, but obviously don't know enough to continue working. Lets be clear, I enjoy learning about this, but I am stumped about where to go from here. 

Meyer said that voltage potential alone does split water, and the free electrons are stripped from the water molecule, providing sustained current at the moment of molecular failure (water splitting). Breaking down the water provides free electricity and free hydrogen... If only I knew how to do it. Meyer said the current would only flow when the water was split apart, however since free electrons are literally created from scratch when the water splits, it means you get FREE current, so no input current is really needed. (If only I knew how to do this?)

The water can BE SALT WATER, 100% conductive. The chromium oxides that form on the stainless steel, which is white, and or grey/black is actually the dielectric (not the water). The conditioning takes place which makes one of the electrodes into an insulator. If you don't condition then you don't get any voltage to build. Conditioning has to take place with unidirectional current. Meyer said "unidirectional" pulses. From my studies I've found that the metal plates naturally want to turn into diodes, blocking current flow the more you use them with regular tap water, but you must use basic straight DC current, or pulsed DC, not AC.

Anyway I have some knowledge but even so, I feel completely lost because I cannot see how anyone could possibly condition the plates good enough, or come up with enough electrical power to build 15,000 volts in between the tubes/plates. I don't have enough copper wire to build an inductive coil big enough to provide that sort of power. Perhaps the water spark plug guys and their CDI (capacitor discharge) ignitions would be helpful in providing a huge burst of energy that might charge these things up and help overcome the losses.

[peterpierre]

Maybe try to build that charge with the induction coil from a car, the voltages produced out of 12V in reach easily 15kV to 20kV but I would be careful at that point because you might have a unpleasant side effect such as arching and explosive discharges LOL ... I believe water capacitor is charged up to infinite high voltages using secondary output no higher than 400V to 600V at max. ... even those values might be to high ... might be as little as 300V but I'll start out with 400 and see if the darn cell will explode on me LOL

[newbie123]

I understand the basic principles, but obviously don't know enough to continue working. Lets be clear, I enjoy learning about this, but I am stumped about where to go from here. 

Meyer said that voltage potential alone does split water, and the free electrons are stripped from the water molecule, providing sustained current at the moment of molecular failure (water splitting). Breaking down the water provides free electricity and free hydrogen... If only I knew how to do it. Meyer said the current would only flow when the water was split apart, however since free electrons are literally created from scratch when the water splits, it means you get FREE current, so no input current is really needed. (If only I knew how to do this?)

The water can BE SALT WATER, 100% conductive. The chromium oxides that form on the stainless steel, which is white, and or grey/black is actually the dielectric (not the water). The conditioning takes place which makes one of the electrodes into an insulator. If you don't condition then you don't get any voltage to build. Conditioning has to take place with unidirectional current. Meyer said "unidirectional" pulses. From my studies I've found that the metal plates naturally want to turn into diodes, blocking current flow the more you use them with regular tap water, but you must use basic straight DC current, or pulsed DC, not AC.

Anyway I have some knowledge but even so, I feel completely lost because I cannot see how anyone could possibly condition the plates good enough, or come up with enough electrical power to build 15,000 volts in between the tubes/plates. I don't have enough copper wire to build an inductive coil big enough to provide that sort of power. Perhaps the water spark plug guys and their CDI (capacitor discharge) ignitions would be helpful in providing a huge burst of energy that might charge these things up and help overcome the losses.

I've conditioned tubes till the whole gap (1.5mm)  was filled with white oxide..  I never saw any voltage build up,  and the oxide layer in water is not a dielectric at all.

[supermuble]

Newbie, if your oxide is not working, then you have chemicals in the water that is damaging the oxide when it is being created (Just a guess).

Here is an example. Take baking soda and mix it with water. Put two aluminum plates in the water. Now slowly introduce voltage to it. You won't be able to pass a bit of current after about 10 minutes. Now, plug 120 volts AC to the plates, the plates won't flow any voltage at all. You see, the oxide (aluminum oxide) is a dielectric, it does not conduct electricity, and it is in CONDUCTIVE soda bath. Pretty fun experiment. You can charge up aluminum plates because aluminum oxide forms a true water capacitor. The plates will block 99% of the current, so you can charge the thing up as long as you want. Stainless steel forms a similar oxide, but you have to have the right chemicals in the water to get the oxide. I think some chemicals destroy the oxide before it can be formed, or it forms incorrectly. I don't have much experience because I don't have patience trying to condition stainless. And therein lies my confusion. I don't see how Stan got high voltage with stainless? With Aluminum YES, but not with stainless.