Joule Thief

[jeanna]

I did something sounding similar to what you describe - them being 180 to one another - I've been calling it a linear transformer because it's just two wires tightly twisted together without a toroid or any core.

@all,  the latest edition of Nuts and Volts as a DC to DC converter which utilizes a a toroid in a similar fashion that the joule thief is built.

Egads words just confuse more than help.

Hi jadaro,
Did I see it in one of your pics?

When Mark made his MK1, he literally split the bifilar element of the joule thief and put the 2 parts at the opposite ends of the toroid. (His reason was to eliminate a dead or at least low voltage spot that happened at the mid-place)

Then he wound the pair of secondaries on either side of these wires. I just called these wires the joule thief wires.

When you make one of the MK series, you need to connect the plus end of one side of these joule thief wires to the minus end of the other side. I called it twist.

He called his pair of secondaries "pick up coils" to be less confusing.
---

Now, If I saw what you are talking about, it is a tightly twisted string of wire twisted like 2 ply twine. I expect this to have some effect and I am wondering if you have studied what?

The folks on Time chatter who make and use time machines use this kind of twist in their sonic resonator machines. They call it caduceus coil.(I don't think it is a good name but you will see the time reference if you search for it.) I think your name linear transformer sounds closer???

--

Do you agree that this thing described in nuts and volts is a dc to dc converter?
I wonder how, since the joule thief makes ac from the dc.
I wonder what they are trying to say?

thank you,

jeanna

[Koen1]

Ok guys, thanks for all the helpfull tips and good advice

I'm sorry for all the fuss, I shall shut up for a bit and
just start all over. Whipe the breadboard, pick
a new core and wind again.
I'll keep it very simple this time; If I want to charge
some AAs I don't really need much volts anyway,
so I'll do 6 identical 5-turn coils, two opposing ones for
the basic JT and 4 Pickup coils. (thanks for that one Mike,
that gets rid of the confusion completely )
If I can dig up some good diodes I'll put them on there,
but as a start I'l just use a few LEDs. See what I get
on my caps.
I can always connect two pickups on one side together in
series to see what happens... Transformer theory says
it'll double the voltage of one single pickup... but we'll see

Suggestions as to what caps, diodes, and anything else
(# of turns on pickups, placing??? of pickups) are most welcome

Thanks again!

Regards,
Koen

[TheNOP]

@theNop: Yes, in theory it would have a slight effect since there is still induction going on
in the shorted coil. If the resistance of this coil is smaller than that of the circuitry
connected to the non-shorted coil, then there will definately be current running through
the short, and this current uses some of the total power that was input by the primary coil.
But if you don't short the coil and leave it disconnected, there is no current path and
there will be a lot less inductive effect.
Not that it matters because we aren't talking about shorted or disconnected coils,
we're talking about a second secondary with a load, similar to the first secondary.
So that's simply two secondaries with the same load which equals one secondary
that is twice as long and has two loads attached... Or doesn't it?

Anyway, it is possible that the time frame thing is what IST was trying to say...
But then it is still not very clear... After all, doesn't the transformer concept
use the same principle? The energy put into the system during a relatively long
span is concentrated into a higher energy level over a shorter span, and this results
in what we can measure as relative voltage increase with amp decrease or vice versa...?
Isn't that exactly what I've been whining about these past couple of posts?
Or have I not had enough coffee yet and am I just being silly here?

what does a step up transformer do ?
it make volts higher at the detriment of amps.

what does happend if you put multiple coils, that step up all to same voltage, in parallel ?

put a resistor on one of the coil if you want instead of shorting it, it is the same.

about time frame, maybe an analogy will help understand it.
take 1 pound, lift it 1 foot high, you have apply xx joules of energy to lift it that high in xx millisecond.
now let it drop, it take x to hit the ground.

apply the same force on the same 1 pound for xx time 2
let it drop, it take xx time 2 to hit the ground.

there will be a difference when it will hit the ground...

with a cap, the discharge is instantanious, it can be compare to that 1 pound crushing deep into the ground as the velocity would be so high.

there is no excess energy at this point or is it ? 


@Goat
About the capacitive coupling when using only one wire.
it does not matter from where the electrons come from, simply add more capacitance will make the light brighter.
think of it as if you were adding a capacitor between the light leg and your other wire.
it will still draw on the battery.



@all
for those having problems with Gadget RC mod.
here something that will be helpfull to you when knowing that the frequency at witch the jt work is making a lots of difference, the on time as well as the off.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RLC_circuit

i had fairly good results with that mod, but still, not good enough for my liking.
it just need a bit more tuning and better transistors then what i have available right now.

[jadaro2600]

Egads words just confuse more than help.

Hi jadaro,
Did I see it in one of your pics?

...

The folks on Time chatter who make and use time machines use this kind of twist in their sonic resonator machines. They call it caduceus coil.(I don't think it is a good name but you will see the time reference if you search for it.) I think your name linear transformer sounds closer???

...

Do you agree that this thing described in nuts and volts is a dc to dc converter?
I wonder how, since the joule thief makes ac from the dc.
I wonder what they are trying to say?

thank you,

jeanna

The linear transformer I used is described here - with picture.  http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=6123.msg160975#msg160975  It about 16 inches long strand of two-ply wire in red.  Actually, this setup is very strange to me, so I'll have to redo it.  This is actually a strobe circuit.

Calling it a caduceus coil is probably a misnomer.  This would imply that they are actually connected at one end - these run opposite direction - it would be more like a double Ouroboros ...like Auryn from the never ending story.

The nuts and volts dc to dc converter is a complicated junker.  too many circuit components to be even remotely efficient.  There is quite a bit of math and technical information about how to choose a ferrite core and how many windings are needed, etc.

[innovation_station]

your answer is    trial and error

we call this tuneing it 

ist!!

when you find the best for your core you do what you like with it ....