Legalities of selling free energy generators

[PaulLowrance]

Someone recently told me to be careful in selling a "free energy" generator because of the legalities, such as getting the device UL approved. This was very disappointing to me because I don't have the $$$ to get UL approved!

This person did have one good advice, sell the "free energy" generators as kits. So after some searching and asking people questions, there's good news! Another person said I could sell *completed* devices, but simply require a signed agreement from the buyer! So when you sell enough generators, then get UL listed because it's very expensive. This person said signed agreements hold a lot more weight in the court of law, at least in the USA. Not sure about other countries.

Furthermore, the second advice given to me was to set up a corporation-- the "corporate veil."  It is not easy to break the "corporate veil." So if you're sued, then it's against the corporation, *not you*!  Here in California the state fee to get a corporation is $115. And for another $30 to $40 you can buy a Do-It-Yourself kit to get a corporation.   Maybe there are free do-it-yourself kits on the Internet.

Here's the message from this guy who posts in EE forums -->

+++++++++++
IANAL, but I suspect the sales of such a converter (without UL certification) is in no way illegal.  Heck, people sell stuff like 2.4GHz or 27MHz RF
amplifiers or non-cell-blocked RF receivers all the time, and everyone knows
darned well that 99% of the buyers are going to be *using* such equipment in
an illegal manual, yet the sellers are often left alone if they do a good
enough job of describing their goods as "test equipment" or similar.  In your
case, there's not even any particular attractoin to use such a device in an
illegal manner.

That being said, if someone buys your product, it starts on fire and burns
their house down, you almost certainly will be sued these days.  You can add
as many disclaimers as you want to the product, but that won't prevent your
loss of time and money when you're forced to win your case in court.  I would
guess that about the only effective way to prevent much of this would be to
get a *written* agreement from potential customers that you're providing no
guarantees, the product is not UL listed, etc., since they it should be a
pretty much open-and-shut court case should the issue ever arise (unlike
"click-through" or shrinkwrap licenses, signed agreements hold a lot more
weight).

Alternatively, figure out how to set up a real corporation somehow, so that --
worst case -- the corporation is sued out of existance, but your personal
well-being is largely untouchable.  (The "corporate veil" and all that --
unless *gross* negligence can be demonstrated, you're safe.)
+++++++++++


What do you think?  Any other helpful advice is greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Paul

[sushimoto]

Someone recently told me to be careful in selling a "free energy" generator because of the legalities, such as getting the device UL approved. This was very disappointing to me because I don't have the $$$ to get UL approved!

This person did have one good advice, sell the "free energy" generators as kits. So after some searching and asking people questions, there's good news! Another person said I could sell *completed* devices, but simply require a signed agreement from the buyer! So when you sell enough generators, then get UL listed because it's very expensive. This person said signed agreements hold a lot more weight in the court of law, at least in the USA. Not sure about other countries.

Furthermore, the second advice given to me was to set up a corporation-- the "corporate veil."  It is not easy to break the "corporate veil." So if you're sued, then it's against the corporation, *not you*!  Here in California the state fee to get a corporation is $115. And for another $30 to $40 you can buy a Do-It-Yourself kit to get a corporation.   Maybe there are free do-it-yourself kits on the Internet.

<SNIP>

What do you think?  Any other helpful advice is greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Paul

Hey Paul,
this is a good thread because of that issue, which could have an tremendous impact.
I already have investigated and written a lot about your toppic.
Maybe i will collect it and post it here, if interested.

Such a device is affecting almost every aspect of our world as we know.

The advice, spreading kits and plans over the internet is primarily  very good.
All Paperwork including patents are absolutely worthless and are leading to no success.
Involving any industry, lawyers, financial companies, government or academic institutions are leading to no success.

All these structures of the "old economy" are not interested in changing the current economy,
because of its dependence on oil-and electricity business.
If you have a "black-box" with a powerplug for everybody's Independence from the grid,
you will be treated like a terrorist, destroying the world.
Which, in fact, is not true for humanity and humankind.
But it will destroy parts of economy as we know today.

Our big advantage is  the internet, were we can reach a lot of people worldwide in 10 seconds.
That cannot be suppressed.

Selling such stuff (kits, plans, books, devices) in the first impact, will also lead to no success,
because there already is a lot of fraud sold out there.
Nobody will spent another dime for another claim of FE.

Once verified by a mass, this guy will get rich and famous anyway.
Ghandi has never asked for money. But he changed a lot and earned a lot of money.
It was his decision to give the money away for humanity..
At least, its a historical honor to be the "Ghandi of Energy"

best,
sushimoto

[PaulLowrance]

Hey Paul,
this is a good thread because of that issue, which could have an tremendous impact.
I already have investigated and written a lot about your toppic.
Maybe i will collect it and post it here, if interested.

Such a device is affecting almost every aspect of our world as we know.

The advice, spreading kits and plans over the internet is primarily  very good.
All Paperwork including patents are absolutely worthless and are leading to no success.
Involving any industry, lawyers, financial companies, government or academic institutions are leading to no success.

All these structures of the "old economy" are not interested in changing the current economy,
because of its dependence on oil-and electricity business.
If you have a "black-box" with a powerplug for everybody's Independence from the grid,
you will be treated like a terrorist, destroying the world.
Which, in fact, is not true for humanity and humankind.
But it will destroy parts of economy as we know today.

Our big advantage is  the internet, were we can reach a lot of people worldwide in 10 seconds.
That cannot be suppressed.

Selling such stuff (kits, plans, books, devices) in the first impact, will also lead to no success,
because there already is a lot of fraud sold out there.
Nobody will spent another dime for another claim of FE.

Once verified by a mass, this guy will get rich and famous anyway.
Ghandi has never asked for money. But he changed a lot and earned a lot of money.
It was his decision to give the money away for humanity..
At least, its a historical honor to be the "Ghandi of Energy"

best,
sushimoto

Yes, please post the info you've accumulated!

I think the exact details to build the entire machine should first be *freely* published. The 1st day should be spent demonstrating the device to people in your neighborhood. You could demo and hand out papers to thousands of people per day. The paper would include everything, such as building the machine.

Also the paper could include kits for sale by the inventor for people who don't want to buy parts from dozens of different companies. Also the inventor could sell completed prefabricated devices for people who aren't interested in building it.

A live demo is far more convincing then an Internet post-- no comparison!!!  Then toward the *end* of the 1st day I would post everything online. Sorry, but *all* "free energy" forums will be the *last* place to see the designs. Such websites are obviously the best place to monitor for such a post on the "grand smoking gun." I don't need to take *any* chance of a bullet in my head upon 10 minutes of posting the "grand smoking gun" to this website thank you very much!!!

After that, it might be a good idea to try to get tv stations to view live demos.

BTW, once it's certain that it is a "grand smoking gun," then don't wait a single day. Do not wait to buy lots of parts. If someone wants to buy the machine, they'll have to wait for your parts to arrive. You can order lots of the parts on the 2nd day.

The 2nd day I would spend the $150 or is $200 to get a provisionary patent! I don't care what anyone tells you. If you don't get a patent, then expect to spend court time trying to defend your invention. For Pete's sake USA inventors, please spend the $200 to get a provisional patent. You can do it online. I wouldn't wait more than 1 day to do it!

BTW, is setting up a corporation better than an LLC?

Global Free Energy in 2009!
PL

[broli]

Here's my advice. Sell the loose part as a kit, state it's for research and testing only (agreeing to a disclaimer should be enough), open a donation link, give the plans away for free. Simple isn't it. If you want to get rich please search for another hobby.

[nitinnun]

NEVER tell the legal system the truth.
they heavily penalize the truth.



instead, say that you are selling "entertainment devices".

and they do not produce electricity.
they produce happy energy.



that is how they get away with widespread p orn, in california.

they are not "being paid to have s ex".
they are "being paid for acting".

they do the s ex for free.
but get paid for the "acting".



the legal system is as insane and blind as the illuminati themselves.

lady justice is blindfolded,
because she is as blind to reality,
as they are.

lady liberty holds the scales,
because the scales have been secretly weighted,
towards whatever outcome the illuminati/dark-clowns desire.



i plan to build and sell mostly wooden cars.
driven by brushless induction motors. like the ones tesla built.
which are powered by gravity, VIA a waterfall generator.


BUT.
i will not be selling "cars".

or even "electricical parts",
that the UL will ***-**** my bank account over, to have approved.


i will be selling the customer a pile of "raw materials".
which i will "assemble" for them, into a vehicle.

i will BUILD the vehicle, FOR FREE !
(the expenses, are in the price of the "raw materials").


it should be legally impossible to stop someone,
from buying materials at a hardware store,
then selling them elsewhere for more.

and equally impossible,
to stop someone from building something,
FOR FREE.


it is possible for the dark clowns to buy from you,
then try to sue you for this or that bull****.

but i don't know how they could.
since what you are doing, is legally undetectible.



the dark clowns are in very, very serious trouble.
for the endless number of bad things, that they have done.


even if there are no pleiadians or spiritual hierarchy to punish them,
than there is still a pissed off population, who is rapidly catching onto them.

and a dying corrupt system, which can no longer protect them from revenge.


maybe once they die this time, they will get send to 2D as punishment.
where they will constantly be terrorized by wild demon-animals.

which don't give one shit about their 3D rules and regulations.


the dark clowns will be forced to use their non-existant emotions, for survival.
with their logical thought being greatly hindered down there.