Sjack Abeling Gravity Wheel and the Worlds first Weight Power Plant

[fletcher]

Fletcher
Just so I understand your point?

You feel that both balls are crossing the "finish line " at the same velocity?

And if they are not [the one traveling the longer path "faster"].

There is something "hokey" here, or I just don't know my physics?

I will not be offended by your response.

Thank you Chet

PS I see your response above,you feel all things being equal ,what these vids are showing is "impossible"?

Yes Chet - to be perfectly clear both balls "arrive" with the same velocity - the one that got there earlier by taking the longer track does NOT have a greater velocity - it's average velocity is greater so it gets there more quickly but with NO extra energy from excess velocity.

A simple way to test this is to have both balls run out along a track - video  it & calculate the across the finishing line speeds OR have the balls impact something that stores or measures Kinetic Energy & see if there is a significant difference - you won't find one.

Here's a quick pic to demonstrate the principle - should be self explanatory to all but omnibus.

Omnibus - go back to school.

[overtaker]

If at the end of both ramps we replaced the basket with a ramp.  Which ball would climb higher? 

Omnibus,  If there is a great energy gain than the ball should be able to climb higher than it's starting point.  This won't happen.

[ramset]

Fletcher
Quote:
Yes Chet - to be perfectly clear both balls "arrive" with the same velocity - the one that got there earlier by taking the longer track does NOT have a greater velocity - it's average velocity is greater so it gets there more quickly but with NO extra energy from excess velocity.
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While my eyes are telling me that one is faster[more KE],I know this can not be true,
Thank you for taking the time to answer!
Somehow I know the"Buss" is not done with this.
although I believe the "audio" on one of the vids did mention the balls coming to "Rest" eventually at the same spot.
Thanks
Chet

[overtaker]

Fletcher,  Do you have to factor in the friction of the ramps?
For instance if both ramps have considerable friction, the ball on a slight incline will be slowed more so than one on a very steep incline.  Am I correct?

[Omnibus]

Yes Chet - to be perfectly clear both balls "arrive" with the same velocity - the one that got there earlier by taking the longer track does NOT have a greater velocity - it's average velocity is greater so it gets there more quickly but with NO extra energy from excess velocity.

That's nonsense. Whether or not the two balls "arrive" with the same velocity is irrelevant. The important obvious fact remains--"it's average velocity is greater" which means, contrary to your understanding, that its energy is extra due to the excess velocity. Indeed, kinetic energy is only a function of velocity (at a given mass) and of nothing else. One ball exhibits higher velocity and therefore has greater kinetic energy than the other ball.

A simple way to test this is to have both balls run out along a track - video  it & calculate the across the finishing line speeds OR have the balls impact something that stores or measures Kinetic Energy & see if there is a significant difference - you won't find one.

On the contrary. As seen in the videos, one ball arrives sooner that the oter ball, even though it's traveling along a longer path. Get used to this fact.

Here's a quick pic to demonstrate the principle - should be self explanatory to all but omnibus.

Omnibus - go back to school.

The discussed fact from the videos is a physical, not mathematical finding. Conservation of energy (CoE) is discussed by physics, not mathematics. Mathematics only helps to find the shape of the trajectory, as here illustrated. Physics, on the other hand, determines violation of CoE because of the obvious appearance of extra kinetic energy in the ball moving along the curved path compared to the energy of the ball moving along the straight path--kinetic energy is only a function of velocity and mass, impact or no impact. Learn this.

Fletcher, go back to school. Learn what kinetic energy really is (it's only a function of v and m and of nothing else, contrary to your misunderstanding expecting impact may have something to do with it) and what the role of mathematics is when discussing physics problems. Don't try to foist on the reader mathematical variational solutions regarding trajectory as if they are self-explanatory solutions of physical problems concerning conservation of energy.