Stator and Rotor how to make help needed!

[infringer]

As far as the keeping the mags in place maybe if glue then glass or possibly use some screws along each side of the magnet or what about using magnetic shielding aluminum foil  or something IDK this does provide quite a risk to take on... there has got to be some way to assure that the magnets do not smack together they tend to bust when that happens at least from my expirence and being 145lbs of pull force it is a nice way to break a finger indeed... But I figure the stronger the magnet the better the power output good thing I did not go with them 300lb mags though the thought crossed my mind...

[Michelinho]

Hi Infringer,

I am in no way an expert on alternator DIY but I'll try to answer a few of your questions. 

Why must you use steel for the magnetic rotor why could you not glass the magnets right into the wood as they sit?

Placing a steel rotor behind your magnets, you get a more powerful magnetic flux between your facing N-S or S-N magnet poles. That I have checked with a Gauss meter. It helps to concentrate the flux between the steel plates and not all over the place.

Bridge rectifiers where can I find some dependable rectifiers and the other electronics I need to convert the 3 phase to DC and what exactly do I need could you provide me with parts and links for the electronics obviously I will need a charge controller to disburse the power from the rectifiers into the batteries but I guess I want to do this cheaply but provide maximal power output ...

In Canada, I get them from a reputable outlet,  http://digikey.ca/ the USA site is http://www.digikey.com/ . You could get them from EBay but you may get those from China and you may get crap. The rating depends on the maximum amp output from your coils or phases. They are not very expensive so why take a chance. If your alternator will output say 12V 120 amps in 3 phases, put a safety margin of 50% and go for 3 60 amps for a 3 phases setup. But by the size you mention, I would go for a 24V setup and you have to consider that for your charge controller and inverters and it will also reduce your wire size gauge from the windmill to the controller..

I bought my charge controller from EBay and got a nice Xantrex C60 (60 amps) 12/24V with the LCD display for $171.00 delivered at my place, saved over $100.00. The 2 inverters also come from EBay and are rated at 1800 Watts and a max of 3500 Watts MSW (modified sine wave not true sine waves $$$$) for $51.00 and $71.00 plus ~$15.00 shipping (I have a US shipping address).

Other things to tackle are how to properly wind coils my guess is if you had 12 coils there would be 4 coils per phase to keep it a 3 phase setup.

Mine is a 12 coils 12 phases as I use one rectifier bridge per coil and can later hook them in series or parallel or series/parallel to work with 12V or 24V depending on the speed the alternator will operate. For 12 coils there would be 4 coils per phase to keep it a 3 phase setup. That is right.

My other question is would you not be able to use 3 of these 4 prong bridge rectifiers to keep them cooler say one for each phase instead of how it is pictured or is it only possible to use two of these ?

As I said above, one for each phase is better plus you have to mount them on heat sinks as they get hot and they don't get a break when the batteries are full as your charge controller will divert your output to a resistive load which can be a 12V car heater or more to disperse the energy.

Beautiful Newman replication to say the least as well!

Thanks.

I'll try to help as much as I can but read the 3 pages from the link above, they have done many and are well done.

Take care,

Michel

[Michelinho]

Re Infringer,

If you go for a Savonius design, you can use a carbon fiber, fiberglass or wood rotor as the coils are around the rotor. Not sure what is the minimum spacing of the magnets/coils though.

All of the above still apply, iron behind the magnets will increase the strength of the flux and give you more inertia in fluctuating wind.

Take care,

Michel

P.S.: In the study of the Bedini window motor, we found that all North or all South facing the coils produce more output. So experiment before putting the glue... The iron behind the magnets will be of help but put a wood spacer between the magnets and iron before the final setup.

[Michelinho]

Re Infringer,

Wind your coils the bifilar way, 50% increase amp output for the same voltage. 

Take care,

Michel

P.S.: Now you know as much as I do... LOL

[Michelinho]

Hi Infringer,

I checked the Savonius design and found this:

http://mb-soft.com/public/wind.html

What I Consider to be a Savonius Rotor!
Top View - Savonius (Drawing is a top view of a completed Savonius)

For these reasons, I tend to have a "lower-cost-approach" to wind-generated electricity! Specifically, there is one version of the Savonius rotor which is the ONLY one that I have ever built or used (maybe 15 or 20 of them over the years). When I refer to a Savonius Rotor, I therefore refer to ONLY the following: Get an old 55-gallon drum. Draw a line completely around it, to be able to saw it apart into two exactly identical half-drums (vertically). The two halves will then resemble two rocker baby cribs. I generally use a Sabre saw with a fine-toothed metal cutting blade, and it makes a LOT of noise!

The two halves are stood up (as though they were still actual drums) where their one cut edge is nearlly touching each other, but the two are facing opposite directions. You should see the INSIDE of one half drum and the OUTSIDE of the other, whichever side you look from. Then place a 36" length of 1x1x1/8 angle iron (or larger) on top of the two and across both. Drill some holes in the tops of the drum-halves and the angle, and use 1/4" bolts to securely attach the angle iron to the drum halves. I use lock washers to make sure the bolts will not loosen from vibration.

Flip it over and mount a second piece of angle iron on the other end of the drum-halves. THAT is pretty much it! How much did this cost? Well, I have always found drums for free, because a lot of people want to discard them. The angle iron and bolts might be around $4, so that is the total cost of the Savonius that I call a Savonius!

I generally drill a 9/16" hole through the very center of both the top and bottom angle piece. There can be merit in using slightly larger angle, as my holes drill away nearly the entire flange of the angle! But I then drive a length of 1" (or larger) water pipe into the ground, several feet. On the top, I get a pipe reducer down to 1/2" and I add a short piece of 1/2" water pipe, maybe a foot. I then get a 4 foot length of 1/2" solid steel rod. I put that rod into the 1/2" pipe at least 9 inches, and drill a small hole through the pipe and rod to secure it. Two might be better.

There is now the larger water pipe sticking up maybe 10 feet above the ground, with the 1/2" rod sticking about 3 feet above that. I then raise the Savonius assembly above it and lower the holes in the angles down over the vertical rod. I usually find salvage water pipe to drive into the ground, so this tower assembly often costs only around $5. The entire project therefore often costs around $10 total!

Yes, buying actual bearings can make sense, but this works fairly well as described, although it sometimes squeals due to metal friction! Given that the 55-gallon drum will likely only last two or three years before it rusts out, I found that my non-bearings never caused any of the angle irons to break from wear.

POINT: Since this entire assembly only cost me about $10, I never really needed massive amounts of electricity before it paid for itself! Since virtually NO other wind-generated electricity system has ever actually paid for its own cost, right there is a real advantage, the way I see it!

POINT: Since this Savonius and tower is so simple, easy, quick, and dirt-cheap to make, I tended to save up all the old barrels I could find, and convert them all into Savonius Rotors! Yes, there is a serious UGLINESS factor! (I did not have any close neighbors in any of three different locations I made them.)

Savonius We show another drawing here which shows both the benefit of a Savonius as well as its greatest disadvantage! The two lower arrows show the wind that is caught INSIDE the concave half of the Savonius, which then forces it to rotate around its central (vertical) shaft. This shows why it has such great torque, even at very low wind speeds.

The upper two arrows show the disadvantage. The oncoming wind hits the convex half of the Savonuis as well, and only its convex shape is what causes the air to be deflected sideways around it. If you think about it, the wind's effect on the two halves of the Savonius is not that different, same speed, same area, the only difference being the concave and convex shapes presented to the oncoming air. You probably see why a Savonius only has around 13% overall efficiency; much of the power that might be captured has to get used up pushing the convex half!

We will see below that such Savonius Rotors, combined with standard (used) GM car alternators, and the common 10 to 11 mph wind in the Midwest, can REALISTICALLY create maybe 7 watts (24 hours every day), then ten of these very cheap devices can produce 70 watts, or almost two kilowatt-hours per day. THAT is a useful amount of electricity! As long as you have lots of batteries to store it!


Not very efficient...

Take care,

Michel