I see an economic diasater coming...

[the_big_m_in_ok]

onthecuttingedge2005 said:

so far there has been no deaths or major symptoms of the current swine flu vaccine in clinical trials to my knowledge.

I've never, ever had the flu.
When I was a teenager in Calif., There was two years of bad flu epidemics in my state.  The first year, no one in my family got it, but the next time, they all got it except me.
I asked myself, "Why was that?"
It wasn't until I learned about the human gene CCR5delta32 that I may have found an answer.  A double deletion(important!) of the gene confers immunity to AIDS, Black Plague, hepatitis, (probably) tuberculosis and (possibly) the flu.  Why?  These diseases use a receptor in the nucleus of the white blood 'T' cells to gain access to the cell's interior, multiply there, and then destroy the cell.
(The gene is actually unnecessary in the body---no one really needs it live.)
Having neither of these genes as deletions from both your parents is the key.  If you have one deletion, you can last up to decades with AIDS, but you'll die eventually.  Everyone else in my family probably had one deletion each and were partially immune to the flu.  If I have both, I'm immune, which is why I don't get a flu shot every year.

The gene originated in Southern Scandinavia about 1,100-1,200 years ago and spread around mostly Northern Europe, the British Isles and Western Europe since then.  Since it originated there, other races in the world have a normal set of genes from their parents and are susceptible to the diseases mentioned above.
(There was a research paper written to this effect, but I would have to look for it on the Internet.)
Re-edit:
Here is one...

Dating the Origin of the AIDS Resistance Allele by the Coalescence of Haplotypes
Am J Hum Gene 62 (6):1507-15

American Journal of Human Genetics, Volume 62, issue #6, pgs. 1507-1515


--Lee

[exxcomm0n]

Now there are plenty of threads here about H1N1 and there is no reason to turn this one into another, but to address these recent posts about it since I seemed to be the one that introduced H1N1 into the topic (only as an aside), I'll give my last word to as why I may have below.

After this, could we please focus on the economic situation as the thread title suggests?


On the subject of the "flu"......

My "significant other" is an ICU nurse at an area hospital, and one of the more sane in our area.

After signing that she had "religious objection" to the regular flu shot, she (as well as everyone else, even non-ICU that abstains) now has to where a mask every shift of work from Oct. 1 to Feb. 1 (EDIT: errr....make that Apr. 1), and this is deemed a more "sane" hospital corporation because at least she only has to wear a mask.

The two other, larger hospital corporations in the area are threatening dismissal of workers for refusal to get a regular flu shot, let alone the H1N1 which is not available yet.

That seems a pretty serious trend towards forced vaccination even though your earning potential is used rather than political mandate.
You have to slowly corral the whole herd to before you can get them to march one by one into the chute.

News has always hyped the common flu and it's yearly coming, as it kills thousands per year that have weakened immune systems from already challenging pre-existing conditions like debilitation or extreme age.

So can the common cold.
So can any other viral or bacteriological illness.

The things that scares me about H1N1 vaccination is that National guard troops have not held training exercises for the effects of civil unrest due to vaccinations for the common cold or "regular" flu.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InX-0qvc2ww
(There is a more substantial Tube post of a local news story about training exercises but "YouTube is down for maintenance and will be back shortly." so I can't find it. Try this instead  http://www.sunjournal.com/node/105339)

There has also never been an international campaign of fear through media for them either.

There hasn't been the rush for a new (and unproven or tested) vaccine for them either, but there certainly seems to have been for H1N1.
http://www.who.int/csr/disease/swineflu/interactive_map/en/index.html

I would like onthecuttingedge2005 to post about these successful clinical trials, when they were performed, and by whom.

I would also like to ask where his statistical data of deaths vs. cases came from. I do not challenge those findings except to find out what health care organization compiled and released them as it would help greatly to validate them.

Let's take the Mexico numbers he posted as an example:

2000 to 2500 suspected cases approximately -
(which makes me wonder what percentage are confirmed, and what approximation was used.)

168 suspected deaths -  with less than 1/3 confirmed =  56 approx., so let's say 50.
(with less than 1/3 confirmed, at least something is reported as confirmed.)

50/2500 = 10/500 = 1/50 or 2% mortality of the suspected approximation of H1N1 cases.
1 out of every 50 persons suspected of contracting H1N1 will die in Mexico.

If you use the entire population numbers from:
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/mx.html instead though........

50/111,212,000 = 5/11121200 = 1/2224240 of the entire population which is a LOT less scary.

About the regular flu.......

This story from 2003:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/01/07/health/main535605.shtml
....says "Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported. Flu deaths now average about 36,000 a year, up from 20,000 in previous estimates, the CDC said."
According to http://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/disease/us_flu-related_deaths.htm this study was from data collected over a span from 1990 to 1999.

http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html says the TOTAL US population is at: 307,610,152 as of this morning, so using average mortality from 2003 against the approx. population of 2009 I get:

36000/307610000 = 36/307610 = 1/8545 approx. of the entire population, not reported cases.

If you take those numbers against the yearly reported cases from
http://www.flufacts.com/impact/statistics.aspx  of 25 million to 50 million you get:

36000/50000000 = 36/50000 = 1/1388 best case scenario.
36000/25000000 = 36/25000 = 1/694 worst case scenario.

According to those numbers it would seem that the common flu is far more dangerous in the USA than the H1N1 flu is in Mexico.
But all of these numbers are dependent on "suspected approximations" or reported cases.
There are no hard numbers when dealing with medical situations because of mis-diagnosis and unreported cases.

I know I shouldn't compare Mexico with the USA as there are many different factors that effect these numbers, but I'd expect mortality in Mexico to be higher than the USA in almost all situations.

But using those numbers above, it seems the amount of HYPE about the H1N1 is astronomical when compared to the "devil we know" common flu, doesn't it?

Now, can we get back to gov't stupidity and the weak faith in the idea of money here?

H1N1 was only one of the 3 reasons i thought self preparedness might be a good idea.

P.S. I just yesterday saw an article in the newspaper that said that Armed Forces were of the first to be getting vaccinated, and that IS mandatory.

[the_big_m_in_ok]

@exxcomm0n, with respect to your Post #136
The only thing further I'll say about the H1N1 Swine Flu is the the Gov't over-reaction to non-compliance against immunization points to something---in my opinion---ulterior in their stance.  This "stance", as I put it, can cause people to grip their weapons tighter as a result.
That reaction, if it happens, can cause a backlash amongst Americans that could hasten the "Collapse".  That's my point.

Otherwise, you're correct and I agree, the H1N1 conversation was an off topic distraction.  Enough said.

--Lee

[Cap-Z-ro]

Id say more of a different aspect of the same agenda than a distraction Lee.

Regards...

[exxcomm0n]

Lee,

I brought it into the discussion and so ultimately it is my fault.

It certainly has not been the only scare tactic within the last decade, but it is the most pervasive one.

My plea to return to the original topic was about it being a indicator, but not a reason for an entire post in this topic.
Then I made an entire post about it.

I apologize for bringing it into the discussion, and most of the blame should be centered upon me.