I see an economic diasater coming...

[Qwurky1]

What I find interesting about "democracy" (capitalism) is that it is based off of darwinism, which is basically ruthless and winner takes all.  True Communism, as Marx envisioned it, was rather naive and a pipe dream, because it assumes that humans have the ability to, as an entire planet/nation/town/neighborhood, give up the desire to possess a larger slice of the pie than anyone else.  Once anyone gains more than the others, that enables them to get still more... yada yada money is evil, blah blah.  Do any of you think humans will ever evolve to the point where we can actually want to share equally with each other?  I like to think we have the seed of selfessness and human unity within us, which is what Tesla tried to "spark" within us (sorry) with his devices designed to equalize social classes and conserve resources for the future, but for some reason nice guys always do seem to finish last.  Perhaps it's because the nice guys never expect to get jumped in the alley on the way to reinvent the world the way it should be.  Personally, if I were a sentient organism that had happened across this galactic backwater, I'd look at the human race as a life form that once had potential but degraded into a horrible disease, and maybe even set up exterminators to make sure we didn't spread out of this solar system and infect the rest of the universe.  blah blah speech over.  Otherwise we will have the "martians" working in sweatshops to make our cheap Nikes (joking) or try to nuke them because they "ain't natural" and are "abominations to god"  Power to the People, Viva Tesla!!

[WilbyInebriated]

I know all this.

and yet you still chose to post an irrelevant argument.

But, when the Chinese don't have any money like everyone else after the economic collapse, they'll act like all other communist states and impose their will militarily on others in their vicinity, regardless of the consequences.  The collapse will probably bring out the worst in people.  Look at movie, The Road, and see what can happen.  Several things can bring about collapse, and it can happen here or anywhere.  Why?  When people have no money, food, water, and warm winter shelter, they often become desperate like in various hotspots around the world.  Africa, the Middle East, Central America with floods and volcanos, etc.

your argument in this paragraph is a red herring. how is any of that relevant to the question of the level of chinese education?

lee, you are obviously confused here. let us recap...
saikron1 said:

china is now becoming richest country in the world... but they still dun have much on technology and majority the ppl there not really educated.

to which i replied:

china has more honor students than america has students, so does india... do the math, their coming dominance is inevitable.

that is a cogent argument... relative and strongly pointed out.

you then hopped on board with your irrelevant response to me:

Communism, as practiced today, doesn't work because of greed.  You can't spend someone else's money; it always runs out.
I know of only one exception:  An Israeli kibbutz.  And only because it's a small scale operation in terms of money.

Additionally, AIDS is going to take a heavy toll on the Chinese population in a generation or two.  Their Govt is avoiding the problem, to their detriment.

--Lee

this is not cogent and here is why. communism was never spoken of, by saikron1 or myself, and is irrelevant to the argument at hand. this is a logical fallacy, known as a red herring argument. you then followed that with another logical fallacy, your statement about aids. aids is also irrelevant (aids has nothing to do with how educated the chinese are) to the argument at hand.

Math?  Math has nothing to do with it

indeed. math has nothing to do with your logical fallacies... because they are irrelevant. lol.

I intended to indicate AIDS was a long term---very serious---problem, but an absolute fact that can cause, even by itself, an eventual collapse in 20-50 years if nothing else changes.  If not enough people are around to maintain a cultural society, there'll be no cultural society to exist.

There are some very serious problems becoming insurmountable in the future, regardless of what is attempted to solve those problems.  The European debt crisis in one example.  The Gulf oil spill fiasco is another.  America is traveling down the same road to the same result as Greece.  Is this cogent?

--Lee

aids is still irrelevant to the argument at hand...

the european debt crisis is another red herring... the gulf oil spill is another red herring... greece is another red herring... no! those aren't cogent! the argument at hand is about the chinese being educated... here, this might help you out. http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/
until you refrain from this repeated use of logical fallacy i'm afraid i will have to refuse to respond to you.


@qwurky1
well said. i fear as long as this asinine ideal of nationalism exists so pervasively around the globe nothing will change. you end up with guys like big_m here hating the 'damn pinko commie bastards', those who espouse communism hating the 'capitalist pigs', those who espouse fascism hating 'everybody'... ad infinitum, ad nauseam, ad absurdum.
george carlin said it wonderfully:

"I frankly don't give a fuck how it all turns out in this country - or anywhere else, for that matter. I think the human game was up a long time ago (when the high priests and traders took over), and now we're just playing out the string. And that is, of course, precisely what I find so amusing: the slow circling of the drain by a once promising species, and the sappy, ever-more-desperate belief in this country that there is actually some sort of "American Dream," which has merely been msiplaced.

The decay and disintegration of this culture is astonishingly amusing if you are emotionally detached from it. I have always viewed it from a safe distance, knowing I don't belong; it doesn't include me, and it never has. No matter how you care to define it, I do not indentify with the local group. Planet, species, race, nation, state, religion, party, union, club, association, neighborhood, improvement committee;I have no interest in any of it. I love and treasure individuals as I meet them, I loathe and despise the groups they identify with and belong to.

So, if you read something in this book that sounds like advocacy of a particular political point of view, please reject the notion. My interest in "issues" is merely to point out how badly we're doing, not to suggest a way we might do better. Don't confuse me with those who cling to hope. I enjoy describing how things are, I have no interest in how they "ought to be." And I certainly have no interest in fixing them. I sincerely believe that if you think there's a solution, you're part of the problem. My motto: Fuck Hope!

[triffid]

I am back from my three week trip now but have no internet connection at home due to a massive virus infection(&*%$!!!).I attended my 40 year high school reunion while on my trip.I am sending this post from a public library.I hope to say more later.triffid

[the_big_m_in_ok]

and yet you still chose to post an irrelevant argument. ::)your argument in this paragraph is a red herring. how is any of that relevant to the question of the level of chinese education?

lee, you are obviously confused here. let us recap...
saikron1 said:to which i replied:that is a cogent argument... relative and strongly pointed out.

Oh? Confused?
Did you read the title of this thread?  It's:  I see an economic disaster coming... (I realized I misspelled it in the title, but this software doesn't spell-check thread titles).
I implied, in my response to WilbyInebriated, that I thought, or intended to say, Chinese education was irrelevant to their survival.  It is irrelevant.
He said:

china has more honor students than america has students, so does india... do the math, their coming dominance is inevitable.

So what?  So they're educated.  An economic collapse would deprive the Communist government of their self-motivated, coveted power to impose their will on people, and they would lose a lot of 'face' in the process.  Being educated won't help them survive; there are just more of them (the Chinese) than us.  For now.  That can, and will, change.  I can tell you why, if you're interested.  Are you?

you then hopped on board with your irrelevant response to me:this is not cogent and here is why. communism was never spoken of, by saikron1 or myself, and is irrelevant to the argument at hand. this is a logical fallacy, known as a red herring argument. you then followed that with another logical fallacy, your statement about aids. aids is also irrelevant (aids has nothing to do with how educated the chinese are) to the argument at hand.
indeed. math has nothing to do with your logical fallacies... because they are irrelevant. lol.
aids is still irrelevant to the argument at hand...

Okay, I concede that point.  Communism is money-oriented and greedy, but that can be part of their undoing economically, which is the subject of this thread.  They're responsible for acting the way they do.

the european debt crisis is another red herring... the gulf oil spill is another red herring... greece is another red herring... no! those aren't cogent! the argument at hand is about the chinese being educated...

Oh? Why are they 'red herrings'? The Europeans are digging themselves into a money hole too deep for them to get out of---and this country is exposed to part of that debt.  It's not a (huge!) amount of money, but trickle-down foreign trade amounts to more money than that and American jobs can be affected badly in the future.
The oil spill?  It's already costing a lot of money and more than 100,000 jobs are at stake.  Commercial fishing, recreational fishing, crab harvesting, oyster harvesting, crawfish harvesting, tourism, and then there's support industries.  For the Gulf States, is up to $60,000,000,000/yr.
The potential loss of this revenue isn't significant to these people?  I think it is.  The whole "Recovery" could go into a double-dip downturn.
Greece?  Not relevant?  Without confidence in the banking system, a monetary crisis could---and probably will---cause a collapse of the euro.  The Europeans are avoiding an economic problem which California is also in now.  Greece is the "Canary in the Coal Mine."  What happens to them will happen to America eventually.  They have grave problems they don't want to face yet---and some, or many, Californians think the same way.

here, this might help you out. http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

until you refrain from this repeated use of logical fallacy i'm afraid i will have to refuse to respond to you.
This thread was intended to be an archive of those articles which I and others could support the reporting of the imminent collapse as a possible warning to anyone who wanted to read the references.
You don't have to respond if you choose not to.

george carlin said it wonderfully:

I think Carlin's attitude was accurate.  Hope really sucks, if that was what he meant.  It does and he's correct in that regard.

--Lee

[WilbyInebriated]

Oh? Confused?

yes. confused.

Did you read the title of this thread?  It's:  I see an economic disaster coming... (I realized I misspelled it in the title, but this software doesn't spell-check thread titles).

you really can't seem to grasp the difference between the 'argument at hand' and the thread title can you?

I implied, in my response to WilbyInebriated, that I thought, or intended to say, Chinese education was irrelevant to their survival.

you implied no such thing... in point of fact, you never once mentioned education in your first two irrelevant responses...

So what?  So they're educated. 

duh!! that was my one and only point to saikron1. my intentions were to correct saikron1's erroneous assumption. then you went off with your irrelevant postings... and now i'm wasting my time on your logical fallacies...

An economic collapse would deprive the Communist government of their self-motivated, coveted power to impose their will on people, and they would lose a lot of 'face' in the process.  Being educated won't help them survive; there are just more of them (the Chinese) than us.  For now.  That can, and will, change.  I can tell you why, if you're interested.  Are you?

no. i'm not interested. here's why, IT'S IRRELEVANT TO THE ARGUMENT AT HAND!!

Communism is money-oriented and greedy, but that can be part of their undoing economically, which is the subject of this thread.

so what? it's not the subject of the argument at hand... you just don't get that do you?

Oh? Why are they 'red herrings'?

THEY ARE RED HERRINGS BECAUSE THEY ARE IRRELEVANT TO THE ARGUMENT AT HAND!!!
come on lee!!! why are you making me repeat myself??
go read that link i posted about logical fallacies. learn it. pay close attention to red herrings, strawman and appeal to popularity...