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Hello all,

from now on Im here.

In this topic I will try to show you MY WAY to built a TPU.
From myself you will have only hard FACTS.

Its time to say that Im every day in contact with "pese" and he is helping me a lot with his very good advices about all the electronics stuff. He is a very nice guy.

Thank you "pese".

My 1. picture is not best quality but you can see the 50 turns coil already connected to the lamp wire and to the bulb. On the other end of the lamp wire is my bulb.
The long thin wire is the + to the power supply.
The lamp wire has 2 strands - 1 is NOT connected.

Hello all,

the next picture - bulb connected to +12V

Hi,

next picture

everything ready to fire up my coils. You can see my MOSFET with the heatsink.

Hi,

next

next

next

Hello all,

I made 14 pictures but it has no sence to post all of them.

This is what Im calling kicks.

Otto

Otto,

Yes, thank-you. I think it is time for a new topic that will show tests with results. We need to get away from the the last topic of LOTR. GK has started blubbering again and it is hard to tell what is truth and what is crap. I myself have been a little quiet since I haven't had a lot of time to work on my coils. I have been following this forum as well as others and I think it is time for me to start playing again. I too, will try to keep this topic as a facts and results place to inform others and try to keep the "comments" to a minimum.

Keep up the good work!

Tim

Hello all,

again, what you need, so everything is here.

1.IRF 840 MOSFET
2. 50 turns coil wound over your 2 fingers, wire diameter 0,5mm
3. lamp wire or speaker wire or insulated litz wire
4. from power supply 12V
5. pulses from oscillator 5 - 15V
6. connectors

Otto

Hello all,

I think its time to invite all the good coil winders here.

We can share our results, I can help you and you can help me. But please, dont guess. This topic should not be a guessing topic.

We need FACTS, yes, HARD FACTS!!!

Only in this way we can have success and be sure in a very short time we all have what we want.
Make my tests, show us your results...I will show you everything I have and this is a lot.

Dont ask me, just follow!!!!

I see a very big intellectual potential in this forum.

The big "heroes" on their PCs, please just sit and look, nothing more.

W E L C O M E

Otto

Quote from: otto on April 17, 2007, 02:51:31 AM
next

Excellent pictures by the way. Very helpful. thanks for your effort.

Can you remember where you placed the probe tip and reference (ground) of the probe, in the circuit for this particular scope shot ?

Quote from: bob.rennips on April 17, 2007, 09:10:15 AM

Quote from: otto on April 17, 2007, 02:51:31 AM
next

Excellent pictures by the way. Very helpful. thanks for your effort.

Can you remember where you placed the probe tip and reference (ground) of the probe, in the circuit for this particular scope shot ?

  and Otto, would you always include horizontal/vertical scope settings  DIV/us and DIV/Volts,  respectively? 

Thanks,

Gyula

Guys!!!
I think that otto just asked you very nicely to be quiet.

just watch

@Otto
Kongratulations to your thread

I would like to see a drawing about the mosfet circuit.
Maybe you cann arrange vor that.

thanks in advance

Helmut

Quote from: Mannix on April 17, 2007, 05:39:02 PM
Guys!!!
I think that otto just asked you very nicely to be quiet.

just watch

Mannix,

I'm curious, why would someone who claims to be knowledgeable in electronics, not see the complete relevance of asking for probe placement on a circuit and what the DIV X/Y for the scope shots are. This is all the more important in resonant circuits.

Someone of your claimed calibre in electronics should know this inside out - it should be a natural knee jerk reaction - after all repair manuals contain scope shots and you betcha they tell you EXACTLY where to place the probe - why is that ? Huh ? You should have come across hundreds of these in your claimed profession.

Yet here you are, appearing like a complete amateur, and asking people who are asking the RIGHT questions, to be quiet. hummmmm. Quite telling if you ask me.

It's like setting out on a 100,000 mile car journey and not asking for the start and end points of the journey (probe placement) nor the scale of the map (div x/y on the scope).

After all Otto is not posting just for the hell of it. He's posting to communicate.
Intelligent questions indicate that people are taking your postings seriously and thinking about what's been posted.

Let me give you all a little story:

Once upon a time there was a person who tried to invent a car engine that ran on air. He tried and he tried until one day his car started to gather up speed and got faster and faster. Look he proclaimed I've finally made an engine that runs on air. And there was great joy all round and people did celebrate with great gusto.

A person who was from a town, a long, long, way away, piped up, I too have a car, and have built an air engine to your exact specifications but my car does not move. With a great scratching of heads he placed his car on the exact same spot where the original car had moved and all of a sudden the engine started working because the car gathered speed and got faster and faster. He was elated. There was great joy as we now had another car with an engine that ran on air.

Being a cautious person he thought I will just confirm that the engine really is providing the power, so he took the engine out of the car, placed the car on the same spot and low and behold to his amazement the car started to move faster and faster. THIS WAS BIG NEWS. The engine wasn't moving the car. How could this be ?

He shouted from the roof tops, please people try this, it is very strange a car with no engine still moves. Perhaps the air engine isn't working after all. But there was one persistent person who drowned out all rest of the people in putting this person down. "Ignore this person. He is not from around here. He does not know what he talks about. If he's asking you to try this out it is because he hasn't tried it out - oh how sad that some people are like this." and this persistent person continued. "you out of towners, listen, and be quiet. Look at all the speed measurements we have. How can you doubt that we have something here."

For years and years they tweaked and fiddled and fumbled and bumbled. Until suddenly they realised that the car was moving because it was on top of a hill. It was moving because it was rolling down the hill. How could they not have seen! And then they became very, very sad, as they realised that the out of towner had a point after all, and they had wasted all those years.

It turned out that the out of towner had lived in a place call 'hill country' and had often seen things rolling down hills but the people who lived in 'flat land' had never ever seen a hill and didn't believe such a thing could exist. The persistent person had said years before "It is all theory. We are working on something shiny and new. How can your out of town old world knowledge help us ?". Well now you know.

Don't ask just follow! >:(.  I am listining. Please carry on Otto. Respectfully.  
                   Moab

.

Otto,

Thank you for posing your test data here in a new topic.  :)

If you need to include clarifications or additional details to allow others to follow your test more meticulously then I suggest amending your first page post with this additional data instead of letting it be scattered about the many pages by the unavoidable and irritating chatter posts.

It will take me a few days to get my hands on that MOSFET but I look forward to the challenge of making a scope shot that looks like yours and learning something new.

Thanks again,  :)
Rosphere

be patient bob...
I know nothing about electrons ...I know that!
You will,perhaps  find out something..done the test??

Hello all,

my oscilloskop is connected to the point where the pulses enters the bulb. Or you can connect the scope probe to the drain of the MOSFET.
The minus is where all minuses are.

I tried to make a picuture with the scope settings but had no luck because I NEVER used a digital camera. Yes, its the truth.

Voltage settings at scope: 20V/div.

But I have to say that the kicks I showed you are not the biggest. If I would show you the biggest you would see only vertical lines. I wanted to show you how nice they are, nothing more.

Otto

Hello all,

Im replying to myself, nice.

You dont see anything in my pictures, dont understand what I want, to be short youre ignoring me!!! OK.

You know what you see in my photos???

IN FRONT OF YOUR NOSES IS A 5W TPU!!!!!!

For today enough from me.

Otto

Quote from: otto on April 18, 2007, 05:15:27 AM
Hello all,

Im replying to myself, nice.

You dont see anything in my pictures, dont understand what I want, to be short youre ignoring me!!! OK.

You know what you see in my photos???

IN FRONT OF YOUR NOSES IS A 5W TPU!!!!!!

For today enough from me.

Otto

Hi Otto,

If you really are 100% sure you receive 5W out for less than 5W input, then I really and honestly congratulate you!  But you state "only"  you have a 5W TPU.

I really apologize BUT from your pictures this does not turn out!  You made the photos where the range setting of your multimeter cannot be seen, you have not referred to any input current from which anything could be thought of etc.  I do not know if your shown multimeter is just measuring current or voltage? 

So if you would be so kind to be more specific on your possible input power or on any more measured data from which one can draw reasonable conclusions.

Thanks

Gyula

Pardon, mosfet connected this way?

Hello all,

@gezgin,

yes, but IRF 840.

@Gyula,

the point is NOT in the watts.

The point is that THIS IS A WORKING TPU!!!!!

This is what Im claiming. To prove that Im not right you have to built one, test it and show that Im joking with people, to say it in a nice way.

Otto

Quote from: Mannix on April 17, 2007, 10:31:53 PM
be patient bob...
I know nothing about electrons ...I know that!
You will,perhaps  find out something..done the test??

Please catch up to where we are, if you need to spend more time reading before posting please do this. It would help not to clutter this board with irrelevant questions that have already been FULLY answered in the last couple of days.

Thanks Otto for your probe placement info. and volts/div info.

Hi Otto,
The 400V spikes you are seeing, is this measured across the 12V 5 watt lamp?
It is possible to apply any voltage to a 12v bulb as long as the duration is short.
But to get that kind of voltage you would also need a fair bit of current.
It would be interesting to see what would happen with a bulb with a higher resistance.
You may get an even larger spike.

Does is matter how thick the wire going through the 50 turns is?
For example, could you try a 15mm or 22mm piece of copper pipe?

Regards
Rob

.

Similar oscillator circuit:

http://www.electricstuff.co.uk/oddosc.html

Not pulses, but similar. 

I know of one that turns 5v into 170v pulses and will scan and post tomorrow.

Hi Otto,

I'm still here and I am going to try your experiment again. Could you tell me how much input current your circuit draws when it is running. Until now, I have been using a DC power supply which is current limited at 0.5A, so if I'm not pushing enough current into the system to get it working, that may explan why I'm not getting the same results that you are seeing. In case the current input is the issue, I'm going to string a bunch of 9V batteries together to use as the power supply.

God Bless,
Jason O

Hello all,

congratulations to Ronnotte!!!! Im happy!!!!

In the picture you see a 25W bulb shining. Its not at full power because I would blow my scope.

Frequencies are in kHz .
The TPU is made with 2 special wound controls each of them on a collector with only1 turn of lamp wire.

Because Im really tired I dont want to respond for a while. DONT ASK ME ANYTHING. I WILL NOT RESPOND.

Here you have a link that somone of you alreday postet not so long ago.

http://magnetism.fateback.com

With this link and my little 50 turn control coil youre now able to built a 100W TPU.

Now will also Ronnotte have much more success.

Otto

Quote from: gezgin on April 18, 2007, 06:34:35 AM
Pardon, mosfet connected this way?

I see in Otto's drawing that the side of the lamp not connected through the 50 turn coil to the IRF840 is connected to +12 volts while your drawing shows the lamp connected to -12 volts. Your MOSFET is correct but the circuit won't work as you drew it.

Quote from: otto on April 19, 2007, 02:23:49 AM
...

Here you have a link that somone of you alreday postet not so long ago.

http://magnetism.fateback.com

With this link and my little 50 turn control coil youre now able to built a 100W TPU.

...

Otto

http://magnetism.fateback.com/Overunity.htm

(Maybe Turbo's TPU really did work after all.)

(EMDevices tried like hell to get everyone to look at NMR.)

Nice article - pretty much sums it all up. 

.

I would like to help Otto by sharing a little information for those of us trying to replicate this test.

Today I drove to my special electronics parts store.  I was told that IRF840 is now NTE2385.  The package says, "replaces ECG2385."  So I asked the nice lady behind the counter to allow me to look at her cross reference information catalog.  There it was, IRF840 = NTE2385.

By the way, I was told the part would cost me less than $2.00.  I planned to buy six.  However, it was actually over $7.00.  I purchased only two.

FYI-Rosphere

Quote from: otto on April 17, 2007, 07:42:32 AM
Dont ask me, just follow!!!!

Quote from: otto on April 18, 2007, 05:15:27 AM
You dont see anything in my pictures, dont understand what I want, to be short youre ignoring me!!! OK.

Quote from: otto on April 19, 2007, 02:23:49 AM
Because Im really tired I dont want to respond for a while. DONT ASK ME ANYTHING. I WILL NOT RESPOND.

Let me know when you feel like communicating.

.

.removed

.

Not offended, annoyed. I'm sorry if I made you feel bad. I sometimes post without thinking it through, my temper gets the best of me on occasion. 

Again, Otto, sorry for derailing.

Quote
IN FRONT OF YOUR NOSES IS A 5W TPU!!!!!!

There's no doubt of the power cause the bulb is glowing, but the 5W of electrical energy comes straight from the electric company and your paying every electron of it  ;D
Please, let's not try to make them any richer.

Did I just wasted 2.24 merers of expensive copper wire?
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jarkonkotisivu.org%2Ftemp%2F50rounds.jpg&hash=1e89b3bf9eafe80fadb2ba286ac319632b754906)

Quote from: sulake on April 20, 2007, 05:05:55 AM

Quote
IN FRONT OF YOUR NOSES IS A 5W TPU!!!!!!

There's no doubt of the power cause the bulb is glowing, but the 5W of electrical energy comes straight from the electric company and your paying every electron of it  ;D
Please, let's not try to make them any richer.

Did I just wasted 2.24 merers of expensive copper wire?
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jarkonkotisivu.org%2Ftemp%2F50rounds.jpg&hash=1e89b3bf9eafe80fadb2ba286ac319632b754906)

can you please also explain why and how if there is no connection to the grid?

Quote from: sulake on April 20, 2007, 05:05:55 AM

Quote
IN FRONT OF YOUR NOSES IS A 5W TPU!!!!!!

There's no doubt of the power cause the bulb is glowing, but the 5W of electrical energy comes straight from the electric company and your paying every electron of it  ;D
Please, let's not try to make them any richer.

Did I just wasted 2.24 merers of expensive copper wire?
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jarkonkotisivu.org%2Ftemp%2F50rounds.jpg&hash=1e89b3bf9eafe80fadb2ba286ac319632b754906)

Fantastic mate...we have been at this for years..now .because something is wrong with your results..we can all go home..LOL

Seriously.. have a look at Ottos picture then have a look at yours..see any thing different? did you change anything?

Did you apply your great experience and make an even better one?

This is what happens over and over ..its not just you and it is not personal I really do not mean offense..but what happens when we get to the Dangerous stage? which is not far off.

Thanks for sharing your results and picture, it is important to get thru this point..got any twin flex?  is the fet an irf840?

notice any sweet spots? tune very very slowly now..there is a delay .no ?then you could try a few things .direction of wind... I noticed a pot...what 4?

Please try again if you are willing.

Quote from: Mannix on April 20, 2007, 05:51:33 AM
...have a look at Ottos picture then have a look at yours..see any thing different? did you change anything?

Sulake,

I think what Mannix means is the bit you have routed through the coil.  If you look at Otto's picture you will see a pair of stranded wires running through the coil.  Otto wrote, and you can see from his photos, that one of the pair is not connected to anything at all.

I slipped my coil off this wire pair during testing and it seemed to make no difference in my output.

Also, my batteries got very hot and today I find them both down a volt from yesterday.

I tried to replicate it as best as I could.  I have no idea if my replication is any better or worse than yours as I have received no feedback.  If you saw Monty Python's, Life of Brian movie you will remember the two prisoners where one was spat at in the face by the guard and the other prisoner was going on about how lucky he was to be spat at: "You lucky bastard!  You must be the guards pet then.  He never spat in my face!"  :D

Hang in there, man!

Rosphere--Questing, Stumbling

Jason was again our hands last night. Mostly though we just sat, and listened and watched as he worked. He didn't really need any of our suggestions last night.

What he did. (I should probably let this come from the horse's mouth, but no post as of yet)

He built the circuit to the exact specs of ottos suggestions (what we have anyway). IRF840 50 turns magnet wire around a stranded collector. Connections made as per Otto's diagram.

Absolutely nothing. Low voltage, low lumins on bulb, if any. Three sets of eyes watching, everything seemed right. We got the same wave form, which IS an odd wave form, with the spike at the LEADING edge of the wave, that in itself is odd.

We swept the frequencies however, and found nothing of any real interest at specific frequencies. PS would not light the bulb, with or without the circuit. Not sure what we did wrong. A couple of people seem to be absolutely positive that it works, so any suggestions would be helpful. What we would like to know are values for

Frequency
Pulse Width
Power supply settings

Really, we need better documentation.

Experiment failed. Wailing and gnashing of teeth ensued.

So since it was such a short gathering, he decided to play with the circuit a bit since the short experiment was over, and we couldn't get it to work with the information we have presently. he set a cap in series with the bulb, the bulb glowed dimly, and played with the frequency a bit. At around 400khz it got a little bit brighter. About 4w output. However at the PS we noticed more current being drawn. No OU. It did give us a start though for a minute.

Strange thing about all this. At the beginning of the experiment, he tested the bulb at the power supply to see if it would light. No. then we got it to light in the circuit. Took it back out and re tested it at the PS again. AND IT LIT. Whisky Tango Foxtrot?

So he reconnected it in the circuit, and it was actually dimmer than at the PS.

This is with the cap in series however, which does not represent Otto's circuit.

This is all a very brief explanation so I don't write too much and bore people to death.

We need to know more about how this is done.. Better documentation, in order to reproduce the results. I'm sure we'd be willing to give it another go, as it's a simple and quick test.

JDO, or GK, if I made any mistakes in my recount of last nights events feel free to correct me.

Regards all,
Rich

Oh, another quick note, we tried moving the lamp wire coil outside of the 50 turn loop and the bulb lit exactly the same. No apparent difference.

Just a note.

Rich

Otto,

Since no one else has asked:

What is the diameter of your 50-turn coil?

Do you have an inductance meter to measure the inductance of this coil?  If not, it can be calculated from the dimensions.  Another way is to use a known inductance value - using the old school method.

What is the length of the wire for the 50-turn coil?  You gave the wire diameter before, but include it as well to keep the information together.

Failed duplications call for more data - such as voltage and current readings.  Place an amp meter in there and get some data.

Renssaek,

Your collector is also twisted to reduce flux. That would have a big effect on your results. However our experiment using lamp wire did not help us achieve anything better.

Rich

If everyone wound their coils like a "Brooks coil":

http://home.san.rr.com/nessengr/techdata/brooks/brooks.html

Then this set of "circuit variables" will be about the same.

(One of you has an inductance meter or a known inductor to determine the actual inductance of the coil.)

With the difference in other circuit elements, a little tuning may be necessary.

This will make it easier to duplicate each other's experiments.


EDIT:

Example - using first equation in above link:

With coil thickness of .6 cm, 50 turns - the inductance is 38.2 micro-Henries
(This coil would have a mean radius of 1.5 x .6 cm = 0.9 cm)

Nothing more from Otto? Dang, I was hoping we'd get more details.

I too built Otto's circuit & could NOT get anything to light.

I even tried 100 turns, & still nothing.

==================================================
ChemTrails, ChemTrails, What's in your sky?
Google it.
.

 ;)

About seven months ago, when Otto first posted this simple T.P.U. circuit, I build the circuit and tested it but didn't see anything of interest. Over the last four days I again built his circuit to his specifications, tested it, and again see nothing except what you would expect. Basically, more power is dropped across the bulb the higher the frequency and/or greater the duty cycle until about 50 KHz when my bulb starts to dim. Probably, the bulb dims because of the increasing filament inductance. I don't see any excess energy being generated. It makes no difference if the loop of wire is through the 50 turn coil or not. I'm finished with this Otto replication and will work on something more promising.

 ;)

Let it be known, my below post isn't MEAN, it is just the truth...

Funny isn't it, you claim to know the secrets, yet you just re-quote SM and merely say 'just do it! then send me a working device'. You are claiming that you found the secret, lol, you only just found some of SM's words... Now you try to make it seem like you figured something out!

What don't you describe the EXACT MECHANISM OF THE OVERUNITY GAIN IN THE TPU!?!? Can you do that?

Or will you just re-quote SM again...

Another thing, you said:

"I am using 6BQ7-A TUBES for the input and phase inverter.....and so you can imagine how CRYSTAL CLEAR my HIGH FREQUENCIES are..."  (p.s.  You just thought he was talking about his stereo! LOL)

Do you ACTUALLY believe that we thought he was talking about his stereo?!? Are you serious?!?

Your intentions are well, but your aptitude for the TPU isn't.

In addition, in your first long post on the TPU, you are quoting all these quotes of SMs, but guess what? Many of those supposed SM quotes that are the basis of your theory, aren't even from SM!

I am bringing this all to light so that everyone reading this doesn't get excited over nothing...

 ;)

It's okay. His intentions are good. The only problem is that many have tried exactly what you are talking about with limited results.

Spark gaps require high voltage, and that has not yet been tried yet. But the multiple frequencies and fifteen different pulsing schemes, even multiple control coils on top of one another etc have been tried. None of them have yet to produce any significant output. Well, let me re-state, not any output similar to Mark's device (1000 to 1+ OU).

I'm not trying to discourage you or anyone else. It's just that it's much more complex than we all thought at first. I am still very optimistic, but the facts so far show that it's a deeper secret than no one has figured out yet.

 8)

Just learn some electronics it's not that hard and you woun't have to talk about toy cars that don't run. 

So, you want to play the 'I'm not technical, so that is how I could see through SM's words'-CARD...

Well, let me ask you this!!!

You are saying that you understand the TPU based on what SM said. That must mean that you take into account EVERYTHING that SM said, right?!?!

Well, did you happen to read SM's post where he says that the MAGNETS ARE NOT NEEDED FOR THE TPU TO WORK?

Based on you saying that you READ and LISTENED to SM, why did you happen to disregard that post? SM said that the TPU had to be able to start via a magnet, to show that it truely was OU, because people didn't like seeing any batteries in his devices. And yes, SM said that in his first devices he used batteries, but only to power the control circuitry. Maybe you need to read more...

You are getting all these guy's poor hopes up with your large posts where you blatantly say that you have the answer, even though you have not made a simple coil! What a shame...

 8)

Hi all,

The closer we get the more arguing....I have been thinking about that and it is really important to our way foward ....why is that?



Otto has kindly been showing us something that he has spent many months discovering.
His little test is where he started.
He is trying to take you to his TPU land ,a place where he arrived by lots and lots of testing and retesting.
While I do not believe that his work is complete..he has done a lot.
Call him an edison type if you must use labels.
He will be following up with some more ,in his own good time I would imagine but I will say this...Did any body notice a bunching ..like a frequency sweeping effect?....see the kicks? Why the sweeping ?
why is it so hard to lock on to some frequencies?

TPU kindergarden

This is one stage, try some more if you like. It might not take you to tpu land but it might help you see something unusual is not hard ,expensive, or difficult.

No results....fine ......keep your test in a corner.

"Allow" him to show you more ... he carries no burden of proof.

The language barrier can be difficult in both directions.

Between ottos an ronnette's there is a wealth of information and lots of work.
Those who are waiting for a TPU to appear here shaould do exactly that just wait . Those who are building are doing good great hings regardless of their results.because they are learning things.

The only way that this technology will ever see light is if we can learn it...We do not already know it . When we do that all the explanations will make sense,the reverse is not the case.

Let me clarify something that may be of assistance

I wrote the King story

Steven Likes my little king story........in his hindsight of already understanding. That does not mean that you can build a tpu with it.

What you do build needs to encompass most of the things that Steven has said..

I am a mere messenger that KNOWS they work. Who is also developing an understanding of why this technology has not become mainstream in the past. We are all at a gate of sorts. Be nice with the offerings of others. You cant force open, the petals of a flower.

Good hunting to all who are still winding coils without words.
You are participating in a great thing that will solve 1 or 2 problems for everybody.


Lindsay Mannix






"Argue for your limitations and you get to keep them"

                                               Richard Bach

Well said Lindsay,!
                                        M.M.

Hello all,

@Bruce,

- step 3 - wrong
- collector wire IS connected to control coil
- collector AND control is the key

Please no questions.

Otto

TIP:

Rather than using a resistor in series with your Power Supply, try using a 6V or 12V Auto Tailight Bulb.  Not only does it work great, it also provide a nice visual illumination indication of what is going on.

At Resonance the Bulb will go dark.  At Non Resonance you will notice the Bulb getting brighter.

If a short occurs, the bulb lights up rather than smoking more resistors.
 
=====================================================
ChemTrails, ChemTrails, What's in your sky?
Google it.


.

Quote from: otto on April 25, 2007, 03:23:33 AM
Hello all,

@Bruce,

- step 3 - wrong
- collector wire IS connected to control coil
- collector AND control is the key

Please no questions.

Otto

OK, i'm about fed up with this.

why no questions? can you give me one good reason why you think your setup is worth something? every attempt at replication that has resulted in ultimately nothing (oh we achieved your results, but it was from the power company), has gone unanswered and we still want to know why you all think this is so amazing.

Also, I have another question. With Ronotted getting MORE power output than you, with an UNCONNECTED collector at 90 degrees, how can you be so positive that it's connected?

It would seem to me that his setup is more correct. I'm not trying to start anything here, I just want to know the logic.

Why won't you answer any questions? when people have tried and tried, and asked you to help them do it, and tell them what they are doing wrong, and why you think it's so great, you are silent.

Why would anyone want to replicate your setup, after failing and not getting any help with their setup? All we saw was voltage spikes. Meh.... So far, it seems like nothing too exciting.

Lindsay, I assume from your encouragements you have done this, and it IS interesting. That's why I haven't just discounted it completely in my mind. For all the disagreements we've had I know you are a sane evaluator of developments. If you are endorsing this, there must be something to it?

Can you then answer the questions that Otto so rudely ignores?
What is it that is so impressive about this test? To people who have done it and not been excited about it. And what have they done wrong?

We need MORE details to replicate. DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT.

even if you need to hand it to someone else to translate first, DO THAT.

NO disrespect intended by this post, please understand that, but why should we care, if you dont care enough to make sure we get it right?

Regards,
Rich

This is from Otto, posted in the german thread:


Hello people

I will try and give you some answers

Nobody succeeded at my test. That is because my homebuild oscillator is of a special type.
Offcourse, I didn't know that and I apologize for giving you all such a hard time copyiong my setup.
I understood that very late. It would have been better if you didn't do the test and therfore not waste your time.

Now the question is will your oscillator work at the next stage.
Ronotte's setup is pretty good but he is having two professional oscillators.

@Gustav22

Nice translation into german. I hope you're willing to make some changes.
The picture going with fateback.com is wrong. My control coils are NEARLY normally wound coils.
There is a little trick to them. When I'm ready I'll tell you about it, offcourse...

I'm quiet because I really need some rest and peace to do some work. When you think the TPU is only a few copper wires you are missing some marbles. This thing is so incredibly complicated....you will see!
And what else I wanted to say: Don't try to get your heads around HOW the tpu works. When it's done then you will understand.

So, please no questions

I'd like to ask something though: can anyone supply me with the schematics for my Hameg HM208?? It very impoprtant. Off course I'll pay for it.
(this is already sorted, he has got it)

Otto

Thank you Dutchy and Otto.

I appreciate the response. I'll see if I can help find the documentation for your oscillator.

Rich

HM208 is an oscope, I thought it was the oscillator you were talking about being different.

Here's the Manual, in PDF format, in german.
http://www.hameg.com/downloads/man/HM208_deutsch.pdf

schematics start on page 30.

Regards,
Rich

and I hope you didn't pay someone for it ;)

Ottos oscillators are very robust.

Steven said Tubes....hmmmmmm.

DING!!!!!!

hears the link please take the time to read it agin then ask yourself if steven said tubes?
if i have to go through it and pick out the parts so you can understand what he is saying i will but please read it a few times over till you understand what he is saying

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,2201.0.html

new posting from Otto in the german thread

Hello everybody

[...]

I will admit it now. Exactly one week ago I had an accident. I connected my coils and instantly knew that somehing was "wrong". I pushed the 3 frequencies into them. The better these frequencies fitted, the more increased the pumping effect, which  became visible at the rectifier. The scope was connected to the output of the TPU with no bulb connected. That was the mistake.
The closer I got to the three correct frequencies, the bigger the pumping effect on the rectifier. I kept up mixing the frequencies and I am quite sure I fed more then 30A!!!! and more then 250V!!!! through the rectifier back into the power grid.
The rectifier survived but the coils and my scope died.

Guess the frequencies where the pumping happened!!!  5 - 10HZ!!!!!

Does that mean anything to you?Huh

I don't really want to think about why and how it happened but we were warned that an explosion would occur. It has.

I am now thinking hard how to bill the electricity board for the energy they got from me. Ha, ha.

Please someone translate my postings into English, when they appear.

I think ronotte's document will have to be changed round quite a bit in the end. Since I now got the schematics for my scope I will now repair my scope and then finally be able to see again, what I'm doing.
You know what I'm working with since one week??? You will say it's not true but all I got is an analogue AVO Instrument, 35 years old, and a testing stick. Nothing else!!!

And I'm quite successful with that.

I hope I can come up with something soon,
and now off to work.

Otto

PS I would post it in English but have no time. Have got to do some drawings. There will be quite a lot of them so that everybody will understand how a TPU can be made. It's quite tricky.
Otto

Awesome,
Thanks gus.

Otto,

HM208 Oszilloskop:

http://cgi.ebay.de/Hameg-HM208-208-Oszilloskop-Speicher-20-Mhz_W0QQitemZ160108841974QQihZ006QQcategoryZ12960QQcmdZViewItem

now this is intresting...

so Otto actually sais he is feeding back about 30A of power into the the grid line.
I like to know if that was a pulsed DC or at what frequency he did that because i did not know that was possible... other then 60 Hz or the main frequency of the grid itself.

Sauron.

In any boundery based grid system a citizen would need a license to backfeed power. That private system had better be using a conventional solar, wind or combustion based entity operating a loss or suffer the consequences.

In the Rocky mountains the 'off grid' requirement is guns and isolation.

--giantkiller. You are either a prisoner or expelled.

@ Otto thats great 5 to 10 hz is where the magic is ...did it start self resonating ?       3 hz it gets real dangerous

Quote from: giantkiller on April 26, 2007, 11:02:11 PM
In the Rocky mountains the 'off grid' requirement is guns and isolation.

--giantkiller. You are either a prisoner or expelled.

I'd take isolation and guns anyday--just give me a lab to work in and I'm happy! ;)

what i was trying to say,
you cannot just feed back more then 30A!!!! and more then 250V!!!! through a rectifier back into the power grid at any frequency...

Hello all,

Sorry, I have only a few minutes.

Yes, its possible to feed the power grid. Why not. I had a pumping at 5 - 10 Hz and my analog meters showed me a lot current and voltage. I dont see why this couldnt be possible.

We all should know that we can have in just 1 wire an AC and a DC signal...I dont know what signal I had in the moment when I feeded the power into the power lines but for sure I saw the output signals on my TPU. I saw almost a sinewave with a lot of hash.
But my oscillators worked with square waves!!!!  Comments???

Weekends Im offline so I can not respond.

Hi Otto,

First I would say that powering any experimental device directly from the power grid is a BAD IDEA! You're asking for trouble, especially when messing around with inductive devices.

If you're using a rectifier and a capacitor the only way you can dump power into the grid is by adding it as a DC component - and only when the AC voltage is below the DC voltage you supply (The rectifier makes sure this normally doesn't happen). This will saturate any item connected to the net, and you're likely to blow e.g. transformers if you keep it up as the DC dissapates power into the devices.

In order to supply usable power to the net you need to have the phases synchroniced, and then moving the phase a little in front of the phase from the net. This is something that requires extensive electronics, and isn't something you "just" do.

My suggestion is to use an insulated DC lab-power supply so you don't kill your self - or others who are interested in what's going on.

To measure any OU use a fully charged battery (12V car battery is great). Take some water, a suitable resistor and a thermometer. First place the resistor in the water and measure the water temperature (use room temperature destilled water). Dissapate energy until the battery voltage is dropping rapidly and measure the water temperature again. Calculate the amount of Joules supplied to the water. Charge the battery again the same way, and this time power the unit/TPU - and now the output from the unit goes to the resistor. Continue until you have the same battery voltage. Calculate the Joules, and if you end up with more than before - contragulations!  (Don't forget to let the water cool down) This is basic stuff tought in beginners physics. Meters can be tricked as they're usually mechanical devices with a slow response.

Happy experimenting - and don't forget: Electricity kills!

[Edit - Output should go to resistor, not battery  ;D]

Otto,

Sounds like you tapped into a torsion field of one of the earth grids.

Very impressive.  Keep it up.

(I think "pese" has info on torsion fields on his site.)

Otto, did your TPU have one big spike, followed by a slight maybe 1 or 2 ms gap, then a ringing that hovered under say 100v, but only diminished a little, to maybe 30v and hung there, until the next square wave pulse?

Grumpy, what is Pese's web site URL?

Thanks in advance.

Pese's site:

http://www.stormloader.com/members/pese/links.html

Might be easier to search for:

"tempic field"
"Torsion field"
"telluric currents"

Radiant energy is a torsion field phenomenon. (torsion and tempic are term for same field)

Quote from: otto on April 27, 2007, 08:03:06 AM
Hello all,

Sorry, I have only a few minutes.

Yes, its possible to feed the power grid. Why not. I had a pumping at 5 - 10 Hz and my analog meters showed me a lot current and voltage. I dont see why this couldnt be possible.

We all should know that we can have in just 1 wire an AC and a DC signal...I dont know what signal I had in the moment when I feeded the power into the power lines but for sure I saw the output signals on my TPU. I saw almost a sinewave with a lot of hash.
But my oscillators worked with square waves!!!!  Comments???

Weekends Im offline so I can not respond.

No ,you cannot do this because it does not match the main frequency of the grid itself...

if you do so, you will cause permanent damage not only to your own equipment but also to that of all neightbours in the block....

all their transformers would go crazy or in the worst case explode due to the mutal inductions.

it's just stupid and by the way most fuses in homes are +\- 20 amps so you had to blow that one first with your 30A!!!!!!

Sauron.

Maybe Otto pumped all of that power into another grid...

Quote from: Sauron on April 27, 2007, 12:57:49 PM
...and by the way most fuses in homes are +\- 20 amps so you had to blow that one first with your 30A!!!!!!

Not if he had a penny stuck in it.   ;)

As a person who has designed and built grid tie and phase control circuitry you must have a number of circuit components in order to "pump power back through the grid". One is a zero crossing sensor which in turn tells you when and where to create your sine wave in phase with the grid power.

If you don't do this you smoke any component used to connect to the mains. The power being "pumped back into the grid" must be of sine wave of the same frequency and voltage (voltage within reason).

Unless I'm shown different that is the only way I personally know of doing it without creating lots of smoke.

Hello all,



I would say more time with his little test

and less time with one little detail of his experience which was a joke! (Be mindfull of humor in translation)

Perhaps It was going to the earth via the grid....it is not very important ..who got the power.

It is very important that he smoked a coil.




Lindsay Mannix

Hi Otto,
If you have extra power to feed back into the grid you need a grid tie-in inverter as used for solar panel arrays:
http://www.solarelectricsupply.com/Inverters/xantrex/sw.html (http://www.solarelectricsupply.com/Inverters/xantrex/sw.html)

This one is not cheap but there are bound to be cheaper ones on the market.

Rob

oh yes we need to hold the paper down with an anvil

@ Otto i like your sence of humer ...... @ group - I'm not a guru but in plain english on AC GRIDS ac runs on 1! line first the hot side wheather its 120 v or eouropean 220v the netural alwys goes to ground we call it sucktion in the electical trade  always remember hot - netural - ground ...netural and ground ties off on the same buss in the service entrance -where the fuses are or breakers so any input to the service goes to GROUND !  just my 3 cents worth... one for the fuse pannel

Hi Otto
I would suggest not to connect to the publik Grid.
In any Way it needs perfect synchronising.On the other Hand you have to take Care about the Regulation of Power Supply,that are providet by your local Supplier.

I the past i heard of a acsident,that happend in a Powerstation by synchronising a Generator. The Generator was (a few tons of weight) starting a freeflight in the produktion Hall.And the Lenz Effekt shows its proof that way,that the Rails from Copper Grid moving by a huge form of Energy together,that it has finally a short,that makes copper melting.

So please supply first a waterboiler instead of the Neighborhood.

Stay carefull

 :P

In response to Otto feeding the grid... After talking to the electric company because I actually called them about the subject. It's pretty amazing that they will tell you anything you want or need to know regarding feeding the grid because it's legal in the usa in 48 of our states AND they will re-emburse you with energy credits! I wasn't suprised it wasn't cash...

Aside from that Otto you can help power my grid anytime!!! I have been doing a lot of research and watching and I'm a believer in SM's work only because I've seen things that I would have a harder time explaining to myself and his device makes perfect sense! I'm a techy, however, I'm not a Coil Master by any means.

With plenty of toys and no time to play with any of them, I decided to take some time from my crazy job and push this topic heavily as it nearly plagues my brain!!! I'm a pretty intelligent person and i'm hoping to complete my own challenge of figuring out the happiness that is such a wonderful device... 7.58HZ is the EM Field recorded here where i'm at today so now i'm ready to play.

Hope every out there is having a good time! -WarMAchine

"Learning without thought is labor lost; Thought without learning is perilous."
~Confucius

"May God bless me with the right person for the job, and me with the common sense to let that person do it."

In the Geman thread Otto has again pointed out, that he makes use of the collector design drawn up by Floyd Sweet. He has mentioned the importance of this design before.

Quote from: otto on April 19, 2007, 02:15:41 PM
... please try to include from this shematic the collectors into your TPU.
....
http://magnetism.fateback.com/Sweet.htm

(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.overunity.com%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D1848.0%3Battach%3D8706&hash=137dd955f71eb631f5173dfb875873c39580ef0e)

When analyzing this collector it becomes clear, that the coils A+C can be wound as one bifilar coil (i.e. from lamp wire)
Same goes for coils B+D.
One double coil CW, the other CCW

Otto says, that it may be a good idea to arrange each of these double coils in a circle, with both circles stacked on top each other.

Unfortunately he is still confined to progress without a working scope.

Please also note, that Sweet states output of 60 Hz with 240 turns @4 coils (wired up in the depicted way)

60 = 240/4

Hi Gustav,

what you posted is really interesting, I'had seen previously that setup but for wathever reason I did not paid required attention. So many thanks to remember it me.

Speaking about the circuit , as I see it, there are clearly two separated sets of 'parallel-wound' (not bifilar connected for itself) collector coils. each set is composed by 2 coils +1 (FB1). The 2 parallel-wound coils (on the left:P1) are run in the same way but used in an inverted-way: just look at the lead numbers 1-2-3-4 and to the arrow sense. This to say that P1 and P2 are separate set of coils and as shown they should not cancel their own fluxes.

So it make sense what you suggest (use two bifilar coils with L cancelling connection): consider a single bifilar coil AC and BD.  But why has been drawn differently?.

Roberto

Hello all,

ok, now look at the Markovich coil or how you would call it.

Otto

Hello all,

Ok, now its really enough!!!

1. Tesla patent 390721
2. Mobius strip or band

With this informations you have my biggest help since Im posting here.

Otto

Otto has made available a wiring diagram (http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg30574.html#msg30574) of his current TPU setup, titled "Final drawing ....".
It is available in the German thread and can be viewed here:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg30574.html#msg30574

We also received clarification that the 4" and the 6" collector are positioned concentrically in real life, i.e. inside each other, i.e. 2 insulated strands (lamp wire) twisted in a M?bius fashion.

edit1: Otto has also confirmed that Gabi's rendition, visible in
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg30587.html#msg30587
is correct.

edit2: I altered the description given above.
Further clarification will be logged when it becomes available.

Hi Gustav:

Thanks for the great job in the translation. I'm new to this forum and have been trying to
follow the subject matter as much as I can comprehend.

Does this mean Otto has been successful in replicating the SM toroid phenomena? I just want to know if Otto's diagram  and Gabi's rendition results in the light bulb lighted up up and that over unity has been achieved?

Sorry if the question is stupid but I am just very new. Thanks for your efforts and all
the wonderful people who are trying to make our little planet less dependent on fossil fuel!

Regards

Chris

Thank you very much Otto, I,ll set about reproducing this immediately!
   Your hard work and effort is much appreciated!

@Gustav thank you for the translation & links

@Gabi Thanks for the artwork

German engineering,  you can,t beat it 8)

Quote from: joe dirt on May 06, 2007, 02:16:54 AM
German engineering,  you can,t beat it 8)

Ain't that the truth! ;)

thanks otto

we do apreciate all the  hard work that you and others have done


thanks   ;D
wer

As Gabi is trying to understand Otto's descriptions, she often draws up several alternatives, asking Otto to confirm which one represents the correct understanding.
Otto has confirmed that the second (lower) drawing in

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg30731.html#msg30731

is correct and that the drawing mentioned in my previous posting was wrong.

Otto has also told us, that he thinks that oscillators based on the 555 chip are not really suitable. He used an ICL 8038 for some time with good results [but killed it in the end, I guess].
He will try to supply a wiring diagram for a suitable oscillator as soon as time permits (end of this week or next week).

All control coils are wound CW.

He also said we don't have some of the important details yet, but he will try to provide accurate documentation.

Please note that this is work in progress and more bugs (also in communication) will probably have to be fixed as time rolls on.

edit1:
@chrisC
I only translate.

It is my understanding that the loop is not yet 100% closed, i.e the oscillator still is powered from an external power source, but presumably with less input power than what is available to light the bulb.

edit2:
Gabi's "final" rendition as confirmed by Otto can now also be seen here
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.torkado.de%2Fimg6%2FottoSeitlich3.gif&hash=a87de4d86da58ae0b1f98853d83d6d1975b11f53)
Horseshoe

edit3:
corrections & additions

Hello all,

thanks a lot Gabi and Gustav22.

Its the bottom drawing. Look exactly at this drawing. You will NOT see at the first moment whats going on.
When you look better than you see that the blue 6" outher collector wire is connected to the 4" INNER collector wire and the red 6" inner collector wire is connected to the 4" outher collector wire.

Otto

Quote from: otto on May 04, 2007, 05:51:34 AM
Hello all,

Ok, now its really enough!!!

1. Tesla patent 390721
2. Mobius strip or band

With this informations you have my biggest help since Im posting here.

Otto

I followed Otto's jumpering for the GK4 coil. This configuration is harmful!
Here is validation of an experiment to produce power in the Hi-RF and Microwave ranges:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1872.msg21431.html#msg21431

The previously mentioned frequencies are below Radiant Energy transmissions.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1914.msg22312.html#msg22312

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1761.msg21120.html#msg21120

The fast rise and fall time in the pulse send a very wide range of harmonics through the copper faster that it can produce a magnetic wave. Hence the discharge.

Otto said no iron and Starcruiser said caps instead of resistors. I have not tried either as of yet.
Since January 3rd I have tried other more dangerous things, i.e. stunguns. I need to cool my adventurous jets a tad.

--giantkiller. It do work!

Well..............................not pretty, but good enough for testing :-\

Styrofoam!  never have any when I need it.......

Otto has posted a drawing, which you can find here:

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg30914.html#msg30914

Otto's accompanying text goes as follows:

Quote from: otto translated into English
Do you remember SM talking about jet wings? He said we should search the web to find out how the jet wing was developed.

Since I know exactly how a jet wing looks like, I wound my control coils like that.
In the illustrations you can see an analysis of control coils, i.e. how they can look.

The top part of the image shows a control coil wound in the usual way.
The magnetic field around the coil possesses even field strength all around. Nothing unusual.
In the center you see a coil wound in an oval way. At the two "ends" the magnetic field is streched out  and the particles in these areas are accelerated.

The lowest part of the image shows HOW I DID IT.

I fixed my lamp wire to a teflon tube of 1 cm diameter.
Since you all are bright sparks it will be clear to you that such a coil is special.

With just one control coil of this kind I get an enormous acceleration of particles and a tornado and everything I need.

I used such a coil until three weeks ago and was quite satisfied with it. But now I again thought hard and I've got something even better.
As you all can see this coil looks like a small wing. If you view it from the side, I mean.

Additional drawing:

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg30921.html#msg30921

+ translation:

Quote from: otto translated into English
Hi everybody,

if some of you thought that my last drawing contains everything I know, you were wrong. The top section  of the drawing only resembles the wing of a light sports airplane.

In the center you can see a proper wing section.

In this drawing you can see HOW I wind my control coils. This way my magnetic field gets stretched out even more. Please note that the control coil starts at the "narrowest" part of the wing and also ends there. This should be the place on the wing, where max. acceleration occurs.

All I can say is: That's my way to wind these coils. Sure, nobody gives you a guarantee that my way is the right way. But as far as I know it is the best way, so far.

Otto

@Gustav22

Thanks for the translation of Otto's design again. Much appreciate. Does this mean that the TPU 'shape' will now be sort of wing-shaped? Also, did Otto imply this new shaped TPU is alive and 'kicking'?

Thanks

Chris

Hello all,

@Chris,

look at the 2. picture, bottom drawing. This is in the moment what Im using. In this way of winding my controls I have with 1 control coil a rotational magnetic field (tornado), a lot of output power.....Im now analysing my controls to see what wire diameter, lenght.....is the best for my TPU.

Its a very f...g job because Im testing various diameters of my wires and various lenghts for my controls.

Otto

@Otto

Wow! Congratulations and a job well done indeed. I'm new to the forum and unfortunately don't have much time to track all the wonderful posts of SM and hard working people like yourself.

I look foward to the day you can truly confirm you have reproduced or even better, make a better device than SM! Please teach us how to make this.

Gas prices in the San Francisco bay area is $3.50 /gallon. Ouch! With TPU and Stantley Meyer's on-demand Hydrogen, I love to see gas at 3 cents per gallon with no takers and water at $3.50 per bottle sold in the middle east!

Thanks again.

Chris

Otto, just a quick question. Have you also tried more than one turn of the collector to see the difference in this setup? If one turn or a few turns is better?

Also, what frequencies are you using?

Thanks,
Rich

QuoteGas prices in the San Francisco bay area is $3.50 /gallon. Ouch! With TPU and Stantley Meyer's on-demand Hydrogen, I love to see gas at 3 cents per gallon with no takers and water at $3.50 per bottle sold in the middle east!

@ chrisC ... you lucky, take a trip to europe and you know what prices are  ;)

Hello all,

@Rich

I used 22 turns, less turns.... and I had NO success.

But a little question: Why is a 6" TPU 6" in diameter?? Why is the inner diameter 4"??
Why not 7" or 5" for the outer diameter? Why, why....

I will answer you:

At exact 6" outer diameter happens something special - the best output voltage when you pulse such a collector.
At exact 4" inner diameter happens something special too _ the worst ( lowest) output voltage when you pulse such a collector.

This means that with 6" and 4" diameter you have the best difference in potential!!!!

Thats ONE of the secrets of the 6" TPU!!!!!

Otto

That's very interesting Otto! Thanks for the info. So start with a 4" ring to form my 22 collector turns on. (lamp wire I'm guessing, since that's what you used in the other experiment). This brings us out to about 5.5" outer diamter, after that, wind the control cols in three segments.

How many turns on the controls? and what gauges of wire. I'm sure this is critical too if the number of turns is so critical. Lower gauge of wire would mean a different potential gradiant, and thus more turns in the collector. What gauge of wire are your controls?

Thank you for your answer!

Rich 

Hello all,

@Rich,

just a moment.
I have only a 1 turn lamp wire for my 6" ring and another 1 turn ring for my 4" ring. Nothing more!!! If you make a 22 turn collector you will miss everything in your TPU.

On this 6" collector I have 3 control coils. You can make it with 4 control coils but then you need the Tesla patent 390721 for the rotational magnetic field. With my 3 controls I dont need the Tesla patent because with only 1 control coil I already have my "tornado".

Im analysing my control coils and in this moment I really cant say the gauge of my wires but I hope, next week Im cleverer than now.

Otto

The following translation is pertaining to Otto's message in German language thread
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg31122.html#msg31122

Quote from: otto translated into English
Has anyone of you asked themselves why the hight of  a 6" TPU is 1 3/4 inches??
Well anyway, inches mean nothing to me as I calculate in mm.
So 1" 3/4 = 44.59 mm!!!

That size is a 'message' for us !!!!!!!!

That can't simply be a coincidence!!!!

As I wound one of my TPUs according to my last drawing I accidentally lifted up the larger/outer ring.
That was when it happened: I could clearly see my 100 W bulb lighting up brighter!!!! Clear and obvious.

So the 44 mm hight is NOT accidental.
There is a good reason: At a certain hight the smaller and the larger rings show some coupling. Obviously some extra energy is released, as this happens. But that only happens when you hit the EXACT right spot/hight !!! Just miss it by 1 mm in hight.... and... well you just missed it. You've got to pay attention.

I for one, have prepared my collectors in a way to achieve max. coupling. The lamp wire of the small ring and the lamp wire of the large ring are fixed in a way that they are aligned. I had to construct a wooden frame, so that I can adjust the level/hight between the small and the large ring. Obviously the problem is to use plastic screws and nuts for all these adjustments.

As you see, none of the dimensions of the 6" TPU come from nowhere.
Now you know why I use 6" outer diameter, 4" inner diameter and 1" 3/4 hight.

@Gustav22

Thanks for translating Otto's German thread again. It's so much clearer when Otto emphasized the 44 mm height! Thanks Otto for sharing that. I sure would love to be able to find time to get my hands dirty! Much appreciate for the info. again.
Even though I can't do any replication for now, I hope the encouragement helps!

Regards

Chris

@Chris C

Maybe you can share your and Otto's clearness with us...... because personally I don't see the connection yet.....

Regards

Robert

HI  OTTO  AKO ZNAS  CROATION  SAMO  PISI   BOLJE CE SE RAZUMEMO  OK :)

@dutchy1966

The way I interpreted Otto's comment on th ~44mm height is that there is somesort of coupling between the two rings at a certain height which results in additional energy being released. 1mm off and the effect is not seen. That's why he is building a adjustable wooden frame to document this effect (like all great German enginners!).

I'm reading it at face value. Nothing more. Otto himself said this discovery was purely accidental. Maybe there's a lot of undiscovered properties of TPU engineering which can only be discovered with hands on dirty work.

ChrisC

Quote from: otto on May 11, 2007, 01:48:54 AM
Hello all,

@Rich,

just a moment.
I have only a 1 turn lamp wire for my 6" ring and another 1 turn ring for my 4" ring. Nothing more!!! If you make a 22 turn collector you will miss everything in your TPU.

On this 6" collector I have 3 control coils. You can make it with 4 control coils but then you need the Tesla patent 390721 for the rotational magnetic field. With my 3 controls I dont need the Tesla patent because with only 1 control coil I already have my "tornado".

Im analysing my control coils and in this moment I really cant say the gauge of my wires but I hope, next week Im cleverer than now.

Otto

Ok, I misunderstood then. Sorry about that. I didn't want to confuse people. I thought that it must mean that you go around several times in the diagram. But was even more confused about how the controls connected.

Ok, so ONE turn lamp wire then! Got that. One ring 4" and one 6", 3 22(or more?) turns control coils. Airplane wing shape as you have described in other posts. 1 3/4 inches high.

I'm getting a pretty good idea how to build it now. Only a few questions left. I hope you are not getting too annoyed with me.

The first one is what frequencies to feed into the control coils.

The next is more of a "how does it work" kind of question. As your control coils are shorted into the inner and outer ring, your coil seems more like one long coil with smaller coils in parallel. Or maybe it would be better said, that the control coils seem to be like special tap points on your collector. What do you think is happening in this setup. What happens to the frequency as it goes through the turns of the controls coil tap points that produces more power? It's a very interesting setup, and very counter intuitive in understanding how it works.

Thanks again. And thanks dutchy for the translations.

Rich

An observation: I can't help but wonder if the 6 inch figure is not particularly AS important as it first seems.  In this video below - beginning at 1m 10s - SM guesses the unit is about 5 inches, then gets out a tape measure and sounds surprised that's its more "about 6 inches".  If the diameter of the unit were so critical, I would think, as the inventor, he would not be guessing, but rather being more matter of fact.  Based upon something read elsewhere, what does seem critical are the frequencies in relation to the circumference, whatever that measurement might happen to be when you are finished with its construction.  This inevitably translates into power output, but the actual diameter probably means little without knowledge of the precise frequencies in relation to the circumference. 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=167210479374903373&q=Steve+Mark+Generator&hl=en

A note, this is only food for thought.  It might be junk food.  I don't want to steer anyone off course.  Its just a thought.

Hi Mannix,

I quite agree with your post and would like to see this discussion continue with minimal flaming. I should also like to ask since I've seen mention of SM's posts, are any of them still extant on this forum?

SM's device is one of the more interesting ones I've seen in the field of energy and I'm very much interested in it. I'd be very interested in replicating it, but without direct documentation from the original inventor I would think it a blind endevor.

To my mind the real heart of the device would seem to be the electronics in the center of the coils. Might it be possible to get the schematic and list of materials for duplicating this?

I'm sure I'm repeating a lot here, but I understand that you were able to contact Steven Mark, and I'm pretty sure I will not be able to so you would seem to be the best source of information on the subject of the TPU and how to replicate it.

Just had to ask,

Amy

Quote from: Mannix on April 24, 2007, 10:40:29 PM
Hi all,

The closer we get the more arguing....I have been thinking about that and it is really important to our way foward ....why is that?

Hi Amy,

It's a logical question of course, however SM is limited as to the amount of information he can volunteer for legal reasons. Doing so would put him in a precarious position. So he's taken the approach of teaching us how to do it via the concepts of the device and a few pertinent tidbits here and there. Most of his posts are in the "Master of magnetics, Steven Mark" thread.

Hope to see you around.

Thanks,
Rich

Quote from: gn0stik on May 13, 2007, 12:58:32 AM
Hi Amy,

It's a logical question of course, however SM is limited as to the amount of information he can volunteer for legal reasons. Doing so would put him in a precarious position. So he's taken the approach of teaching us how to do it via the concepts of the device and a few pertinent tidbits here and there. Most of his posts are in the "Master of magnetics, Steven Mark" thread.

Hope to see you around.

Thanks,
Rich

look, i do hate to do this .. but really? ... legal issues is the reason why the world isn't introduced to new alternative energy means by now???

if he wanted, there are plenty of ways to get the info out and still would be free from legal prosecution, bc there would be no way to prove he gave out the info to someone.

devilzangel
..

Okay, so could you be more specific? What particular *legal* issues prevent him from divulging precise documentation? I have read in his letters to Mannix that he's not out to make money on this, so why even bother with patents?

I can well understand that he might be exposed to bad guys involved in suppression, but I fail to understand how that could constitute a legal issue, unless it's big oil suing him for his invention, which to my mind doesn't seem likely.

a.

Quote from: devilzangel on May 13, 2007, 04:47:53 AM

Quote from: gn0stik on May 13, 2007, 12:58:32 AM
Hi Amy,

It's a logical question of course, however SM is limited as to the amount of information he can volunteer for legal reasons. Doing so would put him in a precarious position. So he's taken the approach of teaching us how to do it via the concepts of the device and a few pertinent tidbits here and there. Most of his posts are in the "Master of magnetics, Steven Mark" thread.

Hope to see you around.

Thanks,
Rich

look, i do hate to do this .. but really? ... legal issues is the reason why the world isn't introduced to new alternative energy means by now???

if he wanted, there are plenty of ways to get the info out and still would be free from legal prosecution, bc there would be no way to prove he gave out the info to someone.

devilzangel
..

hello all

the main reason this is not public but it is  ;) is because of the safty issues interfeirence and the things bad people could do with this tech if it is not built proper it can do things we dont want it to do like suck steel things at high speed in to it

im sure all is not knowen what can happin just yet

is

Quote from: innovation_station on May 13, 2007, 09:34:05 AM
hello all

the main reason this is not public but it is  ;) is because of the safty issues interfeirence and the things bad people could do with this tech if it is not built proper it can do things we dont want it to do like suck steel things at high speed in to it

im sure all is not knowen what can happin just yet

is

Perhaps I'm being obtuse here, but *safety issues* don't seem to have stopped nuclear power, and I believe we are all well aware of what bad guys can do with that. Also, I've yet to see or read anything at all about the potentials you mention with regard to SM's device.

Perhaps you could elaborate a bit more on the "safety issues" for us?



a.

@ amy

and i do not mean this in a rude way but mabe you are looking in the wrong places as far as i can see we  are dealing with microwaves and if they are on the wrong freq what could happin? thease can be tuned to what ever we want to tune it to but the tpu is tuned close to the earths magnetic feild but not too close from what i understand

is

Safety is a concern, but not the primary reason Mark has not released detailed info.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if one goes back and reads through the Mannix/Mark material, they'll see that the reason is because Mark is bound legally by agreements with the owners of the technology, the owners being UEC.

This has been mentioned several times throughout the months in the various threads here.

Darren

sure this tech is owned by some one else but do you think s m was the only one over the last 100 years who discovered this no he was not in fact i beleave tesla discovered this tech a long time ago why did he not make it public? could this be his death ray?

is

All newcomers,

Please review the original thread for a discussion on the topic of the TPU and why Sm cannot reveal more. This has been covered in detail previously.

Not wanting to sound rude but this is why new comers should read all pertient threads regarding the TPU to understand the various nuances of the information shared and why as well as the ground covered by others.

At the very least this will help you understand what variations of the TPU that have been tried and bring you up to date with the efforts of all contributors. We understand that this might take a while to do but research is the foundation of any scientific endeavor as well as patience. There are no easy answers here.

@starcruiser .. i do understand .. it is the discipline of the background that will propel us forward .. yes .. i have read the collected PDF files that are attached in PDF in the popular threads .. containing emails and posts etc. but even after reading .. i dont understand how SM can say he invented it, but then somehow sold the technology to UEC, and now he is suffering from it (more like the world is suffering also).

if you think i may have missed a particular collection please point me in the right direction.

@innovation_station .. totally agree with you

to others ..
btw .. UEC .. really .. what have they been doing with this technology they bought from SM, besides sitting on it (seems more and more like a dummy corp)??? anybody have a clue or real info on it .. what r the arrangements, legal bonds, etc ..it is sad to see good technology buried like this.

safety .. yes we must all make sure to not create a blackhole .. or a rift in space time .. etc .. but really .. from what i understand about toroids the electromagnetics is bounded, and there is very little EM leakage. anybody who has even basic knowledge of electronics knows how to make an EM shield. (personally though, the way SM is playing around with the device in his videos .. doesn't look too hazardous to me)

that brings on another question .. if he is bound legally, how are the videos of the technology available?? and labeled UEC .. how can we contact the company .. shit people are willing to pay here to see it operating in person.

what stage in the process of commercialization is the TPU in at UEC company?? :'(

the more i think, the more it seems we need a team of hackers (and ninjas), not a team of scientists. basically sm is asking the R&D guys here to reinvent the wheel when he has already connected the dots. .. the R&D guys here are stuck at stone wheels when he is riding on Michelin tires.

from my time here .. i see some very serious R&D people here who are willing to work long hours to R&D this TPU thing. I admire their courage, and their willingness to make this technology opensource.

devilzangel
..

The following translation is pertaining to Otto's message in German language thread
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg31553.html#msg31553

Quote from: otto translated into English
Hello everybody,

here comes the schematics of my oscillator [see oscillator.jpg in original posting]. Sorry, but the picture was photocopied from a book and then scanned ...

As I already mentioned it's mainly an ICL 8038 and a LF351 with a pair of transistors.

This oscillator was built 3 times to get 3 frequencies.

If there are questions, I am here.

Otto

and then there is
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg31560.html#msg31560

Quote from: otto translated into English
Hello everybody,

here is the rectifier for my oscillator [see power_supply.jpg in original posting]

So, for 3 frequencies I use 3 oscillators plus 3 rectifiers.

Otto

Otto is trying to upload more pictures but does not succeed due to trouble with his PC. He will try again later.

Hi Gustav22 & Otto:

Thanks again for the translation and Otto for the solid state oscillator circuit. Unfortunatley, the scan quality left a lot to be desired! If I had a scanner or CAD tool, I will volunteer to redraw it for the benefit of all. Unfortunately I have neither. Perhaps you can refer to the magazine/book page?

BTW, what are the 3 frequencies again? I supposed they are set separately by the values of the RC combinations? Thanks again for sharing.

ChrisC

Hello all,

@ChrisC

the book is an old one and in Croatian language.

Yes, the frequencies are set seperatly. Hmmm...for the moment Im using 2 frequencies in the range 100kHz - 300kHz and 1 frequency in the range 10kHz - 100kHz.

I havent repaird my scope so I cant tell you the exact frequencies.

But, I know, when you have the right connections and the right coils you will find the exact frequencies in only a few minutes. Thats for sure.

Otto

Hi Folks,

I found some links on ICL8038 IC based funtion generator schematics, in fact similar to the one of Otto's old book.  Even the data sheet of the ICL8038 (Intersil) is there.

See these links:
http://schematics.blogspot.com/2006/07/function-generator-using-icl8038.html where the output frequency is up to around 100kHz (IC is capable of working up to 300kHz).

At this link the schematics shows the output frequency goes up to around 300kHz
http://www.cip.physik.uni-muenchen.de/%7Ewwieser/elec/oscillator/ICL8038/
(because the selector switch connects a 100pF capacitor to the oscillator in the IC.)

I mention all these only to be able to see the application circuit schematics of the ICL8038 ic in a better quality than that is shown from Otto's old book.

Gyula

well here is what I found out about marks, so I will just sit back and see  :)

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,2384.0.html

Otto SM tought you thought  now you are like me a ovic , your on the path  the thing is to get the magntics gone i the tempricfeilds do tihs i thik by useig capacitors at each level  in the 90 feild that wiel bring the feild 180 bipola in the chage it pases at a fast rate so the topsing goes by it and pahase the diffrential in the 20 degree sweep that you may have missed

deleted

Otto ,
take an am Radio with LONG WAVE on it,

so you can find the frequency , that you work with ,
also if it is the second or thirdh harmonic.

Gustav Pese

http://ch.to/FE

Quote from: otto on May 15, 2007, 04:15:23 AM
Hello all,

@ChrisC

the book is an old one and in Croatian language.

Yes, the frequencies are set seperatly. Hmmm...for the moment Im using 2 frequencies in the range 100kHz - 300kHz and 1 frequency in the range 10kHz - 100kHz.

I havent repaird my scope so I cant tell you the exact frequencies.

But, I know, when you have the right connections and the right coils you will find the exact frequencies in only a few minutes. Thats for sure.

Otto

PEsse you always amaze me ..... beee there

Quote from: Motorcoach1 on May 19, 2007, 06:30:03 AM
PEsse you always amaze me ..... beee there

OK, but this is the simplest way , for folk that have no frequency counters, scopes enz.

i have and can work with all . sinc 40 jears is this my profession.

Any work can do with lot of (unnessary work , or simpel to reqognize
the funtamental of electronics . You can amaze or think about this.
Pese

P.S
I think you will (or cant) understand this and no one additional ansers have any sense for you.

Wow, this is really neat.  So otto, you've really gotten a 100W coil working?  That's awesome.  I hope to experiment myself once I can get an oscillator built.  Seems relatively cheap between the oscillators and the wire, imagine 20 of these stacked in parallel, pretty cool, huh?  I just hope that the coil isn't drawing power from the voltage source or something like that, that's really my only concern.

-Brian

Hello all,

@Super God,

I didnt say a have a 100W working coil.

Otto

My bad.

-Brian

@ Pese - when i said i was amazed i ment you allways come through . yes the freq can be heard on long wave radio or what ever  freq you transmit.  just tune in the modulation before peak tuning. I do have  project I would like to share with you. I don't know if your email is working ...Mike .

@Amy,
Safety first or all else fails.


.

Quote from: Motorcoach1 on May 21, 2007, 10:29:02 PM
@ Pese - when i said i was amazed i ment you allways come through . yes the freq can be heard on long wave radio or what ever  freq you transmit.  just tune in the modulation before peak tuning. I do have  project I would like to share with you. I don't know if your email is working ...Mike .

Is OK . I excuse me also

I done this also as Child , so that over 50jears.

Also THIS way (with Radio) it is possibel to recognize the exactly frequency from
the ground-wave .  All HAM (that worke with Quartz Frequency cristals  , aswell some RADIO-man, know that also.

All this technics can used and followed very simpel .
Most of "money Giving Ideas" bu buy testweuipment
is mostly unnessesary . all differencies to accurat
working , van be tuned in most scematics and wirerings.
sorry for my unpolished english :-)
Pese

The following translation is pertaining to Otto's message in German language thread
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg32286.html#msg32286

Quote from: otto translated into English
Hello all,

I finally ran across Erfinder?s postings. That was some days ago. Soon afterwards he deleted everything. What a pitty!!! But one of the guys of that thread has published a pdf and so we have at least saved some of Erfinder's messages.

He used to post in the tread "MEG circuits....."
Free Solid State/mechanical energy
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,133.0.html
It was about a  Tesla Motor and Patent number  464 666 - Electro Magnetic Motor.

It is about a motor which shows so many similarities with the TPU that it can not be just a coincidence. Maybe you are aware that SM also studied Tesla?s patents.

First I have to mention that Erfinder converts 1 inch into 22.5mm and not to 25.4mm, as would be usual.

He states that for the Motor the ratio of Primary to Secondary should or rather must be 1:1 regarding MASS.
As I only got between 40 and 50 W with a 60 W light bulb from my TPU and was not making any progress I finally yesterday wound a new control coil:

Secondary 144?? x  22.5mm = 3.23m = 5,546 Gramms, 0.35mm wire gauge
Primary 3.17m = 5.546 Gramms, 0.5mm wire gauge

I worked out theses figures. Maybe they are wrong, as I am not a math teacher, ha,ha.

I pulsed this single control coil wit 3 freqs. My 60W bulb only lit up dimly as I only used 1 coil and just one 6?? collector, but that is not important.

However, it is important that ? when I attach another 60 W bulb in parallel, the current does not rise. My mini TPU dies NOT react to that second bulb. My analog meters remain "ice cold". The voltage, which I measure across the bulb(s) initially, goes down a few volts but after a second or so it comes back up to the same value as before. The intensity of the light is the same. The current from the rectifier is the same.

It is the first time that I get this effect.

Obviously it was my friend Pese who came up with the idea of the second bulb in parallel. He also said, that if everything would go as described there would be power in the coil. And there is power in it.

Today I will wind another 3 such control coils and find out what?s going on there.
I?m asking myself if  should reduce my collector rings according to the calculation of 22.5mm per inch. Should I calculate everything like that (22.5mm per inch)?

I guess this is worth some experiments.

I almost forgot: the similarities to the motor:

1. rotating mag field
2. 4 secondary windings
3. 6 ?? diameter
4. Aluminum ?there is also Aluminum in the TPU but people don?t know or don?t want to realize ? the heat sink of the MOSFET.
5. everything or almost everything is wired up in a similar way

There would be lots more, and that?s without going into the working principle of the TPU.

@Gustav22 & Otto:

Thanks again for the long translation. Yes, i also believe Erfinder was trying to make us understand Tesla's patent principles. At some point when all the clues come together with respect to vortex & magnetic resonance, i think we will see the pieces fall in place. Otto, I think you're on the right path but I'm not sure if you can count the aluminium in the Mosfet as sufficient in quantity or in position to create paramagnetic qualities to aid the magnetic field effects?

Looking forward to your new coil windings and turns!

Chris

Hello all,

@Chris,

I dont know if you saw the video with a 15" TPU. There is a laaaarge heatsink or 2? This heatsink(s) are or is made from aluminium. And not to forget, this heatsink is oval in form to NOT to disturb, to say so,  the rotating tornado as I call it.
Now if we compare the motor at the other topic with our TPUs.....

I always thought as Im better in understanding and with better results I would NOT have so much to work on my TPU but I was wrong. Now I have a million ideas what to try, how to make my coils.....

A lot of work is waiting.

Otto

Thank you very much for the update, Otto.

Great job!!

Please keep us informed, this way we do not have the same people repeating any mistakes,and can build off of your lessons.

Thank you for your time,
Bruce

    I guess I can be of a bit of help here. I have all the posts that erfinder made plus all the rest.  I just captured all of them and put it into a text file. Can share with anyone who wishes. That was one of my last posts there, save all for the future as there is something here to all this. The magnetic probability alone is staggering.

sugra

. deleted.

Rich

@sugra

Thanks for saving Erfinder's post. Can You make a pdf copy from beginning to end and post it here? I don't think I have the complete posts.

Thanks

ChrisC

Quote from: sugra on June 03, 2007, 12:42:37 AM
    I guess I can be of a bit of help here. I have all the posts that erfinder made plus all the rest.  I just captured all of them and put it into a text file. Can share with anyone who wishes. That was one of my last posts there, save all for the future as there is something here to all this. The magnetic probability alone is staggering.

sugra

jes post them (in right) tread, so we can discusse ofer this longer , and perhaps "erfinder" will work again in overunity com

@ sugra

yes that would be nice to have a copy of
erfinders post  and others

wer

Yes, me too sugra, or please post it in this thread.

Thanks,
gn0stik.

OK all:
   Since I was asked to put it here, then here it is. This was all shared to a public forum so therefore I dont feel it wrong to reshare it as well. I suspect that erfinder will complain about me over it so until then here we go. I have put all the files in one zip called erfinder.zip. The text file is actually .rtf and was made with wordpad.  Enjoy

sugra

thanks sugra for the up

devilzangel
..

thanks  sugra for the info

wer

   The reason I saved all of it was the more I looked at it, the more I saw some very interesting things in the way the magnetic forces interacted. I will be hard pressed to be able to replicate it due to the cores. I would have to send off to a laser cutting place for them and thats really spendy. Still, worth the play. Hope it helps someone.

sugra

Hello all,

@sugra,

thanks a lot. Now I can learn and really analize Erfinders posts.

Otto

The following translation is pertaining to Otto's message answering @Stefan in German language thread
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg33693.html#msg33693

Quote from: otto translated into English
Hi everybody,

@Stefan,

I was upset and annoyed because people don't want to believe what a gift we've been given.

Nobody takes the 30 minutes to just wind 1 control coil around a collector and to pulse this control coil with 3 frequencies to see what happens. Nobody wants to see the transformation of the kicks into SINE WAVES !!! Nobody wants to understand, that this transformation is a kind of "creation of ENERGY". Are they all so blind and lazy? ??? Huh? Where are their brains?
I mean the guys with the scopes and the high end frequency generators.

I gave all my TPUs to my last visitor. All my papers: test data and drawings, everything.
This last visitor was so enthusiastic that he is going to buy me a scope so that I can work again.
Another visitor is expected.
You can not imagine what's going on in a TPU. Not in your wildest dreams.
You think a TPU is meant to light bulbs???HA;HA.
That's like building an atomic power plant to light up 10 light bulbs!!!!! Exactly like that!!!!!

Have you got an idea what we are doing??? Can you imagine what what we are tapping?  ??? Huh?
Some of you may know, but many don't have a clue.

Read Tom Bearden.
I will contact him soon.
Think I got crazy?? OK, then Tesla was crazy as well. I am NOT Tesla but I am also not a dreamer.

Please no emails. I can't read them and have to delete them as they arrive.
Please somebody translate this into English. Thank you.

Otto

A quick personal note to all you readers:
I personally think that we find ourselves right in the center of an avalanche of change.
Maybe we can try to understand each other
and the unique position each of us is in.

@OTTO:

A big handshake and I personally say:

W E L L   D O N E


I'll support and do personally invite everybody to support you in every possible way.

ronotte

Well said Otto!

It seems some would rather reinvent the TPU then just do what has been said for weeks.

Keep up the great work and God bless!

Cheers,
Bruce

Be very careful of these "visitors" otto, they may seem nice, buying you "gifts" so that you can resume your research. They may seem supportive now. But later they may not be so nice.

Regards,
Rich

Guys,

thanks a lot for your kind words.

Dont worry, Rich, my feeling never fails about my visitors.

Is one of you able to post on this forum my final drawing?? I dont know how to do it.

AND ITS REALLY IN THIS MOMENT MY FINAL DRAWING.

The pdf is NOT so important.

Otto

 ;)

Rich,

Can you PM Otto and help him with this drawing.  I could not draw a good circuit to save my life and do not want to mess this up.

Thanks,
Bruce

Otto,

I know you have been working on this for a long time and have put many hours into it. Thank-you for your hard work and especially for sharing!

Tim

Good luck Otto.  Don't let it overwhelm you.

Otto,

Is this the correct "final" drawing?

 ;D

Yeah, the one I posted is the "Gabi" version.  Same thing.

Hello all,

yeeeees.

control coil lenghts:

4,2m primary, diameter of wire from 0,5mm - 1 mm, all the same current from the power supply. Yes, I know what Im wrighting!!!

10,5m secondary wire lenght, diameter 0,35mm.

Now will Erfinder have almost a heart attac.

@Erfinder

dont worry, I know and saw of course, your teachings.
As Im clever,ha,ha I tried all your teachings (same weight of primary and secondary coils, 2,25mm instead of 2,54 for 1"). And much more.


Please understand all that this lenghts of my control coils are NOT the best but as I didnt want to stop my work I figured this lenghts in my way out.
But even with this controls I can clearly see the conversion process.

In the german topic you can see the pictures of the beginning of the conversion process.
The top signals are our kicks and the bottoms are tha little converted signals. At this point of conversion starts the pumping of the power supply. Look and enjoy.

Otto

Great work Otto:  On your earlier post of your drawing , I was doing some LEEDSKALNIN magnetic tests and yes there are 3 mag points and on larger units there are more. So as i see it these are the coil points. the test also included that in the C shaped wire there is an AC feedback at the center of the shape (in the U shape also ). toward the end where the gap is. who would have thought hahaha. great work my friend now we build and refine ... Thank you humbly Mike

Hello Otto,

What about collector coils,  Is that 22.5mm hight? and How many lamp wire?

Thank you.
nong

Otto's collector resembles mobius resistor - non-inductive and non-reactive

Quote from: otto on June 05, 2007, 10:44:43 AM
Guys,

thanks a lot for your kind words.

Dont worry, Rich, my feeling never fails about my visitors.

Is one of you able to post on this forum my final drawing?? I dont know how to do it.

AND ITS REALLY IN THIS MOMENT MY FINAL DRAWING.

The pdf is NOT so important.

Otto

Alright if you feel good about them, or know them, then I trust your judgment, but still, be careful.

I didn't know if you answered so I did my best to post it in german in your thread, hehe, probably sounds horrible in german.

Any way, I tried, the language barrier shouldn't be only yours to deal with.

So, I am taking your drawing and as many of your notes as I can find and making a PDF for people, should be ready soon.

Regards,
Rich

Hi Otto,
Good work, well done!

The drawing that Dansway posted:
otto_finaldrawing2.jpg

The 3 frequencies input, are they all from 3 different frequencies from seperate signal generators or is it one frequency with a phase shift of 180 degrees for each of the 3 inputs?
Reason I ask is that I have one 20Mhz signal generator and I may need to get two more.

Is the 4 inch collector coil inside the 6 inch collector?

Regards
Rob

HERE is the first revision of the PDF that I have made from the combined specs of Otto's TPU.

Although all the information is in different threads, once it's all collected into one cohesive document it makes pretty clears sense.

So here it is, otto.pdf v1.0

Some stuff will probably need to be added as we remember more, I'm open to suggestions for items to include.

I didn't know where to put the references to aluminum, and how exactly the mobius looks in real life.

I was also going to put in some quotes from SM that point to different parts of Otto's configuration to make it a bit clearer in the minds of everyone.

What we lack is exact frequencies, we have some ideas of ranges but that's about it.

Input power is another thing lacking, we have some voltage figures but no current figures.

Such as it is, however, it should be enough to replicate with a little experimenting.

It's pretty quick and dirty, I wanted to get it posted before I got in the car. It'll be more refined tomorrow. I just wanted to get this out there to help people who are in the middle of replicating so that they could have easy to reference material.

@Otto, please review this and tell me what else it needs. You can PM me with any information you would like added. Thanks.


Regards,
Rich

Quote from: gn0stik on June 05, 2007, 08:20:53 PM
...PDF that I have made from the combined specs of Otto's TPU.

Hi Rich,
thanks for your efforts.

Maybe it would make sense to collect incoming questions from everybody at the end of the document in FAQ style.
Then Otto can answer those to which he knows the answer
and open questions would be logged and be left open until the answer is found.

Thanks again to you and Otto.
:)

Hello all,

@Rich

in this moment I prefer for my primary side of my little "transformer" 4,2m wire lenght and diameter can be 0,5mm - 1mm. Its the same. Yes, the current from the power supply is the same. Nice, isnt it?

For my secondary I use 0,35mm wire diameter and 10,5 m .

Of course, the controls must be optimised.

You did a great job. Finally, my drawings on 1 place. Thanks.

I see you mentioned currents.
When you first pulse the coils at WRONG frequencies it can happen that the current from the power supply is at least 5A!!!!  A disaster. The controls are overheating, you can smell the isolation of the wires is almost melting.
Wehn you are nearer even a wrong frequency, but a nearer, the current drops to 2 - 3A and then the coils are hot but not overheated. With such a current you can then easily work.
Later I will describe something impossible but fantastic.

Again in short:

1.primary coil 4,2m lenght, diameter 0,5mm - 1mm
2.secondary coil 10,5m lenght, 0,35mm

It will be and must be changed.

Otto

Otto,

Have you noticed the inertial (gyroscopic) effect yet?

Quote from: otto on June 06, 2007, 12:35:31 AM
Hello all,

@Rich

in this moment I prefer for my primary side of my little "transformer" 4,2m wire lenght and diameter can be 0,5mm - 1mm. Its the same. Yes, the current from the power supply is the same. Nice, isnt it?

For my secondary I use 0,35mm wire diameter and 10,5 m .

Of course, the controls must be optimised.

You did a great job. Finally, my drawings on 1 place. Thanks.

I see you mentioned currents.
When you first pulse the coils at WRONG frequencies it can happen that the current from the power supply is at least 5A!!!!  A disaster. The controls are overheating, you can smell the isolation of the wires is almost melting.
Wehn you are nearer even a wrong frequency, but a nearer, the current drops to 2 - 3A and then the coils are hot but not overheated. With such a current you can then easily work.
Later I will describe something impossible but fantastic.

Again in short:

1.primary coil 4,2m lenght, diameter 0,5mm - 1mm
2.secondary coil 10,5m lenght, 0,35mm

It will be and must be changed.

Otto

Alright Otto, I will change it, and re-post it first thing tomorrow to reflect the things you specified. I'll make a note of the current notes as well, for tuning indications.

Thanks for the tips. I'm glad to help. Gus, good idea. I think a q&a section would be a good, no pressure approach to answering questions that need to be answered.

A question for everyone(whoever can answer). What would the "gauge" in the US (AWG) be for .35mm and .5mm wire? (lol at myself)

Regards,
Rich

Nevermind, it looks like 24 AWG(.321), and 27 AWG(.511), they are not exact, but close.

Here's a chart.

These will work, won't they Otto? 

http://www.vandenhul.com/artpap/awg.htm

Rich

The following translation is pertaining to Otto's message
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg33897.html#msg33897
in German language thread

Quote from: otto translated into English
Hi everybody,

here comes a real bummer ? A sweet for our physics experts and our Gabi.

All of us pulse our  TPUs with 3 frequencies. All of us use 3 MOSFETs, 3 pulse generators etc. for this purpose.

In order to not overheat the pulse generators we use a heat sink for each MOSFET, so that?s 3  heat sinks in total. They are made of aluminium.

A long time ago we were told that everything should go into the TPU. I followed this advise although I could not see any change or sense in it.

Maybe you also remember my magnetized needle, which started to spin. I did not know why it started spinning (not important). When I saw it spinning I took a lighter and used it to heat up the wire. OHO. The needle started to spin up like mad. It was obvious: something was going on in the wires. I put this experience aside, but took note of it.

Then I took a look at the 15?? TPU: an oval heat sink. You can?t overlook it. Then the open TPU: 2 black rings. Hmmm

Maybe I should tell you that I envisage the rotating mag field as rotating ?dust? or ?particles?, in order to visualize what?s happening.

OK. The heat sink must be oval so that my fast rotating particles don?t get disturbed in their movements but can rotate unhindered. So I had solved this problem.

But why should the heat sink be in the TPU??

And here it comes:

3 heat sinks with attached MOSFETs.
Outside the TPU: If they get pulsed all 3 heat sinks get hot.

When my visitor and I changed the frequencies we could observe that a small sine wave showes up. To prevent frying the MOSFETs I alway had to put my hand over the heat sinks to feel the temperature. What did I realize??

Good god, the heat sink of the MOSFET which gave the sine wave must have got heated up to more than 100? C!!! Why did the  MOSFET not switch off. After all it is equipped with an overheat protection !!!! What is going on??? The heat sink was so hot, I could not touch it. Yet the  MOSFET continued to operate!!!!
Something is wrong there..

Then I detached the MOSFET from the heat sink and took it in my hand. Unbelievable!!!!!! It was just WARM!!!!!!!! UNBELIEVABLE but true!!! Just WARM!!!

Well, that?s one of the effects we saw. That?s just one of the secrets of the TPU.
Now you also know what the black rings in the TPU are: rings of aluminum!!!

Sure, then I remembered the wire which I heated up, and which mentioned above .

One of the secrets of the 6" TPU:

Aluminium gets heated up to release particles which are then injected into our "tornado" with my coils. That?s one of the secrets.

Why do you think I try to get people to replicate a - my  TPU?. So that they will be able to see what I and my visitor saw.

Digest this a little.
Tomorrow another small story.

Otto

Otto .. THANKS for your insightful observations of you experiment.

Maybe .. the whole TPU acts like a tube .. getting to a certain temp to operate functionally.

(@Gustav22 - thanks for the translation)

devilzangel
..

Quote from: otto on June 06, 2007, 12:35:31 AM
Hello all,

@Rich

in this moment I prefer for my primary side of my little "transformer" 4,2m wire lenght and diameter can be 0,5mm - 1mm. Its the same. Yes, the current from the power supply is the same. Nice, isnt it?

For my secondary I use 0,35mm wire diameter and 10,5 m .

Of course, the controls must be optimised.

You did a great job. Finally, my drawings on 1 place. Thanks.

I see you mentioned currents.
When you first pulse the coils at WRONG frequencies it can happen that the current from the power supply is at least 5A!!!!  A disaster. The controls are overheating, you can smell the isolation of the wires is almost melting.
Wehn you are nearer even a wrong frequency, but a nearer, the current drops to 2 - 3A and then the coils are hot but not overheated. With such a current you can then easily work.
Later I will describe something impossible but fantastic.

Again in short:

1.primary coil 4,2m lenght, diameter 0,5mm - 1mm
2.secondary coil 10,5m lenght, 0,35mm

It will be and must be changed.

Otto

12v at 5 amps is 60 watts.

12v at 2amps is 24 watts and 36 watts at three amps.  If this is at each control coil, then you would have 72 to 108 watts going in and this is applied to the collectors since they are connected to the controls.

0.35 mm wire is only rated at about 1.7 amps - which is conservative, but indicates that it should get hot with more current than this.

So, do you have less going in than you have going out?  If you do not, then how can you say you have a working TPU?

You have given no measurments of the lumens output of the bulb, no measurements of the currents.  The control coils are connected to the collectors so you can not say that the input is isolated from the output.  Would not a better indicator be a resistor and a meter at the load, rather than a bulb which changes as it heats?

Otto: Is this modified schematic correct?  Do you cross at each side or across the middle?

Quote12v at 5 amps is 60 watts.

12v at 2amps is 24 watts and 36 watts at three amps.  If this is at each control coil, then you would have 72 to 108 watts going in and this is applied to the collectors since they are connected to the controls.

0.35 mm wire is only rated at about 1.7 amps - which is conservative, but indicates that it should get hot with more current than this.

So, do you have less going in than you have going out?  If you do not, then how can you say you have a working TPU?

You have given no measurments of the lumens output of the bulb, no measurements of the currents.  The control coils are connected to the collectors so you can not say that the input is isolated from the output.  Would not a better indicator be a resistor and a meter at the load, rather than a bulb which changes as it heats?

Illuminating a 60W bulb with 2 or 3 Amps does not need a TPU. Wind a bifilar coil on a 150mm x 175mm conventional wire spool using 19swg or 18awg (preferably twisted or litzed) and fill the spool. Configure this into an oscilator using a single MOSFET or BIPOLAR transistor and see that 60W mains lamp glow nicely. Alternatively make a very simple push - pull inverter using a 'P' & 'N' MOSFET bridge and a large toroidal mains transformer . This would look just like a TPU if the MOSFETS were placed around the inside circumference of the toroid!

I thought the challenge was to do as SM did and illuminate the lamp from no PSU or perhaps just a small 9V battery??

Quote from: Hoppy on June 06, 2007, 02:22:04 PM

Illuminating a 60W bulb with 2 or 3 Amps does not need a TPU. Wind a bifilar coil on a 150mm x 175mm conventional wire spool using 19swg or 18awg (preferably twisted or litzed) and fill the spool. Configure this into an oscilator using a single MOSFET or BIPOLAR transistor and see that 60W mains lamp glow nicely. Alternatively make a very simple push - pull inverter using a 'P' & 'N' MOSFET bridge and a large toroidal mains transformer . This would look just like a TPU if the MOSFETS were placed around the inside circumference of the toroid!

I thought the challenge was to do as SM did and illuminate the lamp from no PSU or perhaps just a small 9V battery??

That is exactly what I'm talking about.  Once again we are led to believe the the journey is over when it has barely begun.

@ Grumpy
@ Hoppy

Why not just take an hour and wind the coil and try it for yourself and post the results.  You have both the equipment and know how to do this.  I plan on doing likewise.  Otto is not dumb, and would not be saying all that he has been if he were not seeing incredible results. 

So, ya know, just build the thing and chill. 

It is just the beginning I agree, but we must walk before we run... ;)

I saw a saying today that I liked very much.  It said, "A good leader knows when it is time to follow."  And I say, for now, let us follow Otto with accurate replication and go from there.  Perhaps we shall be very happily surprised.  I for one expect this.  If not, then so be it.

Cheers,
Bruce

@Grumpy

Why make such a fuss when all you should be doing is spend 30 minutes like what Otto had suggested: "BUILD THE THING!"

If AFTER you built it according to the specs. Otto released and you can't replicate it then you have the right to bitch!  If you can't make it work as prescribed than you can certainly ask questions?

I just wished I have the simplest equipment to start replicating. I don't even have a solder iron or working bench at this time!

Regards

chrisC

@btenzer
@chrisC

In case you have not been following closely, Otto already built it and is the person claiming to have a working TPU - despite the power supply connected to it.

The fact that Otto can not or will not provide input an output power is a reason to bitch about the claim.  As I have told Otto before, lighting a damn bulb is not a definitive test and certainly not enough to claim you have a working TPU, especially when you are supplying a few amps of current from a damn power supply! 

So, why don't all of you pull your heads out of your asses and see with your minds that this is not a working TPU!!!

I'd rather buid the bifilar induction coil light bulb lighter - at least I know that will work!

@Grumpy

Maybe you're the one that has not been following this closely. You took the time to reproduce the final circuit. Right? So in that final circuit, is that lamp connected anywhere to a DC path from the pulsating frequencies?

So, if Otto told you there as x amps measured at the input pulses power supply and the magic magnetic power is at the collector output and it's a huge magnitude difference from what the input is measured, all you have to do is to verify that it is true? Can you not do that without bitching?

What the heck is wrong with you?

ChrisC

Quote from: Grumpy on June 06, 2007, 03:47:53 PM
@btenzer
@chrisC

In case you have not been following closely, Otto already built it and is the person claiming to have a working TPU - despite the power supply connected to it.

The fact that Otto can not or will not provide input an output power is a reason to bitch about the claim.  As I have told Otto before, lighting a damn bulb is not a definitive test and certainly not enough to claim you have a working TPU, especially when you are supplying a few amps of current from a damn power supply! 

So, why don't all of you pull your heads out of your asses and see with your minds that this is not a working TPU!!!

I'd rather buid the bifilar induction coil light bulb lighter - at least I know that will work!

i have to totally agree with Grumpy here.
it is not hard to lite up a bulb, i have showed you all more then once.
it get's intresting when we can disconnect the power supply and the bulb will still lite.

HOWEVER,
let us not go into the argue region any more we need the damn tech and evereybody who is willing and who thinks he can add something to the project must be able to speak up without backfire of any sort.

my last coil is running here in front of me.
it's 3 frequency's independant adjustable thrue 6 variable resistors switched thrue 3 irf n- channels hooked to a big supply and i am still searching for a sweet spot.

Let's just hope somebody finds the right setup and is willing to let us all know how to make the violin sing, this is what we all want, isn't it...?

Marco

@ChrisC

Stop acting like a cow - the herd will go over the cliff and you with them.  Open your mind for a second.

In case your vision is blurry and you can't see the connections in the schematic, the damn control coils are connected to the collectors - more like "bias" then "ground" than 90 coupling.

Guess you didn't see his scope shot either - collector pulses line up with control pulses - no "DC with hash" like SM stated the TPU has.

As for the current at the output - Otto is silent on that question (I am aware that it will take some work to clean up that signal), but it does not matter because it has already been indicated that you can light a damn bulb with a pulsed inductor, but it ain't no TPU!

@btenzer
@chrisC

Another problem is that no one can build an accurate replication of Otto's device with the specs we now have. We need documentation and accurate measurement of input power to output power.

@marco

I do completely agree with you and Grumpy that before we rejoice in Otto's claims, we should be comfortable that mistakes were not made in the discovery process. Indeed everything should be verifiable and of all people, you experimeters with proper equipment should be able to start the verification process.

As you have pointed out, you have made your test rigg but cannot find the sweet spot. However, is your set-up exactly what Otto showed? double Mobius? If it is not identical then you can't say his set-up does not work? Right? Compare apples with apples.

Otto did not show a self-running TPU. All he was showing that with 3 controlled frequencies and a special mobius arrangement plus the Aluminium factors, he was able to go beyond what all of us so much wanted to verufy!

He is trying to understand how to control these immense power that be generated whilst some people are still bitching about the fact that he may be blowing smoke!

That's all I have to say. Yes, I have not tried to replicate just because I don't have any equipment but I think I do understand enough of the mechanics to follow what Otto has been able to discover.

That's all. Peace!

chrisC

Quote from: mflynn44 on June 06, 2007, 04:37:41 PM
@btenzer
@chrisC

Another problem is that no one can build an accurate replication of Otto's device with the specs we now have. We need documentation and accurate measurement of input power to output power.

This is ALWAYS the problem therefore we need to be polite to each other...

Quote from: Grumpy on June 06, 2007, 04:31:03 PM
@ChrisC

Stop acting like a cow - the herd will go over the cliff and you with them.  Open your mind for a second.

In case your vision is blurry and you can't see the connections in the schematic, the damn control coils are connected to the collectors - more like "bias" then "ground" than 90 coupling.

Guess you didn't see his scope shot either - collector pulses line up with control pulses - no "DC with hash" like SM stated the TPU has.

As for the current at the output - Otto is silent on that question (I am aware that it will take some work to clean up that signal), but it does not matter because it has already been indicated that you can light a damn bulb with a pulsed inductor, but it ain't no TPU!

Grumpy just in case you did not notice,
Otto has been on this project for a long time...

he has contributed to the overal process by:

*building coils
*doing experiments
*writing down some graphs (which is about the hardest part i can think of)
*shared his results

now what else can we wish for??

THANK YOU OTTO.

even if it is not the right setup, at least he did contribute in a most positive way.
that is somewhat diffrent then start arguing about why this or that cannot work....

i have already learned to stay in the background and see how things devellop if they don't fit into my knowledge.... think about it.

Marco

Hello all,

@Grumpy,

a very short time ago, there was a master with the name "Erfinder" in the MEG circuits....topic.

Sorry to say, read again his posts.

Do you really think its important if I have from the power supply 1, 2, 3, 4, 5A???

But when I post than please read carefull. I sayd that at 5A the isolation from the wires is almost burned but then I change the frequency a little and need only 3A or more or less. Then I can work without any problems. F...k the current fron the power supply. This is not important at all!!!!

If you think that the TPU unit is a so called overunity device where you have an input of 1A and an output of 2A in a classical meaning way, then youre on the WRONG address.
If you think, you put in 10W and the output is 20W - again wrong address.

THIS IS AN CONVERSION DEVICE.

To be short, read Erfinder.

Its night,  good night.

Otto

@Otto

thanks for pointing toward the truth especially with reference to Erfinder's postings. I am inclined to believe before Erfinder dissapeared for good, he was trying to teach people one step at the time that there are stanger truths than what we all have been taught about electricity and magnetism.

Then there are these "I know it all" people and Tesla experts  that probably pissed him off and he is no more on this forum!

So, my take it, unless we try to undersatand and take advice, don't think others are blowing smoke, just because our own brains are too small and our egos too large!

chrisC

Hallo all,

@Grumpy,

I really have no money. Here my offer:

Make my coils, connect them......make what is needed.

IF YOU HAVE NO SUCCESS I WILL PAY YOU FOR YOUR WASTED TIME AND THE FEW DOLLARS FOR THE WIRES!!!!!

Otto

Erfinder never built his device.  He could not even describe magnets correctly as he had never obtained them.  The hardrive magnets he spoke of are not magnetized in the correct orientation.  Although I will not say that his ideas are wrong - I do not believe that they are wrong at all - only that he has not made them manifest - and this is what I have urged him to do - build it!

If the current from the power supply is "not important" - then remove it.  

When you light that bulb with just the pulses from the signal generator - then you may have a TPU!  

When you wind a coil that has no input, yet it produces usable power - then you may have a TPU!

first off .. users here need to stop shouting at each other for no reason .. it is useless and counterproductive. Treat others as you expect to be treated.

From what Grumpy, and Marco have said; and from what we know about SM's TPU, one is inclined to say that Otto's current device isnt exactly like SM's TPU. SM's TPU "might" have had a small battery, it didnt have a couple of amps powering it. big difference.

but the fact that otto's device shows some promising results is in itself a reason to pursue what Otto is doing. Maybe with more R&D he will be able to get it to the point where he can swipe a neo magnet across it and get it to run.

@Otto - you have no reason to promise us anything, no one is paying you to work on what you r doing, you are volunteering your time and effort into the replication of a TPU. We should indeed be very grateful for all your time and effort. That should be enough for others to atleast confirm your experimental results by trying to follow your design.

the powersupply thing is important to consider .. Otto, you may be getting some nice results .. but as Grumpy pointed out remove the powersupply .. find a way to make it via a battery or a neo mag.

devilzangel
..

@Grumpy

Why are you ever so certain you know everything? Did Erfinder not say he BUILT IT and knows what the heck he is talking about! Otto built his. Can you verify? If not, please SHUT UP!

peace

ChrisC

I think we can all appreciate Otto's effort here. However, replication of a device that requires tuning and an unknown interaction of parameters is very hard to do. At the end of the day only Otto knows what is happening around his device.

More importantly a claim that a device is working has a number of effects, one of which is that work stops on other avenues of research. As such, a claim, such as Otto is making, does require more than just an interpretation of an anomalous set of events. It requires a further set of test, along the lines, of, I believe that the results show x,y,z is happening. If this is the case, then I should be able to measure ab,c, or do test 1,2,3, which will also CONFIRM my findings.

It is the confirmation stage where so many experiments fall by the way side. Experienced engineers know this to be the case. Grumpy et al, are only pointing this out.

Quote from: bob.rennips on June 06, 2007, 05:15:12 PM

It is the confirmation stage where so many experiments fall by the way side. Experienced engineers know this to be the case. Grumpy et al, are only pointing this out.

thanks for that post .. it said what i was thinking .. this is the reason i (and other members) are requesting Otto to put in the effort of writing out the experiment in a scientific manner so that any n00b can read it and know what he is talking about, without having to read all of his posts in this thread as well as the German thread. This way it is formal.

then those with the capacity or means to reproduce his experiment can do so and officially produce questions and their own findings and results on the confirmation.

Otto .. you saying that a PDF isnt important is understandable .. fine, make a word document; it doesnt matter what format u use, atleast respect your work enough to document it; it will help fellow OU users to confirm your results. I say this with no disrespect whatsoever.

another thing .. Otto, i think you r a smart person .. so i dont know why u shugged off a comment about being careful about who u show your experiments to .. it may have been a pit that SM himself fell into bc he wasnt cautious .. DONT give out working devices to people without making them sign a non-disclosure agreement!!! otherwise people will play you for a fool.

devilzangel
..

Quote from: bob.rennips on June 06, 2007, 05:15:12 PM
...
It is the confirmation stage where so many experiments fall by the way side. Experienced engineers know this to be the case. Grumpy et al, are only pointing this out.
...

Exactly.

Quote from: chrisC on June 06, 2007, 05:11:29 PM
@Grumpy

Why are you ever so certain you know everything? Did Erfinder not say he BUILT IT and knows what the heck he is talking about! Otto built his. Can you verify? If not, please SHUT UP!

peace

ChrisC

I do not know everything - I just know that you are too eager to believe something when no facts are provided. 

I talked to "Erfinder" directly and he stated that he had "not" built it (he also added that it "changes nothing").  Had you the "insight" - you would agree with what I am saying.

OK!

Otto asked me to just build it.  I'll compile what I can find of the details - ask for the rest - and start winding.

Ain't that much wire anyway.

If anybody needs a punching bag then here I is.
I built the GK4 from Otto's mechanical specs. I added the bailing wire on my own from SM. I got the 22awg @ 200 windings from c0mster. The frequencies were just sweeps. An obvious thing to do. The timers are adjustable. It was plugged into the wall. Just way too simple. And oh what I experienced by experimenting! I don't recall anybody else doing this. And it was so easy to do. Alot of people wanted to know what I did. What I did? Please. I posted full specs. What Otto showed us was the 3 freq tied together at the end for the phase cancellation that produces extremely fast rise and fall times. SM showed us two metals. C0mster showed us smaller wires for the better field. Otto showed us the 50 turn coil. The GK4 has 12 of them. I cooked my hand and head. These are very real results( was told by the top dogs immediately to stop). Now Otto shows us these things again and we pick on him. I will not go there. He has shown us now 2 very heavily embedded secrets of this technology. The mobius winding(grumpy posted the dynamically changing impedance), the aluminium (verified by the circut in the middle reason), in 4 ways. The winding of the GK4(his first coil, my labor. Yes you read that correctly) and the 50 turn coil, the 3 frequencies(in 2 diagrams!), the aluminium in the middle.
I took Marco's last posted coil and saw small results. I put an aluminium plate top and bottom and get the sh*t scared out of me, again. Ooooweee. This coil again shows 3 frequencies applied.

We are not done. We are being asked to follow over and over again. I have been. We will get there. If not, I will just by following patiently. I got time. The pump prices are starting to bother me though.

I just got beat up by posting too much about the safety for the umpteenth gabillion time. I expect to see smoldering flesh from somebody elses posts then. And do you know why? Because there is no gray area at this point. Otto also just posted about the smoldering insulation. and looking for the sweet spot. Well when you get to this point you are shooting yourself with vhf, microwave, and xray speeds of frequencies, verified in another conversation I had elsewhere with Cavetronics. I posted about dangerous thinking. Why? Because is very hard for me to test now knowing what the outcome might be. Otto just did more than cook insulation.

Just experiment and smack that copper! Obtw, now Otto, Marco and I are the only ones that spanked the aluminium. We have seen the next level. Sounds silly, don't it?

Quasimoto stated 'I ring the bell'. Poor guy was half deaf from holding onto the clanger. We should be so lucky, eh?

--giantkiller. It all works. It's all good and no black holes or crash sites in my neighborhood, yet...

@Grumpy

Maybe you spoke with another Erfinder and because of your huge ego, he has decided it "changes nothing" for your own "insight".

Just reproducing some excerpts from master Erfinder himself:

Hi, sorry to have to burst your bubble, but I don't think you know what I am doing! I am not trying to do
anything. It's done! You are trying! (Please don't take offence to this) You cannot explain what is going
on in my circuit with mainstream science as your basis. If you could people all over the world would be
replicating Tesla! Free energy as we mistakenly call it would be the norm.....

As for me, what do i know?

Peace

chrisC

I have his personal email and his first and last name - as do a couple of other people.

I also know he shut down his site and started another - think it is "exclusive".

As usual, you are talkiing out your ass. 

You may want to look at his thread - back around page 8 and see some of the post I made.  I know very well what he was talking about.

Chris, I'm pretty sure that was unnecessary. Grumpy is bringing up valid points, although, they are not what some may want to hear, they are valid, and eventually need to be addressed.

now Otto says that it's a conversion device. Perhaps the power out vs. in is difficult to meter.

The only thing I can say is build it. Find out. I have just bought two sizes of crocheting hoops, or knitting hoops. I really don't know what they are for, except they are for some kind of artsy fartsy crap. 4" and 6" respectively.

I bought some speaker wire, and have some 30 awg, and 28 awg wire at home for the controls, and three gennies.

given some time, i have what I need to reproduce, if I can depend on otto's help.

C'mon guys, lets try to understand what he's done. There's nothign really to lose in trying it.

Regards,
Rich

@Grumpy

I will say no more. If you can replicate and prove Otto was blowing smoke, I will tip my hat off to you! Somehow my bad ass is more inclined to believe there was no smoke!

Peace

chrisC

Quote from: Grumpy on June 06, 2007, 05:42:36 PM
OK!

Otto asked me to just build it.  I'll compile what I can find of the details - ask for the rest - and start winding.

Ain't that much wire anyway.

I've already done that, dude. just download the pdf.

At gk, I didn't spank you (if you are referring to my rant) for speaking about security. If you think I did, read it again. It's tight lips I have a dislike for. WITHHOLDING INFORMATION, IN LIEU OF DISSEMINATING SAFETY INFO. Is what I think is wrong.

The govt does things "for our own safety" all the dang time. We dont' need that.

We need to read the safety info, and disclaimers and push forward.

Rich

Hmmm people say argument is nonproductive . I believe all of this was very motivational   to many in this thread. 



Just Build It
IronHead

OK Kids if i have to stop this car someones going to be in trouble ....hahahahaha
I hope Otto reads this . I think it's great Otto has gotten this far and think he deserves respect as a reasercher. It will not change the fact of what I'm working on . It just gives me insite to whats going on and many just maybe theres someting I missed or can use in my reasearch , THAT WHAT WE CALL SHARING , it's not written in stone ! . I have never followed the easy road , so everything helps at this process. I find that most people want to EASY button, I wish there was one.  I strongly feel that Otto wants to share but afarid of being flamed or the reshearch is not all proven and still has questions to be answered , so i see why he doesn't respond at all the questions. do your reasherch and listen to others matbe what your working on could lend information to others to use in there projects.  READ study and utmost understand what your reading and apply the tecknowligies. I'm like otto right now my Occiliascope is on the bum so I'm still working and testing just move along and do your project and maybe you will have someting to offer.. Mike thank you , PS not spell checked

DELETED.

You are all obviously having fun doing what you are doing. I'll butt out of these thread and become just a lurker for a while.

updated document per otto's request.

please review it otto.

Also, I was looking for that cross section cut out pic of the TPU.

if anyone has anything else that I missed please let me know.

Rich

Here is an obvious confirmation test that Otto should already have done. Given that it's postulated that the mobius coil is causing some of these effects that are observed then a test should be done that removes the mobious coil and collector from the circuit.

1. Take a scope shot across the lamp as per Ottos configuration.
2. Disconnect the collector, where the words '0' and 'phase' appear in the diagram in the pdf, and again take a scope shot across the lamp.

If the mobius coil/collector is doing something anomalous then you should get strikingly different results. However I believe that there will be no difference once the frequency has been readjusted to take into account the length of wire in the collector coil.

Will Otto do this 30 second test, to confirm that his interpretation, of his results is warranted ?

@ bob
Otto already said in my thread that without the mobius band it will not work at all. 

@ Rich
Thank you again for taking the time to update the PDF.  We do appreciate it.

@everyone
Those of you with equipment and electronic skill, PLEASE spend the time replicating.  If I had half of your skill and some equipment, I would not have to wait for my partner tomorrow night to help me, I would have been on this last night, already posting reports.

Once we see that Otto's coil does indeed work, we can move on to "tuning" the coil to resonant freq. of SM's.  Tuning our Controllers, etc. etc.  Do not think for a moment that SM's final coil looked like his first.  He spent years and years developing the tech.

So let us be cautiously optimistic, and build it.  bob, build it and you can do that 30 second experiment and post it.  You guys have such gifts, some of you and don't realize it.  When you understand what Otto is talking about the "power", you will understand the awe he is in.  A mini particle accelerator that harness's the power of lightning at 245 KHZ, the magnetic field of the earth, etc.  A LOT of power.   

Anyway, enough has been said for the day, we need now to build and post ACCURATE information and drawings to help everyone on the forum.


Let's give our children the lightning!

Bruce

@Bruce,
Thanks.

@spinner.bob,
I have always posted in a manner to bring people into this information. I don't know it all. What about we have a truce. You tell the 14 yr old male who is new here reading this not to dissect a flyback and plug it into the wall, ok? I wouldn't want to spoil his experience with my ego.

To all,
Disregard any of my previous posts. I did not realize they offended anyone. I thought all information and everyone had value. And please don't respond to this, either. It isn't worth the electrons.

--no name. :-X

DELETED.

You are all obviously having fun doing what you are doing. I'll butt out of these thread and become just a lurker for a while.

I suspected that without the ground connections we cannot equate to a useful power out. Maybe I don't know. That would be supposition on both parts, eh?

Quote from: giantkiller on June 06, 2007, 10:30:40 PM
@Bruce,
Thanks.

@spinner.bob,
I have always posted in a manner to bring people into this information. I don't know it all. What about we have a truce. You tell the 14 yr old male who is new here reading this not to dissect a flyback and plug it into the wall, ok? I wouldn't want to spoil his experience with my ego.

To all,
Disregard any of my previous posts. I did not realize they offended anyone. I thought all information and everyone had value. And please don't respond to this, either. It isn't worth the electrons.

--no name. :-X

Truce. I'll butt out and become a lurker on these threads.

Quote from: bob.rennips on June 06, 2007, 11:41:52 PM
DELETED.

You are all obviously having fun doing what you are doing. I'll butt out of these thread and become just a lurker for a while.

Fun should absolutely be part of the journey here, but objectivity is required now and again as well. Bob and Grumpy et al have provided some apparent much needed "down to earthness", and I commend them for that.

Keep it up guys, sometimes things get polarized too far in one direction, and these "reality check" posts are a welcome sight.

Regards,
Darren

Translation of Otto's message
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg33919.html#msg33919
in German language thread

Gabi was contributing thoughts regarding Aluminium

Quote from: otto translated into English

Hallo Gabi,

I have got to get a move on.

In the big 15" TPU AlMn (Aluminium Manganese alloy) [not pure Aluminum] has to be used, in order to boost the extractable energy level!!!!

I was mentioning all you physics experts, because I only have my fingers to do temperature testing. It is you who please should  take up the work from this point on. I just wanted to give a hint to inquisitive researchers.

After all I only have my fingers to work with and to make tests with.

Please translate into English, as I think as many people as possible should get involved to save our poor planet.

Yes. The wires length of the control coils is veeeeery critically important. As I already said: it?s the first thing I have to optimize further.

Otto

Thank you Gustav22 for remembering us! :)

Please have Otto look at GK's and My questions on my last post on my thread and help us out.

Thank you much,
Bruce

Quote from: gn0stik on June 06, 2007, 08:09:09 PM
updated document per otto's request.

please review it otto.

Also, I was looking for that cross section cut out pic of the TPU.

if anyone has anything else that I missed please let me know.

Rich

thank you for compiling the current specifications and instructions for Otto's TPU. now people can get down to reproducing what Otto is showing.

devilzangel
..

Quote from: OttoIn the big 15" TPU AlMn (Aluminium Manganese alloy) [not pure Aluminum] has to be used, in order to boost the extractable energy level!!!!

please elaborate on how u know this. Why aluminum or AL MN alloy for that matter?

such alloys are shown to have superconductive properties.

Quote from: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/Xplore/login.jsp?url=/iel5/77/31006/01439592.pdfThe authors present tunneling results for junctions comprising Mn doped Al films produced by sputter deposition, with Mn concentrations in the range of 0-5000 ppm. Our results for S'/I/S', S'/I/S, and N/I/S junctions demonstrate that Al-Mn alloys can serve both as superconductors with critical temperatures reduced from that of Al and as normal metals. The authors find Al-Mn in this doping range to be otherwise identical to pure Al in terms of its BCS-like tunnel characteristics (for superconductors) and its ability to produce high-quality tunnel barriers.

Quote from: http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1974PhRvB..10..278KNeutron scattering studies were performed on an Al-0.5-at.%-Mn dilute alloy at T=80 ?K and T=300 ?K sample temperatures. The incoherent magnetic scattering cross section was measured using the Dubna pulsed reactor as a function of in-going neutron energy, at four scattering angles. The results show a nonzero magnetic moment on the Mn sites and a ξ~6 ? radius oppositely polarized electron cloud around these atoms.

devilzangel
..

Hi devilzangel,

there is no such thing as superconductors.
There are superconductors over certain temperature ranges.
The word superconductor has no meaning except when linked to temperature.

However, should the plates in the TPU be made of AL or AL/Mg the plate temperatures are very high due to high eddy-current heating.  Hot AL/Mg or AL is never a superconductor.  The plates get so hot, the TPU must be turned off after 30 minutes of load.  Talk of superconductivity is nonsense, in my opinion.

Regards, Earl

Quote from: devilzangel on June 07, 2007, 02:37:40 AM

Quote from: OttoIn the big 15" TPU AlMn (Aluminium Manganese alloy) [not pure Aluminum] has to be used, in order to boost the extractable energy level!!!!

please elaborate on how u know this. Why aluminum or AL MN alloy for that matter?

such alloys are shown to have superconductive properties.

Quote from: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/Xplore/login.jsp?url=/iel5/77/31006/01439592.pdfThe authors present tunneling results for junctions comprising Mn doped Al films produced by sputter deposition, with Mn concentrations in the range of 0-5000 ppm. Our results for S'/I/S', S'/I/S, and N/I/S junctions demonstrate that Al-Mn alloys can serve both as superconductors with critical temperatures reduced from that of Al and as normal metals. The authors find Al-Mn in this doping range to be otherwise identical to pure Al in terms of its BCS-like tunnel characteristics (for superconductors) and its ability to produce high-quality tunnel barriers.

Quote from: http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1974PhRvB..10..278KNeutron scattering studies were performed on an Al-0.5-at.%-Mn dilute alloy at T=80 ?K and T=300 ?K sample temperatures. The incoherent magnetic scattering cross section was measured using the Dubna pulsed reactor as a function of in-going neutron energy, at four scattering angles. The results show a nonzero magnetic moment on the Mn sites and a ξ~6 ? radius oppositely polarized electron cloud around these atoms.

devilzangel
..

Rich,

I recently posted a redrawn version of Otto's circuit on the German Otto's Nachbau thread (page 31) http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg33925.html#msg33925 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg33925.html#msg33925) in which I changed the 240 degrees to 270 degrees.  Otto has made no comments on my GIF drawing until now.  I think the 240 degrees is an error.

Regards, Earl

Quote from: gn0stik on June 06, 2007, 08:09:09 PM
updated document per otto's request.

please review it otto.

Also, I was looking for that cross section cut out pic of the TPU.

if anyone has anything else that I missed please let me know.

Rich

Rich,

I think I had 4 coils in my head when I thought 270 degrees.  270 is correct for 4 coils, but not for three coils.  For three coils 240 degrees is correct.  I was looking at Otto's 3 coil device and had the open TPU in my head.

That said, in Otto's 3 coil device, unless there is a fixed relationship of 120 degree electrical phase shift between each coil, there will not be a rotating magnetic field.  Feeding various random frequencies into coils physically spaced at 120 degrees will NOT produce a rotating field.

At this moment I can not say whether SM's device needs a classical rotating magnetic field or not.  It could be possible that only radiant events are produced and that these are not dependent on any rotating magnetic field.

Regards, Earl

I do agree to what you r saying .. as the quote stated "critical temperature"

however, SM mentions the electrons moving freely .. (due to removal of flux.) .. thus allowing speeds close to the speed of light (or maybe beyond) .. does that not constitute superconductivity?

devilzangel
..

Quote from: Earl on June 07, 2007, 04:03:54 AM
Hi devilzangel,

there is no such thing as superconductors.
There are superconductors over certain temperature ranges.
The word superconductor has no meaning except when linked to temperature.

However, should the plates in the TPU be made of AL or AL/Mg the plate temperatures are very high due to high eddy-current heating.  Hot AL/Mg or AL is never a superconductor.  The plates get so hot, the TPU must be turned off after 30 minutes of load.  Talk of superconductivity is nonsense, in my opinion.

Regards, Earl

NO, it does not contitute superconductivity.

Quote from: devilzangel on June 07, 2007, 04:57:58 AM
I do agree to what you r saying .. as the quote stated "critical temperature"

however, SM mentions the electrons moving freely .. (due to removal of flux.) .. thus allowing speeds close to the speed of light (or maybe beyond) .. does that not constitute superconductivity?

devilzangel
..

Quote from: Earl on June 07, 2007, 04:03:54 AM
Hi devilzangel,

there is no such thing as superconductors.
There are superconductors over certain temperature ranges.
The word superconductor has no meaning except when linked to temperature.

However, should the plates in the TPU be made of AL or AL/Mg the plate temperatures are very high due to high eddy-current heating.  Hot AL/Mg or AL is never a superconductor.  The plates get so hot, the TPU must be turned off after 30 minutes of load.  Talk of superconductivity is nonsense, in my opinion.

Regards, Earl

   About the magnetic spin. If you watch the so called traveling lights they appear to be moving in a specific direction. In actuallity they are only being sequenced. That is really what is happening with the moving magnetic field. Its all on how the frequencies come together that appear to make it happen. As in a motor. Sequence of events make the rotor move to the next state just happens to be in the same direction. Key is that it works and quite powerful as well.

sugra

free flow of electrons = resistance free current

somehow i feel like u r yanking my chain.

also .. consider the fact that SM starts the TPU with a swipe of a neo mag .. sounds like Meissner Effect characteristics, it starts a flow in the coils (or so we adequately call "pulse").

maybe it isnt a few degrees to absolute zero .. but the characteristics of superconduction r there.

also a link i have posted a few weeks ago in my thread - http://www.amsuper.com/products/htsWire/index.cfm

devilzangel
..

Quote from: Earl on June 07, 2007, 05:16:08 AM
NO, it does not contitute superconductivity.

Translation of Otto's message
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1848.msg34078.html#msg34078
in German language thread

Quote from: otto translated into English

Hi all,

You will start to hate me. You will want to shoot and hang me..

Some time ago I got a PM: people hate Mannix!!!!
Another PM came: the wolfs will tear you to pieces are you ready??

Many people hate Mr.Mannix. Why??

It is obvious. He insists on the use of oscillators with tubes!!! Why???
BECAUSE SUCH OSCILLATORS PROVIDE STABLE SIGNALS AND BECAUSE THERE IS  POWER IN SUCH SIGNALS!!!!!!!!!!

Now let?s go back to my 50 turns test:
Nobody had success!!!! Why??? YOUR  OSCILLATORS ARE NO GOOD!!!! THEY ARE NOT WORTH A PENNY!!!!!

Those with a good background in electronics know what I mean. You need good oscillators, which provide the coil with the necessary strong signals.

Look what Ronotte uses: professional oscillator + MOSFET DRIVER + MOSFET. That?s what I call an oscillator for a TPU!!!! That? what works, and ONLY that.

Now hate me or follow me:

I can see that a lot of you are trying to replicate my coil setup. OK!!!! But I INSIST that you rework your oscillators ore build new ones.
If you can not do this or don?t want to, FORGET THE WHOLE THING!!!!!!Forget that you wish to have a  TPU.
Again: NO GOOD OSCILLATOR - NO TPU!!!!

I hope that was clear.

Otto

more

Quote from: otto translated into English
@Norbert

the open TPU [of SM] has 4 control coils but take a good look at the upper ring. How does it look like??? Do you realize something?Huh


Something else:
please don't feel bad, if I leave a question UNANSWERED. I don't ignore nobody but you see what's going on. A heap of questions and me in the center of the chaos.

My friend G. P. constantly pesters me me to synchronize the 3 freqs. Yea, the good guy is right but I AM AFRAID!!!!!!!!
Really!!! with my NON synchronized frequencies I have fireworks going!!
What will happen with synchronized frequencies?Huh
I will use synchronized pulses at some point, obviously. But rest assured that I will not watch the signals on a scope then .

@Gustav22 .. thanks for the translation .. appreciated

@OTTO - please let us know why u r saying it is an aluminum alloy sink.

@norbert - answering question with questions isNT going to take u out of that chaos. even if the suggestion is wrong, atleast it was put out on the table in the forum for everybody to know that it was wrong .. so others will also think about it  ;D

devilzangel
..

The heat that can be generated by an oscillator with a generous power supply is awesome and I've badly burnt my hands on a number of occasions experimenting with various types of high power oscillators. This thermal runaway effect in the semiconductors  and power supply can be controlled to some extent but high current will always be needed to maintain the heat. Heat is the result of current flow which needs a power source. The reality is that nobody is going convince the group that they have a 'free energy' TPU by using a PSU or battery that is capable of supplying 12V @ a few amps. It really does not matter what documentation or waveforms are produced, no TPU with a 'big' PSU is going to taken very seriously.

Otto talks about his TPU as being a conversion device. I take this to mean that his TPU converts low voltage to high voltage 'Radiant' energy that is needed to illuminate the bulb. I can light bulbs with ease using LC oscilators of various shapes and sizes but my test of a 'free energy' TPU is to reduce the current availability to the oscillator and maintain the lumen level.

OK by all means start with a big TPU or battery but don't just leave it on the TPU without a current limit and at some stage while you are fiddling with tuning be horrified when that smoke bellows out, your skin fries and the workbench catches fire because this is exactly what high current is capable of doing even without cosmic intervention; I've got the scars to pove it!!

Having said this I really do hope that Otto is onto something and he deserves every success and respect from all of us for his huge effort to replicate SM's device.

Quote from: devilzangel on June 07, 2007, 06:40:51 AM
@Gustav22 .. thanks for the translation .. appreciated

@OTTO - please let us know why u r saying it is an aluminum alloy sink.

@norbert - answering question with questions isNT going to take u out of that chaos. even if the suggestion is wrong, atleast it was put out on the table in the forum for everybody to know that it was wrong .. so others will also think about it  ;D

devilzangel
..

oh sorry, it was not a question just a suggestion and i dont even ask for answering.

regards Norbert

@ Rich
Some more great information about exactly what oscillators to use, to add to the .pdf
Also that the Collectors are "two conductors" each as Otto posted on my thread, unless everyone but me had already figured that out! LOL

@ Otto
SM said to start the frequencies up, ONE AT A Time.  First the resonant, then harmonic, and then intermodulation.  That would suggest to me that we do not want the frequencies "syncronized", would it not?

If you are wanting more power, I suggest making your next collectors and "tuning" them to one of SM's specific frequencies, by making sure the "resonant" frequency of your coil MATCHES the first frequency you are using. 

Once I first replicate your work, that is my first task.   ;)

Blessings,
Bruce

Otto,

About the oscillators:

Can you provide minimum current and voltage requirements ?  (I know you stated 5v before.)

What are the specifications for your square waves?  What is the width?  You give a frequency and voltage level.  Are the square waves same width and space? (50%)  Have you tried other widths?

Guys,

about aluminum.

If you read erfinder's posts that inspired some of otto's work, you will note that it's not the superconductive properties, but the Paramagnetic properties of aluminum, that are important, just a note on context if you'll hear it.

I have not been able to start winding yet :(, very frustrating.

I don't think my oscillators will be sufficient. I have to crack one open and see if they use mosfets or transistors. Then i'll know for sure.

Also, I'm kinda short on time as you all know keeping a house clean for interested parties, is a bit of a pain in the neck.

My schedule in unpredictable, and my wife doesn't want me to have my spaghetti experiments all over the place if someone comes to see the house.

*spaghetti of science* I say under my breath.

anyway. we trudge on.

bob, grumpy, chris, gk speak your minds. don't be so thin skinned.

anyway, just a quick shout out to you guys before I head to work.

Rich

Bruce,

this implies to me that the resonant frequency = fundamental freq.
Between the fundamental and all its harmonics exist both frequency and phase synchronization.

Regards, Earl

Quote from: btentzer on June 07, 2007, 09:20:21 AM

@ Otto
SM said to start the frequencies up, ONE AT A Time.  First the resonant, then harmonic, and then intermodulation.  That would suggest to me that we do not want the frequencies "syncronized", would it not?

Hey all,
I asked somebody who should know a bout the possible significance of aluminum and copper.

Cryptic as ever but...I hope that it may be of some assistance to our quest.





About the aluminum and copper...
Do you remember my saying something about finding out that heavily oxidized multi stranded wire seemed to poses special qualities where the generator is concerned? I do remember that being the case although we never figured out why or how it could have any effect.

Quote from: gn0stik on June 07, 2007, 10:40:17 AM
...
bob, grumpy, chris, gk speak your minds. don't be so thin skinned.
...

OK.  I think we are making this too damn complicated.  Overthinking it.

SM had chokes (?) and capacitors in the middle of his rings.  The entire outside appears over-wrapped - just like he stated.  Don't tell me that SM used wire lengths based on a 22.5mm inch.  SM used 3 collectors - not 1 - not 2 - not 4 - three!  He did not state that you had to have three - he stated that three was important and that they could be connected in series or parallel.  I think Otto has taken a turn down another street.

I still hold to the statement that SM made about Tao's comments - "stop the pulse before it reaches the end of the wire".

Quote from: Mannix on June 07, 2007, 11:03:45 AM
Hey all,
About the aluminum and copper...
Do you remember my saying something about finding out that heavily oxidized multi stranded wire seemed to poses special qualities where the generator is concerned? I do remember that being the case although we never figured out why or how it could have any effect.

"Copper oxide" is a semiconductor.  Best copper comes from Chile - somehow it is "different" than copper from anywhere else.  You can still find diodes made from copper oxide - rather large size.  You can heat copper in a fire - wave it around to form the oxide - then use this as a "detector" - old crystal radio trick.

Maybe SM can elaborate - cryptically - about his comments on stopping a pulse in a wire.  Or, if this is not possible - perhaps he can elaborate on "the difficulty he had when measuring the energy in his collectors with normal instruments" in his collectors.  No difficulty is as good an answer.

@Mannix

oxidation of copper is the key to the William N. Barbat patent:

"Applicant has deduced that Leimer's energy magnification most likely was due to low-mass electrons that were liberated and made conductive in the antenna by alpha radiation, which allowed these special electrons to be given a greater-than-normal acceleration by the received radio-broadcast photons. Applicant has further deduced that such low-mass electrons must have originated in a thin-film coating of cupric oxide (CuO) on the antenna wire. CuO is a dull-black, polycrystalline, semiconducting compound that develops in situ on copper and bronze wire in the course of annealing the wire in the presence of air. Such CuO coatings have been observed by Applicant on historical laboratory wire at the Science Museum at Oxford University, U.K., and on copper house wire of that era in the U.S., indicating that CuO coatings were commonplace. In later years, annealing has taken place under conditions that prevent most oxidation. This is followed by acid treatment to remove any remaining oxides, leaving shiny wire."

"Applicant's interpretation of Leimer's experiment is that the liberated low-mass electrons of the semiconductor-coating (copper oxidation) of
the antenna wire were not directly accelerated by the inductive photons of the radio signal, but rather were accelerated to high velocities by an oscillating electric field created in the metallic wire by the radio photons."

Much more to read and understand  here:

http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/files/patrickkelly/PatD25.pdf (http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/files/patrickkelly/PatD25.pdf)

Quote from: Grumpy on June 07, 2007, 11:36:39 AM

SM had chokes (?) and capacitors in the middle of his rings.  The entire outside appears over-wrapped - just like he stated.  Don't tell me that SM used wire lengths based on a 22.5mm inch.  SM used 3 collectors - not 1 - not 2 - not 4 - three!  He did not state that you had to have three - he stated that three was important and that they could be connected in series or parallel.  I think Otto has taken a turn down another street.

This has been a mental hurdle for me too. Only two collectors makes it difficult to comprehend why such a fundamental difference from SM's words would produce the effect. Especially since it was so emphasized my Steven. Let's look at the exact quote from SM.

Quote from: SM
About the collector:

It is three separate coils of multi strand copper wire laid one on top of the other, not interleaved. Three is important. You can do many things with three coils. You can run them in parallel, you can run two in series and one in parallel, or etc.You can run a separate frequency into each coil for better control on large power units if need be.

So is he simply saying that each ring uses a different frequency, or is he actually talking about a the control coils here, and mistyped "collector" in the beginning? Why would he be talking about feeding the collector a frequency? Or since Otto has the controls connected to the collector, is that what he means?

The very next line in the same quote reads:

Quote
The control wiring is vertically wound in several segments around each of the horizontal collector coils. Other control wires are wound around all of the horizontal collector coils together.

It's hard to say in this light, is it not?

Quote
I still hold to the statement that SM made about Tao's comments - "stop the pulse before it reaches the end of the wire".

Otto IS doing this (in my opinion). In fact, anyone who is sending multiple pulses down the same wire is doing this, though they may not know it, or realize it, but it's so integrated into their thinking that they just neglect to say it. Think about polarity, and what happens when the positive of one pulse meets the negative of another, as they pass eachother at the same point in the wire. Think Jumper cable experiment.

Quote

Quote from: Mannix on June 07, 2007, 11:03:45 AM
Hey all,
About the aluminum and copper...
Do you remember my saying something about finding out that heavily oxidized multi stranded wire seemed to poses special qualities where the generator is concerned? I do remember that being the case although we never figured out why or how it could have any effect.

"Copper oxide" is a semiconductor.  Best copper comes from Chile - somehow it is "different" than copper from anywhere else.  You can still find diodes made from copper oxide - rather large size.  You can heat copper in a fire - wave it around to form the oxide - then use this as a "detector" - old crystal radio trick.

Maybe SM can elaborate - cryptically - about his comments on stopping a pulse in a wire.  Or, if this is not possible - perhaps he can elaborate on "the difficulty he had when measuring the energy in his collectors with normal instruments" in his collectors.  No difficulty is as good an answer.

This is quite interesting, however if I'm using shielded copper collectors and controls, how do I get them to oxidize? And what does that have to do with aluminum? This is the part that's cryptic to me. Curiouser, and curiouser.

Regards,
Rich

Hey guys,

Thank you Mannix for sharing what SM wrote back.

Now my take on all of this.  Some time ago, I had run across oxidized copper, (oxidized iron, etc).  Anything oxidized will put more ions (electrons) off into the vortex of particles, in particular, oxidized copper.

Now, Aluminum, WHEN HEATED, puts off many Ions (electrons) into the vortex of particles. 

The ALLOY that Otto refers too, puts off TWICE as many, (when Hot) but is STILL diamagnetic.

Again, SM started with one thing and after much research he ended with changes for the better.  Oxidized copper, later R&D alloy, or both.

Thank you for your time,
Bruce

Quote from: Mannix on June 07, 2007, 11:03:45 AM
Hey all,
I asked somebody who should know a bout the possible significance of aluminum and copper.

Cryptic as ever but...I hope that it may be of some assistance to our quest.





About the aluminum and copper...
Do you remember my saying something about finding out that heavily oxidized multi stranded wire seemed to poses special qualities where the generator is concerned? I do remember that being the case although we never figured out why or how it could have any effect.

In reference to the oxidation:

Why is multi-stranded wire used for speaker wire vs. solid copper?

What are the beneficial characteristics of Litz wire?

Think guys.

Darren

Well, you can accelerate electrons by applying a perpendicular magnetic field - which could be pulsed - or making them rotate faster and faster in a trap which also uses a perpendicular field - interesting...

If you accelerate the electrons in a wire - then you increase the velocity of the drift current - then you increase the current - like if you increased the voltage.  So, you could increase a small milliamp signal to a higher and higher current by repeatedly kicking it in the arse with a perpendicular magnetic field.  You would also start the initial flow if you waved a magnet past the coil...very interesting.

Solar flares - magnetic reconection - magnetic fields colliding charging electrons to rediculously high levels - boda bing - boda boom - that just might be workable...

Side note: what if you applied magnetic reconnection to eddie currents?

Quote from: gn0stik on June 07, 2007, 12:03:39 PM

Quote from: SM
About the collector:

It is three separate coils of multi strand copper wire laid one on top of the other, not interleaved. Three is important. You can do many things with three coils. You can run them in parallel, you can run two in series and one in parallel, or etc.You can run a separate frequency into each coil for better control on large power units if need be.

To me this is a clear indication that SM applied a signal to each collector - be it a different one for each or the same for each, he applied a "frequency" to the collectors - period.  This is also inline with his statement about starting the oscillation in the collecter which started the current flowing and allowed for the magnification.

Quote
Otto IS doing this (in my opinion). In fact, anyone who is sending multiple pulses down the same wire is doing this, though they may not know it, or realize it, but it's so integrated into their thinking that they just neglect to say it. Think about polarity, and what happens when the positive of one pulse meets the negative of another, as they pass eachother at the same point in the wire. Think Jumper cable experiment.

The wires are too short for this signal to stop in them - however the drift current may be starting and stoping.

Quote from: Grumpy on June 07, 2007, 12:36:51 PM
Well, you can accelerate electrons by applying a perpendicular magnetic field - which could be pulsed - or making them rotate faster and faster in a trap which also uses a perpendicular field - interesting...

Sounds like a particle accelerator. Do electrons exist as an entity in themselves, or are they always associated with an atom or ion (i.e plasma)? I believe the latter.

Quote
If you accelerate the electrons in a wire - then you increase the velocity of the drift current - then you increase the current - like if you increased the voltage.

I believe the only means of increasing drift velocity is by rendering the wire superconductive.

Quote
Solar flares - magnetic reconection - magnetic fields colliding charging electrons to rediculously high levels - boda bing - boda boom - that just might be workable...

Side note: what if you applied magnetic reconnection to eddie currents?

Magnetic reconnection is limited to plasmas is it not?

Darren

Quote from: Grumpy on June 07, 2007, 11:36:39 AM
I still hold to the statement that SM made about Tao's comments - "stop the pulse before it reaches the end of the wire".

If we stop the pulse before it reaches the end of the wire, are we creating a travelling EM wave?  Or are we creating a charge density wave in the wire?

If we are creating an EM wave, and we launch an identical wave from the other end of the wire, in the middle the two waves will combine momentarily with twice the voltage and twice the current, thus twice the power.  (Pin=V*I + V*I)  (Pout = 2V*2I)

Hmm....

More food for thought - particle accelerators - see attached:

Also, when you initially apply voltage to a conductor, the electrons first align with the potential, then they start to slowly move and you have "current".  Like I have said many times before, stop them before they move and you just twisted them and then let them twist back - like you got them all excited and then told them no...pisses them right off! 

Anyone have Eric Dollards book set?  What does he say about Tesla's RE discharges - he reproduced them...

Will pick up a DPDT relay tonight - want to try to duplicate Thompson's Induction coil charging effect that led Tesla to RE.  Thompson pulled continuous white arcs off doorknobs while the induction coil was running - damn easy to make - should at least try it.

 @ Z-P-E
You asked, "Why stranded wire and not solid." 

SM taught us that the electrons reside on the "surface" of the wire.  Using stranded wire gives you much more actual "surface area" than solid wire.  More surface area, more ions (electrons) for our mini particle accelerator.

@ All
My take on the "superconductor" question, is that somehow through the unique process of the three frequencies, mobius turns, etc.there is a disabling the flux of the wire the electrons move free as SM stated.  Once free, then "SR" Einsteins Special Relativity theory comes into play.  This is also the Cannon Ball story by SM.  This is the "Reason" the Electrons can speed up to the speed of light.

Now on Otto's coil, I will attempt to replicate it exactly.  BUT I still feel there are some missing components.  NOT to make it work, but to make it work more "efficiently".  I do not want to get into those now until after a replication.

Cheers,
Bruce

@Otto

Better hurry up! MIT is on your heels!

http://www.engadget.com/2006/11/15/mit-makes-case-for-wireless-power/

chrisC

@gn0stik & Mannix .. thanks for shedding some light on the matter of using aluminum alloy. I dont know if the oxidation would contribute to the results we see in SM's videos. again, that a guess based on certain intuition .. the block in the center is still a mystery to me, if it was getting very very hot, it is probably bc it is getting in the way of the VERY fast rotation of the magfield. also, if the whole process was releasing microwaves, it would show some obvious affects on the aluminum.

here is what i think happens in the TPU in sequential order:
SM swipes a neo mag which starts the initial flow (pulse), which in effect starts the pulsers/freq. controls by some mechanism that acts like a switch (when it receives a pulse, it closes the circuit from a battery to the freq. gens, thus feeding the freq. gens) .. these frequencies build up causing a rotational pattern to form from shorts/kicks; which causes the progressive speeding of the shorts (kicks) in a rotational pattern due to increased flow-ability of the electrons due to more and more flux cancellation, this results in an even faster rotating mag field evident by the compass, hence the turbine scenario. This fast acceleration causes heat to build up due to the obvious inertial situations, as well as the kicks .. these kicks eventually form what "looks" like a fluid sine wave, which allows the bleed through of radiant energy into the  collectors. 

i dont think that just removing the flux will make the electrons reach close to light speed, since one has to think of the relativistic affects on the mass of the electron.

devilzangel
..

Appears that it will take an extremely high voltage to make an electron approach light speed.  A voltage pulse would cause a short sudden increase in velocity.

Maybe we are not looking at this the right way.

Guys,

This is NEW TECH, old rules do not apply.  Remember SM's story about the diamond needle playing a vinyl record.  NOT IMPOSSIBLE< It just has not been done..till SM, Then Otto, and soon me and others who replicate it.

Reread SM's Posts about HOW the Electrons speed up to the speed of light.  It is the THREE FREQUENCIES that speed them along!!  ;)

But all the discussion falls short, TIME TO BUILD!
I start tonight, and I am very excited!

Cheers,
Bruce

Quick exert from Wikipedia on the electron:
Electrons in an atom are bound to that atom; electrons moving freely in vacuum, space or certain media are free electrons that can be focused into an electron beam. When free electrons move, there is a net flow of charge, this flow is called an electric current. The drift velocity of electrons in metal wires is on the order of mm/hour. However, the speed at which a current at one point in a wire causes a current in other parts of the wire is typically 75% of light speed.

So electrons move through the conductor very very slowly and at higher frequencies move faster on the surface as per the "Skin effect".
If its true that we can get electrons to speed up in the copper, even just a small amount, you will end up with hugh amounts of current.

As for electrons moving at the speed of light, this would only occur when being boiled off from a red hot element, i.e. the coil in a flourescent tube or the cathode ray tube.

Whether its possible to get a few electrons moving very quickly I don't know.

Using high power valves and coils running at different frequencies reminds me of the Philadelphia Experiment where (allegedly) they tried to make a battleship invisible to radar during the war.

Incidently Bruce, what are you using for your 3 freq. generators?
Are you going to put then inside the TPU?

Rob

@ Rob
My partner, has 4 mini function generators he had put together as kits, plus a "real" function generator and scope.  So we are in good shape there.  Sorry I do not have specifics...I will post all of that when we get to that point.

Cheers,
Bruce

A very interesting read!
mechanically it does not quite fit....much of else is familiar in light of what Otto has shared with us as well.

Oh lady theory!... only in hindsight do we ever really adore her.

Quote from: tak22 on June 07, 2007, 11:47:42 AM
@Mannix

oxidation of copper is the key to the William N. Barbat patent:

"Applicant has deduced that Leimer's energy magnification most likely was due to low-mass electrons that were liberated and made conductive in the antenna by alpha radiation, which allowed these special electrons to be given a greater-than-normal acceleration by the received radio-broadcast photons. Applicant has further deduced that such low-mass electrons must have originated in a thin-film coating of cupric oxide (CuO) on the antenna wire. CuO is a dull-black, polycrystalline, semiconducting compound that develops in situ on copper and bronze wire in the course of annealing the wire in the presence of air. Such CuO coatings have been observed by Applicant on historical laboratory wire at the Science Museum at Oxford University, U.K., and on copper house wire of that era in the U.S., indicating that CuO coatings were commonplace. In later years, annealing has taken place under conditions that prevent most oxidation. This is followed by acid treatment to remove any remaining oxides, leaving shiny wire."

"Applicant's interpretation of Leimer's experiment is that the liberated low-mass electrons of the semiconductor-coating (copper oxidation) of
the antenna wire were not directly accelerated by the inductive photons of the radio signal, but rather were accelerated to high velocities by an oscillating electric field created in the metallic wire by the radio photons."

Much more to read and understand  here:

http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/files/patrickkelly/PatD25.pdf (http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/files/patrickkelly/PatD25.pdf)

If you want to age your copper wire- go to Homedepo they have copper Patins (acid ) to make things look old. it will leave the coating on the wire. the only problem i see is that the insulation will have to be delt with, on enameled wire. Old styel tuners and recive coils that were croded seem to work better after they aged a little , if you moved the tap to retune, it was customary to just clean the small area the tap was moved to.        if someone wants to try this take a round magnet about 2 inches long and glue a stick in the middle put it in the center of the ring and spin it fast. have fun ,,,,Mike

Hi Bruce,
Are you driving the mosfets with a mosfet driver like the following:
http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ucc37324.pdf

This device will allow the mosfet to be turned hard-on/off very quickly so you get a good square pulse.
As you probably know that any curves in your output wave will introduce power loss through the mosfet.
This is of course using a none inductive load to test with like a 12V bulb.  When its coupled to the coil then I expect the shape to be curved again, but I think this would be OK.

Rob

Hi all,

I DID IT

THANK OTTO!!!!!

Please as I'm writing full-time no discussion now...be patience for a few days.

Roberto

@ Roberto
GO! GO! GO!
WAY TO GO!!!!!!
Congratulations To Otto and Now to Roberto for a successful Replication!!!
    :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) ;D

@ Meggerman

Otto is absolutely correct on the oscillator comments and no, we do not have that...yet.
We tried to wind the collectors of Otto's TPU and want his confirmation that they are correct.  We still need to know it the double mobius is correct and if the wires need to be "on edge" around the core as one of his drawings depicts, or if it is flat against the core.  We will be putting together all of the components that Otto says.  As near a true replication is possible.  If Otto posted a drawing of his oscillator circuit this of couse would help...alot.

Cheers,
Bruce

Hello all,

I was informed by my last guest that he sent pictures of our signals and a short comment to CERN. We are waiting for comments and reactions (if'??) from them.

Here was mentioned a particle accelerator. Yes, the TPU is a particle accelerator. And the effect was shown in the video. But this is ONLY ONE effect or to say it better one way to use the hugh energy that can deliver the TPU.

The point is: there is a frequency mix. When this frequency mix reaches the point of "success" your equipment is destroyed. So we must use a frequency AWAY from the point of "sucess".
With an alloy we are able to use the TPU far away from the critical frequency mix. This is the point.

You wonder how I know about AlMn, about everything Im wrighting.

1. I have readed Erfinders posts and grabbed what I needed (thanks Erfinder)
2. I have read Esu Manus posts and grabbed what I needed (thanks Esa Manu)
3. I worked a lot

As you see Im only a little man from a little country.

Maybe somebody knows a way to contact Tom Bearden and other "big guys"????

As I want to share, my "mission" is to contact the "big guys" so they can see whats going on.

The time for hiding this genious technology is over. I can only hope the real inventor got a reward for his work.

When I have finally my scope I want to explore just one point. We called it the "SEED".
In this point is the sinus "born". I want to understand whats going on in this point. How the sinus is created.....Yes, we saw how a sinus "eats" a kick.....everything. But the "seed" is special. Not easy to explain.

ChrisC

Why to hurry??? Everything is a long time on this forum.

Otto

Otto,

You are one of the biggest guys here....thats for sure!

Hello all,

I forgot, sorry.

Lets be clever:

Let us together built 3 oscillators that are able to drive our TPUs. In this way the 50 turns test cant anymore be a fail and ONLY in this way we can easily drive our TPUs and in this way we ALL have success.

Lets first find on the net a oscillator that is cheap, easy to built......

I have such oscillators but they are complicated to built.....profi version.

I hope you agree with me.

I INSIST in the 1. time on NOT SYNCHRONISED FREQUENCIES!!! I INSIST!!!!

This TPU biest can easily kill you!!!! With not synchronised 3 frequencies is the danger very big but you maybe have the chance to survive.

Dont even think Im wrighting crap!!!! I exact know what we have and you cant even imagine.

Otto

Hi Otto,
what about an oscillator that drives a shift register and
puts out at 3 outputpins  3 pulses, but all in a sequence,
so we could use a master oscillator at the input and always
have a rotating field as each of the 3 coils get their
pulse in a sequence, so the field is always turning ?
Then we only need to find the one frequency for our
master oscillator...


Hallo Otto, ich schreibs auch mal in Deutsch:
K?nnen wir nicht auch nur einen Master-Oscillator nehmen
und den ?ber ein Schieberegister einspeisen und
so dann an 3 Ausg?ngen immer einen sequentiellen
Puls rausbekommen, so dass an jedem AUsgang dann
der Puls "weitergeschoben" wird?
So h?tte man in den 3 Kontroll-Spulen immer
ein rotierendes Feld und br?uchte nur die Master-Frequenz
zu suchen...
Dann ist auch alles immer automatisch synchronisiert..
Falls zuviel Power rauskommt, kann man ja den Masteroscillator
gleich abschalten...

Gruss, Stefan.
P.S: Stecke noch in anderer Arbeit, deshalb komme
ich im Augenblick nicht zum Bauen.

Hello all,

Mr.Mannix,

its a honour to see your words.

The people cant even imagine what a present us gave our master.

Remember Teslas words?

There will be a time......

The era of using "dirty energy" is behind us.

You cant imagine how it is to work with my coils. When you see the moment when the sinuses are "born", they moves slowly to the kicks, "eats" them......

I worked thousands of hours. This time was NOT wasted. I saw the first time in my life how the energy is created.....

What to say. Thanks God, Im in this involved.

Otto

Hello all,

@Stefan,

you want synchronised frequencies. OK. But you already worked with coils, you have the right knowledge. The point is: a lot of people dont know about the power in this TPU.
If allowed, you all are in a way my "family". I dont want to kill members of my "family"!!!

As Im working very fast sometimes it can happen that I touch a wire when the TPU is working. WOW, not nice.
But with synchronised frequencies it would not be only "not nice". It easily can be "not living"!!!

Its on you all to decide. You all are warned.

Otto

Hello all,

I have looked foward to this for years!

Being a small part of this process has been an honour for me ..seeing the fantastic efforts of people here that could do things with  the seemingly sparce information provided in ways that I could not,wether unwilling or unable, humbles me.

Failure after failure... still at it!! you are just the best!

There are so many of you, you know who you are. Thank you for your faith in this process however rocky at times. I have done my best..at times not seen as such.


The unconstructive doubts expressed by some at times have actually horrified me.
Depression has even set in at times.    I am so elated that they have not affected the good efforts of the many,enough to prevent success..we may look back as say ....why couldnt we see it?
I hope so...as we go foward it will serve us well to remember that As we attempt to explain it further along.
This has been a team effort make no mistake about that..Otto stands out because of his tenacity...and his dogmatic attitude to test everything with what he had....a test light and an old analogue meter in the end!.......The efforts of others are not seperate from his success....Little bits here and there.

The work has just begun ....and it is most likely that accidents will happen...anybody want to make explosives?...no?...Then listen to the advice that comes from Otto....who will do his best...and it still may not be safe. so when he says dont sync....just dont!

He might say later sync 1 +2...who knows ...I dont!

If we dont listen we will not learn.....

We all want to be here to continue with the tpu research project.

There is not enough info to make this safe..I hope that it will change soon ...If it does it will be widely available.

If you want a power generator...go to the hard ware store!

If you want to take part in TPU research then this is the place for you and you are welcomed and warned.

I say AGAIN Listen to Otto..and learn...take whatever time you need there is no rush.

Without multiple tpus...whats the point of any of this?

Most of all I hope Steven Mark will be recognised for his TPU...

Let me assure you that he is isolated,poor and quite alone.
If he had his time again he would have not done it...That is what inspired me to write his story  "The master of Magnetics" I will be able to really get on with it soon...The last page needs a diagram!

A document will be produced and you will have to do some work that may not make logical sence to you....it will be  potentially Dangerous.

The biggest favour that you can do for those who are leading you thru this is to succeed for them...because that it is their difficult job....and it will become your job as well...Reliable/safe power generators could take time and  effort..

fantastic times!

Lindsay Mannix




 

@ Otto,

First i wish to say: congratulations as being the first to replicate SM's methods!

You mentioned to build oscillators together as a team. Very good idea!
Is the oscillator you publiced (the scanned picture from a little while ago good enough for this?
If so, I suggest we all adopt that design.

Please let us know as soon as you can. We can then start building oscillators..... :)

Regards

Robert

Hi Roberto,

Well done!
When you say you have "I did it" does that mean you have over-unity?
I can't wait to see your results....

Hi Otto,

I am currently going as quick as I can to build up a cheap high spec. oscillator module based on the DDS chip AD9833.
Its a surface mount device 0.5mm pin MSOP package.
The triangle output from the AD9833 is coupled to a high speed comparator AD8611 and allows you to set a duty cycle.
http://www.edn.com/article/CA324406.html
(scroll down to DDS implementation)

The comparator then feeds a mosfet driver UCC37324 (dual 4 Amp).
http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/ucc37324.html

The driver then feeds your mosfet like IRF3707. (50A 30V).
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/irf3707.pdf

But maybe a higher voltage mosfet may be needed.

The fequency selection on the AD9833 is done using a PIC chip.
I have all the parts except the 25 Mhz crystal oscillator module and the AD8611.
I may have to use a surface mount crystal oscillator device that has no steel can. Because the whole board is going inside the TPU, only the PIC controller is on the outside.

SM must have used DDS for stability,size and sheer simplicity.

Regards

Rob

Hi Otto,

bin in Elektronik seit 40+ Jahren und ich habe einfache, billige, stabile
und sehr gute Oszillatoren. Mit und ohne synchronizierung.

Sagts mir bitte was Du fuer 3 Frequenzen haben moechtest?
Denn hast Du sofort die Schaltungen.

Veroeffentlichen werde ich zuerst nur fuer nicht synchron.
Auch werde ich Sofort-Stop dabei haben, die eventuel als Puls-Schlucker -
um Asgangs-Leistung zu reduzieren - funktionieren koennte.

Gruesse, Earl

Uuupps, I am in an English forum, so here is the English

I have been in the electronic industry since 40+ years and I have simple, cheap, stable, and high-quality oscillators, with and without synchronization.

Please tell me what 3 frequencies that you want, and you will immediately have the desired circuits.

In public, I will only give out circuits for non synchronous operation, at the beginning.  My circuits will also include an instant STOP input, which could eventually be used also as a pulse-swallower - to reduce output power - or as an ON/OFF switch.

Regards, Earl

Quote from: otto on June 08, 2007, 05:36:20 AM
Hello all,

I forgot, sorry.

Lets be clever:

Let us together built 3 oscillators that are able to drive our TPUs. In this way the 50 turns test cant anymore be a fail and ONLY in this way we can easily drive our TPUs and in this way we ALL have success.

Lets first find on the net a oscillator that is cheap, easy to built......

I have such oscillators but they are complicated to built.....profi version.

I hope you agree with me.

I INSIST in the 1. time on NOT SYNCHRONISED FREQUENCIES!!! I INSIST!!!!

This TPU biest can easily kill you!!!! With not synchronised 3 frequencies is the danger very big but you maybe have the chance to survive.

Dont even think Im wrighting crap!!!! I exact know what we have and you cant even imagine.

Otto

Otto, here are the Moebius strips, but I don't know how to connect them.

Please tell me how to connect the red and blue wires between each Moebius and also to the zero and phase?

Hier sind die Moebius Strippen, aber ich weiss nicht wie man die verbindet.

Bitte mir sagen wie die rote und blaue Draehte zu verbinden sind sowie die Verbindungen zum zero und phase?

Regards, Earl

Roberto. Otto, thank you for all your hard work.

I'm very anxiously awaiting your docs roberto, I'm sure they'll be fantastic.

Regards,
Rich

Hi Earl,
See post:
message 33776 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,2235.msg33776.html#msg33776)

As I understand it, and Otto may need to correct me, I think if you follow the lines on the drawing of the coil arrangement for the 6" and 4", there are two independent loops of wire coupled by an air space, so in effect it is like some kind of tuned capacitor. With each of the two plates made up a 6" + 4" loop of one conductor of the lamp wire.
The way the loops appear to be arranged mean that +ve plates for each half of the capacitor (6" and 4" loop) back onto each other.
The only bit I am not sure about is if the twin core cable is laid flat or is vertical.

What sort of frequency generator circuit are you proposing?

Rob

Quote from: MeggerMan on June 08, 2007, 10:09:18 AM
Hi Earl,
[snip]
What sort of frequency generator circuit are you proposing?
Rob

Hi Rob,

I will be proposing simplest and cheapest, able to buy parts at most electronic stores or mail order, nothing exotic, standard, everyday parts.  In spite of this, still the highest quality oscillator, very stable with low-noise and low spurious.  Analog Devices solution has parts difficult to obtain, expensive, and DDS has dirty spectrum.

There are several possibilities, depends on Otto's frequencies.

Regards, Earl

In my Moebius strip drawings, yellow and turquoise only exist to show twist direction.  In reality, they are air or maybe some insulation.

In meine Moebius-Zeichnung, gelb und turquoise Farben sind nur da um umgekehrte Drehrichtung zu zeigen.  In Wirklichkeit sind sie aus Luft oder vielleicht Isolierung.

Regards, Earl

Hi Earl,

QuoteAnalog Devices solution has parts difficult to obtain

In the UK and USA they can be sourced from Farnell and Newark respectively.

Quoteexpensive

Cost in UK ?4.50 + vat
Cost in US $8.00
Samples from Analogue Devices Qty x 2 free.

Quoteand DDS has dirty spectrum.

At very low levels compared to the main signal and can be removed with a couple of extra filter components.

But it is quite complex for the average person, but this is the way I'm going and I may be on my own on this one.
Ahh well I tried...

Rob

Quote from: ronotte on June 08, 2007, 04:29:16 AM
Hi all,

I DID IT

THANK OTTO!!!!!

Please as I'm writing full-time no discussion now...be patience for a few days.

Roberto

I assume you mean you got overunity--CONGRATULATIONS!! :o :o :o

Hello all,

Im really sorry that I cant answer to every question.
An idea:

is one of you guys able to built 3 oscillators NOT SYNCHRONISED and then make my little 50 turns test.

The point is: if you fail then the oscillator is NOT GOOD enough.

You see what ronotte has: profi oscillator - not enough + MOSFET DRIVER = enough!!!

My oscillators are good but the problem is that the output transistors DC 141 and BC 161 are in pairs. Their characteristics are almost the same. I really dont know if you can buy such transistors.

Otto

Otto, Roberto,

Can you confirm what it is you have?  Do you have more spikes or do you have EXCESS ENERGY which is not accountable?  Is it self running, or what do you have?

Roberto said he has it, replicated Ottos work, but what does Otto have?  Have I missed something?

Can you confirm!

If you have confirmed overunity I congratulate you and eagerly await the details!  I also commend you for continuing.  After building and testing multiple TPUs and finding only electrostatically generated spikes for over a year, I lost the will to live...


Best regards,

Dave.

Hello all,

really to all.

Understand that we are NOT speaking about overunity or COP or something like this.

You have to understand that this beast is a CONVERSION DEVICE. It would be totally idiotic to say it converts ONLY kicks int sine waves. Not ONLY this!!!!! As the beast converts it couples more and more to the aether or name it how ever you want.
Yes, you have to understand what aether energy is.

Just google it, if you dont know. Educate yourself as I did a long time ago.

Otto

Otto,

The terms overunity and COP>1 have to be clarified.  If you get more out than you pay for, it doesn't mean you have made something from nothing, we must assume we are converting aether/ZPE or some other form of energy in to electricity.

Let mean clarify my question then, are you getting more energy out that you PAY for on the input by converting something you cannot account for?

Is there a conversion of an unknown form of energy taking place which results in an excess energy output which you did not have to pay for?

If you do not have more energy out that you paid for with the power supply then what do you have?  Surely that means no conversion of anything is taking place except the energy from your power supply being converted to heat in the coils?

By the way, I am not putting anyone down here, just looking for clarification about what you have actually found which has caused you this excitement.


Thanks,

Dave.

Otto,

I understand what you are saying about coupling to the Aether, primal field, whatever term you use.

I understand that the unit is a "conversion" device and will even go so far as to say that your instruments may not be capable of correctly determining the output.   

I will even go further and embrace the device with open arms.

First I must know how the damn thing is wired and what type of oscillator you are using.

Do the oscillators have power from the same 12v power supply?

Is the lamp wire vertical or horizontal?

Are primary and secondary wound over both 6 inch and 4 inch collector?

What type of oscillator?  (Is it a "named" oscilaltor? What components? inductors, transistors, capacitors?)

Regards,

@Otto & Ronotte:

Thank you again both for such perseverence and seeking out the truth. Now we know SM, Erfinder and others really read into Tesla patents what he really meant. All these conventional Tesla experts and know it all people will finally understand there are stuff out there science does not answer.

@ CTG Labs

I think Otto's TPU when operated correctly (close enough to resonance but not to blow it up) will couple ether into reproducible energy many magnitudes beyond what can be supplied through your power supply. The power supply driving the oscillators has no bearing on the gotten power from ether transformation!  That is my understanding. So whether the TPU is self running is not the point.

Peace

chrisC

Hello all,

@Dave

you saw in the videos the TPU. Its a self runner. A tini bit of the output is feeded BACK into the TPU.

Of course my TPU is not jet a self runner because Im not jet on this stage. This is not soooo a big problem. The biggest problem is, as alreday mentioned, to control the beast.

@Grumpy

Type of oscillator - home made - not so a good picture posted in the german topic, very complicated to build. This is the reason I sayd we should try to find a better shematic.....
The oscillators uses a 230V supply
In what sence vertical or horizontal???
Primary only over 6" collector. Not spreaded over all the collector. Just over 1" of the collector.

No, dont say its wrong. Remember SM words: there are a lot of combinations, types of TPUs. Some are good, some are not so good.....

I saw in the open TPU are the controls spreaded almost all over the collector. This is only another way to get the same.

Ha, ha, yes, a "named" oscillator - the Otto oscillator. Please, dont get mad, Im just a little joking.

To all,

now you will say that Im crazy. I have not a self runner......I can only say, NOT JET!!!!

Remember, Im waiting for my scope that 2 people from this forum buyed for me so I can continue to work

Otto

Quote from: chrisC on June 08, 2007, 01:32:07 PM
The power supply driving the oscillators has no bearing on the gotten power from ether transformation!  That is my understanding. So whether the TPU is self running is not the point.

Hi Chris,

Yes I totally agree with this.  My point is, if there is no excess energy coming out, then what do we have?

Perhaps I am just being dumb here?  If there is no excess energy other than the energy from the power supply then why do they think Aether is being converted in to electricity?

And if there is excess energy coming out, ie above what the power supply is giving then that is COP>1 and the conversion of an unknown source is occurring for free.

As far as I can see its one or the other unless I am missing something.

Perhaps I just don't get it...


Thanks,

Dave.

Ok!

Roberto just told me he has a confirmation of excess energy and this must be from the free conversion of an unknown source.

He is busy typing documentation for us and we shall have it by Sunday max.

So, my congratulations to Otto and Roberto and my apologies for mis-understanding your earlier posts.


Regards,

Dave.

Reading back over the recent post from Otto about the oscillators:

BC 161 PNP transistor - 500ns turn on - 650ns turn off - audio application and switching to 1A

BC 141 is the complimentary NPN version.

Are you using these to amplify the oscillator output? (look slow for switching)

These are used in this "Efficient driver circuit" for a flyback transformer and paired - amplify current
http://www.kronjaeger.com/hv/hv/src/fly/index.html

What is the current of the 5v square waves?


Is there another associated effect, or effects, with this conversion - or are we just talking about electricity?  I mean, if the damn thing is levitating, then we need to take a different perspective.

Otto,

I'm still a little confused exactly how the modius collector is setup. Would it be possible to get a picture or a little more info. I do want to replicate this but I think I need a little more info. Sorry.

Also, since your setup is different than Marks, maybe your coil should be called the Otto-Transformer :D

Tim

Quote from: CTG Labs on June 08, 2007, 01:51:40 PM
Ok!

Roberto just told me he has a confirmation of excess energy and this must be from the free conversion of an unknown source.

He is busy typing documentation for us and we shall have it by Sunday max.

So, my congratulations to Otto and Roberto and my apologies for mis-understanding your earlier posts.

Standing by to replicate... ;D
Now that we have free energy, anyone want to work on a reactionless propulsion system? ::)

@Grumpy
Here is the circuit for the oscilator and psu posted by Otto on the German forum.
the other 2 were posted, I forget who by, because the first 1 from Otto was from his original photo copy and some parts were not clear.


Tim.

Quote from: eldarion on June 08, 2007, 02:49:59 PM

Quote from: CTG Labs on June 08, 2007, 01:51:40 PM
Ok!

Roberto just told me he has a confirmation of excess energy and this must be from the free conversion of an unknown source.

He is busy typing documentation for us and we shall have it by Sunday max.

So, my congratulations to Otto and Roberto and my apologies for mis-understanding your earlier posts.

Standing by to replicate... ;D
Now that we have free energy, anyone want to work on a reactionless propulsion system? ::)

Yeah free energy was easy.....now for something a bit more of a challenge... ;D

R.

@Otto

Contacting Tom Bearden's is via his webmaster address:  webmaster@cheniere.org.

Maybe you already know this.

chrisC

Hi all,

all posted schematics of course are good, but not for our purpose, it is necessary to add a suitable ouput stage with 10 nanosecond range rise time, low impedance (<= 50 Ohm) and capacity to drive MOSFET's capacitance gate.

regards to all

Roberto

@Ronotte
Yes I agree, but this was aimed at Grumpy as he was enquiring what Otto was using as his oscillators.

Hi Otto
Back in October last year, you were on a roll.  I wrote that I was going to 70 years old in December and I wanted a TPU for my birthday.  Well this is close enough! 

If I read right, you don't even have an Oscilloscope!  So, I am going to give you my oscilloscope, if you want it.  It is a Kenwood CS-1065.  Three channel trace and 60 Mhz.  It seems in good condition and I never learned how to use it.  It can run on 240 volts by configuring a switch on the back.  I have a CS-5165 instruction manual which seems to have the same specs.  The probe seems marginal?  It is heavy and I will pack it with care.  If you could help with shipping, it would help, as I live on a small pension.  You could use it on risky things.  In case you fry it, you won't be out much money.  I need to know where to ship it?

Turning 70 was a big headtrip on me and I thought my life was over.  Well, the universe had other plans for me and I am off to China to marry the woman of my dreams.  She is the culture of China and teaches folk dance and plays the 2500 year old instruments.  Music has brought us together and to be with her I have to live there.  All this has happened in the last two months.  Getting older?  No way!  Just going to focus on the music from now on.

It has been really exciting being here searching for the elusive TPU. 
Good luck to all!

Tishatang

Quote from: dutchy1966 on June 08, 2007, 03:43:30 PM

Quote from: eldarion on June 08, 2007, 02:49:59 PM

Quote from: CTG Labs on June 08, 2007, 01:51:40 PM
Ok!

Roberto just told me he has a confirmation of excess energy and this must be from the free conversion of an unknown source.

He is busy typing documentation for us and we shall have it by Sunday max.

So, my congratulations to Otto and Roberto and my apologies for mis-understanding your earlier posts.

Standing by to replicate... ;D
Now that we have free energy, anyone want to work on a reactionless propulsion system? ::)

Yeah free energy was easy.....now for something a bit more of a challenge... ;D

R.

Sure, why not?  ;D

(I was kidding in my original post, by the way...just so someone doesn't think I was serious later on.)

Tishatang that is a truly wonderful gift to Otto , I'm sure he will put it to good use. and happy birthday we'll surly miss you. Mike  Good luck and beee happy !

Hi Roberto,
I have to agree with you there, poor choice of mosfet driver:
ICL7667 made by Intersil, pdf document states 1999, so its about 8 years old. Around 200-300mA drive current.
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/63698.pdf

This one is a bit quicker but not less than 10ns
http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ucc37324.pdf

Here we go: DEIC420
http://www.ixysrf.com/pdf/driver_ICs/DEIC420.pdf
Ultrafast, less than 4ns rise time into 2nF load with 20A max. current
Max freq. is 45MHz
BUT, and this is a big but, they cost a whopping 18GBP each, even I gulped at the price.

Burn out 3 of these and you would be slightly miffed.

Roberto, why such a sharp rise/fall time?
What driver are you using?

Regards
Rob

Thank you Rob!
18 GBP to US is $35.38 each times three is about $106.00 towards a working TPU.  Not too bad.  (unless you fry them of course  ;D) LOL 

We need to price them here in the US and Germany and see if we can find them any cheaper.  Or Roberto when he posts his circuit, I am sure will have some suggestions...

Cheers,
Bruce

See file for MOSFET speedup:

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1825.msg20465.html#msg20465

@tishatang

That was really a magnanimous gesture on your part in offering your scope to Otto so he can proceed on his TPU work of excellence! However, I think Otto is already waiting delivery of a new scope bought by 2 members of the Forum since he fried his last scope!

If Otto does not want it, I am pretty sure I can make use of it if you want to send it my way! I have been wanting to start replicating Otto's TPU since I now have a pretty good understanding of the 'principles' invloved. I'll be glad to pay the shipping anywhere in the U.S since I am located in san Jose, CA.

btw, 70 is not old! My father in law is 94 and is very much alive and kicking (however, not like TPU kicks!)

Regards
ChrisC

Quote from: tishatang on June 08, 2007, 06:21:52 PM

It has been really exciting being here searching for the elusive TPU. 
Good luck to all!

Tishatang

Tishatang,
Thank you for your input in the past and good to see you posting again.  You have my respect and you had very good insights into "harmonics" and "mobius" last year.  Congratulations on the marriage.

http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,712.msg16416.html#msg16416

Kent

Kent
thanks

chrisC
I did not know Otto was expecting a new scope.  I have had other things on my mind the last two months.  Life is interesting.  My name is also Chris and I have already made plans to visit a friend in Santa Cruz in about two weeks.  I will be there for 2 to 4 days.  So, we don't have to worry about the scope getting damaged in shipping!  If its OK with Otto, it's OK with me to have it.

I also have three spools of wire about 8 to 10 lbs each.  As I recall one is 30 awg, one is 5 strand litz 26 awg, and one is 12 awg inulated like house wiring only stranded I think?  Make a reasonable offer plus what you said for shipping and I can add that to my travel expenses to China.  Airfare alone is $1200!

Email me your contact info.  I think it is still active?

Tishatang (aka ChrisG)

@Tishatang (chrisG!)

Thanks indeed! First things first, let's let Otto confirm that he is not in need of another scope. I would rather do that first. It's only the right thing to do.

If he does not need it, I will contact you privately via the forum. I'm 45 minutes drive to the Santa Cruz mountain and if your scope is not too expensive and it's available, I'll be happy to drive down to Santa Cruz to meet with you or you're welcomed to visit my home in San Jose!

Will keep in touch! (p/s: my dad's from China)

ChrisC

no complex circuits needed just listen and learn

Hi Grumpy,
Yes I have read the document on gate drives for mosfets but it does not help.
This is what a mosfet driver IC is - a set of transistors setup in a push-pull arrangement.
I think if you are not careful then you will end up consuming more power turning the mosfet on and off than the actual mosfet uses itself to drive the controller coil.
Perhaps you can do some tests to see what switching times you get with and without the speed up circuit.

The DEIC420 I found has 16 bypass capacitors of various values to get the required 20A into the device in 2-6ns - this is heavy stuff.

Anyway, I think Roberto may have a much cheaper and simpler solution.
I suspect the DEIC420 may be overkill.
I will keep looking to see if I can come up with something better.

[edit]
OK here we go, brand new (2006) from Texas Instrument: UCC7200
http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ucc27200.pdf
3A rise/fall time 8ns/7ns (typical with 12v)
Cost $3.10 from Mouser or $2.79 from Digikey
This is more like it, just need to find a UK/European supplier now.

Few more:

TPS2829
http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tps2829.html
2A rise/fall 14ns(typical) 30ns(max) cost 0.61GBP

LM5110
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/55858.pdf
5A rise/fall 14ns/12ns (typical) cost 0.81GBP

TPS2812
http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tps2812.pdf
5A rise/fall 14ns/12ns (typical) cost 0.88GBP

MC34152P (dual)
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/36798.pdf
1.5A rise/fall 14ns/15ns (typical) cost 1.2GBP

IR4426PBF
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/ir4426.pdf
1.5A rise/fall 15ns/10ns (typical) cost 1.2GBP

LTC3901EGN
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/84113.pdf
2A rise/fall 15ns/15ns (typical) cost 3.5GBP

Its difficult to compare specs as each manufacturer uses a different supply voltage for their typical rise/fall time tests, but most seem to use 12v.
So in summary the UCC7200 is the best value for money and its speed is completely unrivaled.

Regards
Rob

Motorcoach1

Somehow I missed your post.
Thanks a lot.  I wished I could have contributed more.
Just hitching on to you guys shirt tails has been very gratifying to me

Tishatang

my supplyer said 26 buks but he uses them in his lazer units so i'ts less mmmm good deal

Hello all,

@Tishatang

I exactly remember your birthday. Thanks a lot for your offer but 2 nice guys from this forum bought me already a scope. In a few days it will be here. Thanks again.

Otto

OTTO that 's  great on the scope , mines stiil done in but looking for a new one , looking for ad older tetronoks 60 unit , but life is good  best wishes ..

Hi Otto,

i am currently trying to devellop a 3D image of your coil.
This takes some time and i am a little bit confused about the wing design.

So i will post what i made so far , and i will change anything which is not good.
If you can tell me what's wrong with the image i can change it so we will eventually end up with the good 3D drawing.

This is the look so far and i will add the coils later when the image is correct.
Marco.

Hi All,
To work out how much power is used at turning on/off the mosfet you can use this calculation I found:
Mosfet input power usage calculations:
P = 2 x 1/2 x C x V x V x f

P=power in watts
C=input capacitance (Ciss) of mosfet gate in Farrads
V=supply voltage
f=Frequency in Hz

So for the IRFU3707Z mosfet (has a gate capacitance of 1150pf) running at 12v and 300KHz:

P = 1150 x 10^-12 x 12^2 x 300000
P = 0.05 watts

In summary the lower the gate capacitance of the mosfet the less power wasted and the faster the rise/fall time.
I'm sorry if I sound like I am ranting on a bit but I feel I need to convey as much info as possible to help people with component choice.
Another mosfet to consider BSC042N03S
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/90464.pdf
Rds On 4.2 mOhms Vds 30V current 50A

Regards
Rob

@Marco

Otto wrote:

Primary only over 6" collector. Not spreaded over all the collector. Just over 1" of the collector.

So this would mean secondary winding over both collectors and thta these will be sitting at an angle.

Maybe you can put them in already and then put it up again for otto to see....

Robert

Quote from: dutchy1966 on June 09, 2007, 06:36:48 AM
@Marco

Otto wrote:

Primary only over 6" collector. Not spreaded over all the collector. Just over 1" of the collector.

So this would mean secondary winding over both collectors and thta these will be sitting at an angle.

Maybe you can put them in already and then put it up again for otto to see....

Robert

Hi Rob,
Thanks. :)

I need to build the image in a step by step fashion to be able to make the changes in time if it's wrong.

otherwise i would have to start over and over again if it's incorrect.
That really takes a lot of time.

Marco.

Hi Marco,

Yeah i understand it has to be modular. What program are you using to do the drawings?

R.

well, i am using many many programs together in a crosslink fashion. :)
it's quite a big list really.
But i like adobe and corel most. :)
Marco

oo oo ooh .. guessing game ... ummm .. i pick .. solidworks 2007, and adobe cs3 extended.

@-[marco]- .. it seems u made the bifilar vertical for each ring .. it make more sense than the "flat" config.

devilzangel
..

Hi all,

here are detailed instructions on how to build & cconnect the Mobius coils.

BUILDING DETAILS

6? Mobius double wire loop

1.This coil loop is composed (in demo unit) by a single turn of standard lamp-wire (two isolated parallel .8mm copper strand wires) this just to ease the assembling.

2.After cutting the correct wire length you must prepare as well an equivalent length of silicon (or  the like hose but able to support >100?C heat) hose 1 cm of diameter in order to setup a support structure for the lamp-wire itself.

3.Form the hose in a circle and fix it by inserting for example a wood inset between the two ends.

4.You have now to glue the lamp wire to the internal side of the formed hose loop. In demo unit we glued the lamp-wire to hose in a vertical way (horizontal would be best but is more difficult to do).

4? Mobius double wire loop

Just do the same done for the 6? unit but this time of course you have to put the lamp-wire on the outer side of the loop. This is to enhance coupling of the two loops.

Control Coils
You have to build 3. Each CC is a transformer so it has a primary and a secondary. In order to do winding you have firstly to prepare a suitable support structure. Remember that the structure must have a longitudinal inner hole to match the overall shape of the Mobius  hose + lamp-wire assembly. When the CC are finished you will have to slide the e assemblies into the Mobius loop and position them at 120 degree.

Summarizing:

? CC structure width: about 1?.
? Primary winding: you have to use 4.20 mt. length. And .5 mm. copper enameled wire.
? Secondary winding: you have to use 10.50 mt. length and .35 mm. copper enameled wire.

NOTE #1: the coils are parallel wound in a CW way. The primary wire will reach the end first as it is shorter. No problem you continue winding of the secondary wire till the end.

NOTE #2: Each CC has a starting and an ending, label on the support structure that wires as next you will follow always the same connection rule (I mean do not slide the CC on Mobius coil in a vice-versa way).

After completed the two wire loops assemblies, you have to put the small one into the larger one and start to do the connections. In Fig 8 you can see an 6? setup (note that the 6? is opened, that just for easy working on).

Hint:

We do suggest in order to avoid errors, to do like this:

1.Lay down on your work-bench the 6? assembly collector loop (1 cm. hose with the glued lamp-wire) leaving the 4 end leads (about 5 cm.) out.

2.   Put the 4? assembly collector loop inside the bi loop leaving the 4 end leads out.

3.   Connect the big loop lamp-wire upper wire, on left side, to the smaller loop lower wire left side.

4.   Do the same for the 4 leads on right side.

You did the job without errors!.

Regards to all

Please feel free to ask for any other building details.

Roberto & Otto

Hello all,

@Roberto

you have saved my life. Now, try to make a little drawing how the controls looks. Please. Im with my "big guy" 15" TPU and mixing the frequencies. Im using only 1 control coil.

@Marco

good so.

Otto

Otto

Hi all,

here is the detailed Mobius schematic as per Otto's request.
Good work.

Roberto

@renotte

Many thanks for the detailed drawing and description. Any chance of a couple of good quality photos. of how the mobius coil & collectors are arranged and positioned?
Thank you.

regards

chrisC

@ Roberto
Great job as always on documentation!  A heartfelt thank you!  :)

@ Chris
Ditto's, We indeed could use a few photo's, and one of the finished product

@Marco
An Accurate 3D rendition like the one you have started would also be awesome

@ EVERYONE

Anything that we can do to ease and simplify replication is of the UTMOST importance.  Not just for us now replicating but for all those researchers in the future who will be interested in this technology!  I'm sure everyone understands how important to realize this.

Thank you and Cheers, We have a new energy source!  Thank you SM!!
Bruce

Hi Roberto,
Thank you for the details.

There appears to be something not quite right with your schematic:
All the mosfet drains are connected together?
This would mean that when any of the mosfets are turned on then all of the control coils will be powered.

You have a n-channel and p-channel mosfet to turn on the final mosfet, so do you feed the IRF7307 with a driver?

Is the 6" the outside diameter of the support tube or inside diameter?

I am still struggling with the construction details:
Left option shows the lamp wire in vertical format, glued to the top and bottom of the support tube.
[edit] image removed.

Regards
Rob

ok so now i'm a bit lost.
are the 6 and 4 " next to each other or on top of each other?
Marco

Quote from: ronotte on June 09, 2007, 09:28:38 AM
Hi all,

here is the detailed Mobius schematic as per Otto's request.
Good work.

Roberto

Roberto, very nice diagram.

Are you going to document your results as well?

Regards,
Rich

Megman,
you have 2 extra lamp wires there!
One each!
All,
They are working hard to get the full document ready....
have a short break.

Lindsay

@meggerman

I think your drawings are wrong.

@all

Please can I remind you that Otto's and Roberto's version are not exactly the same.
They WORK the same but are build differently!!
The collectors in Ronotte's version are inside eachother in the horizontal plane
In Otto's they are ALSO about 45 mm spaced apart in the vertical plane.

I spoke to Roberto earlier today and according to him it is not necessary to have them in different heights as Otto has.

@Marco
Hope that clears up your confusion....

Regards

Robert

thanks.

Hi All,

Is this more like it?

Regards
Rob

Ronotte's circuit schematic shows IFF7307 driving IRFP450 or IRF840. Ideally at least 11V is needed to drive the gates of these and only 6V is available for switching by the IRF7307 drivers. Is this intentional and by design because as shown the IRFP450 / IRF840 Mosfets will likely to be switching inneficiently and dissipating unecessary heat?

Megman,

6" one turn of twinflex on silicone

4" one turn of twin flex on silicone


Confusing,I know  better just wait for the doc it wont be very long have break you are going to need it.

Lindsay

Quote from: ronotte on June 09, 2007, 07:51:05 AM

single turn of standard lamp-wire (two isolated parallel .8mm copper strand wires) this just to ease the assembling.

Connect the big loop lamp-wire upper wire, on left side, to the smaller loop lower wire left side.

Do the same for the 4 leads on right side.

You did the job without errors!.

Regards to all

Please feel free to ask for any other building details.

Roberto & Otto

i see something like this.
at first i was thinking it was two coils on top of each other....
Marco

Hi all,

I DO UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE MANY CORRECT QUESTIONS

Please be only a little patience and you'll find all the very needed answers.
Be sure that together Otto we will provide for any possible detail/answer within our best knowledge.

We are working for all without any limitation. You all are kindly invited to join us in this event.

@Marco
You are absolutely correct.

SO let me see if I understand the construction then, so by using a 1" diameter silicone tube/hose, bent into a loop to achieve an outside diameter of 6" we would then have an automatic 4" inner diameter. Then by gluing the lampcord as marco has shown on the bent tube we have our collectors.

Roberto and otto say to wind the control coils separately then slide them on the collector assembly into the correct positions.

Seems easy enough.

another thought, now maybe I am getting ahead of myself here (something to try after replicating otto's work) would be to use 1/4' copper tubing for the collectors (of course we would need to cover them, perhaps with heat shrink tubing, to isolate the conductors/collectors).

patiently waiting for otto and roberto to finish their doc's and tests.

:)

To everyone who still cant imagine the setup:

There are two tubes (1 cm diameter):

a 6 inch diameter ring with a single loop lampwire glued on the inside

a 4 inch diameter ring with a single loop lampwire glued on the outside

The 4 inch sits inside the 6 inch......

Now look again at marco's last picture and see that he only drew the lampwires, just imagine the lampwires being glued to the tube rings as described....

it's easy......

regards

Robert

Hi All,

I am throwing another drawing into the forum, if it needs to be changed, tell me and I will change it.

Read all the comments from Otto and Ronotte and ECD_Mobius_Schematic.PDF

Regards, Earl

Hello all,

finally. THANKS ROBERTO NOTTE - Ronotte

Enjoy.

Otto

Thanks.

@Otto & Renotte

WOW! That's a lot of documentation and a great job WELL DONE!
Thank you both for such unselfish dedication! You deserve a place in historyThank you SM and others who continues to pursue Telsa's teachings.

Thank you

chrisC

Otto and Roberto, thank you for this milestone!! Very impressive!

Regards`

Robert

@Roberto and Otto!

Thank you for all your hard work on the TPU project!

Excellent pdf Roberto!!!!!!!!!!

All the best,

~Dan

On bended knee I am truely grateful and thankful.

--giantkiller.

Excellent Document Roberto and Otto!!

I have already procured all the necessary components to built this circuit and will be building and testing tonight. I will report back with pictures and video as soon as I get some results :).

God Bless,
Jason O

Roberto and Otto,

What a magnificent job of documentation and explanation.  Your relentless work and tireless testing is shown throughout the document.

Seeing the "seed" was a glimpse on creation.  Very humbling indeed.  I stand in awe of HIM by whom all things consist.

Now it is time to build, and share with as many as possible.  I am humbled to see the "seed" of a new (to us!) power source spring forth.

May history speak well of you and all of those who have worked, some for years, others for months, to see this birth. 

IT IS TIME TO GIVE OUR CHILDREN THE LIGHTNING!

Highest Regards,
Bruce

Hi Otto and Roberto,
Excellent work by both of you, this is outstanding work and dedication towards documenting your research into the TPU.
I have read it from start to finish and I think it will make very useful reference material for my own experiments.

I had no idea that you were both working on this together and working day and night to get it done - outstanding!

What supprised me in the document was the high voltages achieved, sometimes over 500V.

I have been thinking about the aluminium heatsink heating up.
Maybe its induction heating by eddie currents from the various powerful magnetic fields present.
To prove this try a block of aluminium and it should heat up quicker than lots of small pieces or thin sheets of aluminium.

There was mention of a 15" and 16" TPU, is there 2 large TPUs or was it a typo?

In summary have you seen an excessive amount of output?

When Roberto said "I did it" does that mean you are no longer working together?
So Roberto has reproduced the experiments you both did together?
Sorry for all the questions.

Regards
Rob

I'm not breaking out the champagne yet guys.

I've read Roberto's latest document, and although it is relatively well written, there is no mention of what exactly has been achieved in terms of power production.

30W to 40W of power is being consumed by the device, but no indication of output power is given, other than a picture of a dimly lit bulb.

This road has been travelled a few times already with past false alarms, so until solid evidence of some sort of power production over and above that used to power the device is shown, my excitement remains on hold.

Regards,
Darren

@ Z-P-E

Roberto Stated input was 36 watts and output was 100 watts.  That is pretty crystal clear to me!  Time to break open the champagne indeed!  LOL

Quote from: btentzer on June 09, 2007, 06:38:49 PM
@ Z-P-E

Roberto Stated input was 36 watts and output was 100 watts.  That is pretty crystal clear to me!  Time to break open the champagne indeed!  LOL

A statement is not evidence.

RMS measurements of INPUT vs. OUTPUT power is the kind of thing I am referring to.

Measuring 500V spikes into a 10 MegOhm scope probe is not a reliable method of testing power capability.

Darren

Darren,

You can build this and see for your self.
Im looking foward to your experiences here

Quote from: z_p_e on June 09, 2007, 06:32:20 PM
I'm not breaking out the champagne yet guys.

I've read Roberto's latest document, and although it is relatively well written, there is no mention of what exactly has been achieved in terms of power production.

30W to 40W of power is being consumed by the device, but no indication of output power is given, other than a picture of a dimly lit bulb.

This road has been travelled a few times already with past false alarms, so until solid evidence of some sort of power production over and above that used to power the device is shown, my excitement remains on hold.

Regards,
Darren

You'll never cease to amaze me. Jesus had a disciple just like you. He simply couldn't believe. At some point, you'll have to snap out of it... Searching for the truth is great. But when it shows up, you have to recognize it for what it is. So as you would say yourself: "back to the workbench".

Jacob

Quote from: chrisC on June 08, 2007, 01:32:07 PM

@ CTG Labs

I think Otto's TPU when operated correctly (close enough to resonance but not to blow it up) will couple ether into reproducible energy many magnitudes beyond what can be supplied through your power supply. The power supply driving the oscillators has no bearing on the gotten power from ether transformation!  That is my understanding. So whether the TPU is self running is not the point.

Peace

chrisC

Hi Otto & Renotte:

I'm sorry I mis-spelt Aether as ether when I responded to CTG Labs. Ether is a liquid and can be confusing. Maybe the next rev. of your pdf file, you should change it to Aether! Sorry!

chrisC

@Darren

Whist Otto and Renotte did not include any static measurements of rms power (in the typical power engineering analysis sense), perhaps what they tried so hard to show scientifically is that the magnetic coupling effects at some % point close to resonance ( for that set-up of coil type, dimensions and pulsed frequencies & spacing ) draws the magic power from Aether! This is not your electrical engineering analysis of circuit power 101.

I'm pretty sure much more power can be (safely) extracted when the discovery process is more complete. After all, did SM not show without a doubt from the poor quality videos that all you need is some % of feedback power to sustain the oscillations and perhaps some mechanical magnetic flux via a external magnet to 'light the fire', so to speak?

This is only the beginning and let's all keep the process going forward.

regards

chrisC

Hi Roberto and Otto,
first , I have to really thank you for your hard work and very good documentations !

This is the way it must be documented.

Now a few points I have to make after reading your PDF file:

1. Please try to document the input power
besides the pictures when the light bulbs lights up.

A good way for measuring the input power realiable
would be:

PS -> analog Volt and amp meter -> LC lp-filter-> LC lp-filter-> LC lp-filter-> input to mosfet circuit...

So directly after the output of power supply PS you put analoque Volt- and amp-meters
and then have at least 3 stages of LC lowpassfilters with big wire size inductance L in series
and capacitance C to ground, so you have at least a cutoff frequency of less
than 0.1 Hz.
So that will give you an almost pure DC current flowing  from the PS through your meters.

Also put the PS with the meters a few meters away from the TPU, so you have no RF interference.

As it seems in the 2 pictures the 100 Watt bulb lights with about maximum
30 Watts or so brightness, so it is not the full 100 Watts output, that the bulb could take, right ?

So what is your input then at this brightness ? Less than 2 amps at 12 Volts ?


2. The heating of the alu heat sinks could come from the magnetic fields
inducing eddy currents into the alu metal, so just put it more far away from the
TPU if that helps...or do you really need the heat inside the MOSFETS ?

3. What happens, when you use a 10 to 100  nF capacitor parallel to the output at the bulb ?
Do you get then pure sine wave output with a DC offset ?

I also got in my short TPU experimentation a better output, when I mixed 2 oscillators
instead of 1 oscillators into the controller coils.
So with 3 mixed frequencies you could achieve probably even more, that is clear.

4. Maybe you can try it again with big loudspeaker cable as the output cable,
which have many stranded fine wires... also maybe with more loops !
This should even give more output at the same input power.

Many thanks for this great documentation and looking forward to more measurements and updated PDF files.

Regards, Stefan.

Hi to all,

@Meggerman
- of course there are some typos...I'll fix them.
- NO problem I'm working with Otto...only my fault with verbs!

@ ZPE
Thanks for your observations. I just want to say that ECD is not an overunity device. Power supply is needed indeed only to power the 3 oscillator (100% of the time....for now) and the MOSFETs for the first few seconds in order to get them soon hot...and start the particles release cycle. So actually it seems that there are no relations (known by us) to correlate in any way the PS power and the output power in the sense that with the same PS power you can choose to have in theory any desidered output power. That is what we have seen. Again when we are near a 'full conversion' the PS output current goes to ZERO.......that's what we have seen. Of course is difficult to give an explanation according current standard EE knowledge.
I really kindly do invite you to replicate this design and do help us in understanting this new technology.

Regards

Roberto & Otto

@Stefan,

many thanks for your kind words and for the many questions you are making. Please be patience, give us the time to get a pause as we have been working lately so hard. I've not yet had the time even to go to my work-bench (the same for Otto) to start making the many other tests that are waiting (anyway I've to attend my duty in my Office as well).

Actually 'the meat on the fire' is really a lot and I don't know perhaps were to start from!. I'm asking to all of you to help in doing such a monstruos task!  So Stefan why don't you try as well? Of course you can I do know it, so do it! We really are waiting for your tests...we are not joking, it's not a game any more.

One of my first next personal task will be to make a 'GOOD' footage of real operation so you will see it 'on-line' as I understand it seems incredible (for me also), and I'll post it there.

Regards to all

Roberto & Otto

Hello Roberto and Otto,

I'm glad to read your document.  It's very nice.
Thank you very much.

Could you give me detail for collector coil.  How many coil
turn's number for 1cm silicon hose?

Best regards,
nong

Quote from: nong on June 10, 2007, 04:06:34 AM
Hello Roberto and Otto,

I'm glad to read your document.  It's very nice.
Thank you very much.

Could you give me detail for collector coil.  How many coil
turn's number for 1cm silicon hose?

Best regards,
nong

I take it you didn't actually read the document after downloading it then?

Nicely prepared document Otto / Roberto.

From your document it would appear then that you are heating your Mosfets by design in gating them at 6V rather than 11V plus so that you can heat up the aluminium heatsink; I presume you lose the whole effect if 12V VDS is used?

You mention that the current draw from the PSU reduces as the 'effect' magnifies. When a Mosfet starts to runaway thermally, it's RDS increases. This will reduce the current from the PSU. With a good heatsink the temperature differential will be marked between the heatsink and the Mosfet. The mosfet will be cooler than the heatsink. I understand from your report that you have seen both of these effects.

Hi Otto and Roberto,
When the power on the PSU went down to nearly zero, was the bulb still lit?

I think what I need to do now is get 2 more DDS 20 kits and build them into equipment cases and start testing.
You can buy a dds function generator from GW Instek but they are quite expensive even for just one.
One thing I want to try is different pulse widths and different input voltages.
Varying the duty cycle may allow different effects to take place.

The cost of building all 3 generators from scratch into one case using 3 x AD9833 will be about 80 USD.
Thats 3 x AD9833 (DDS), 3 x AD8611 (comparator for duty cycle), 3 x TPS2829 (2A MOSFET driver), 3 x FDP3651U (80A 100v fast mosfet - new), 1 x PIC16F873A (28 pin flash based microcontroller), 1 x 4x20 LCD display, 3 x rotary encoders,20MHz crystal,25Mhz crystal oscillator, case, pcb, push-buttons,resistors,caps,BNC bulkhead sockets,12V PSU.
And probably a few other bits I missed.
For now though I am going for the DDS 20 kits and just chuck them all in 3 cases.

Regards

Rob

Hi Rob,

- in the case of Otto's runaway event ......there were not any loadt at all!!!!! that was his big mistake...pleas read pdf carefully.

- of course he was seeing a full pure sinewave on his still good scope...than BANG.

@Hoppy

read careful the pdf: the Mosfet gets +12VDC (of course trough the CC), the mosfet's driver only are set to +6 VDC as per IRF datasheet

Roberto & Otto

I Have been studying the document several times.
It's a nice documentation about test results however i did not read anything about:

* The gyroscopic effect.
* The Vibration /washboard effect.
* The up side down effect.
* The supposed Interaction with the magnetic field of the earth.
* The inertia effect/ turbine effect, especially the winding down part of it.

i did read something about the turbine effect,but not the slowly speeding up and down compass needle.

Can anybody give out additional information on the above effect's ?

Marco.

Hi Rob...

Iforgot to say that I do like your design proposal. I want to help in this so let's discuss about it, not for the digital synthesizer itself, but rather for his output driver circuitry....I'm not sure you fully understood the needings. Again please make use of IRF840 ONLY as power MOSFET. Soon I will post if IRFP450 or 460 are compatible for this kind of application. I'm going also to send Otto 3 of them. Please remember that MOSFET seems to need only for:
- start the Seed creation process and
- in the beginning to deliver some heat to ease the Al particles release.

Regards
Roberto

Hi Marco,

you are right.  Please be patience as the work done has been really big. Me & Otto have been doing our best. It's time that you help as well: please do it. You may be sure 100% we will help you so you will see it by yourself..it's the best.

We literally have had had not time, that's all. Of course me and Otto will do all possible tests. The turbine effect we have seen is REAL!!  We have seen it clearly.

So, what to say?..... do it and help us please.

Roberto & Otto

@ Roberto

I'm looking at your TPU V4 Magnetic clash test document, Page 14 which shows an excerpt from the IRF 7307 Application Note. This clearly shows a VCC rail of 12V. I understand that the CD4027 requires 6V. I've also checked the IRF 7307 data sheet and it does not mention 6V.

Hi Hoppy,

you are right. I will amend the schematic. The +6V is needed on that schematic only for the CD4027. The IRF7307 does has a max VDS= 20V.

Roberto

@Ronotte and Otto please read

In the best interest of everyone I would like to propose something. As everyone can already see, the two of you will get flooded with questions. Therefore I like to suggest that you take the question that you answer to a FAQ document and upload that every now and then as more questions get answered. That way you dont have to answer questions more then once and as more people are getting involved they can check the FAQ before bothering you. This will probably give you some more time to do other things.....

Second, if you have any other suggestions of how we should pass questions to you please tell us.

Hope you find this a workable suggestion.

Looking forward to your response.

Regards and thanks again,

Robert

Quote from: -[marco]- on June 10, 2007, 05:21:13 AM
I Have been studying the document several times.
It's a nice documentation about test results however i did not read anything about:

* The gyroscopic effect.
* The Vibration /washboard effect.
* The up side down effect.
* The supposed Interaction with the magnetic field of the earth.
* The inertia effect/ turbine effect, especially the winding down part of it.

i did read something about the turbine effect,but not the slowly speeding up and down compass needle.

Can anybody give out additional information on the above effect's ?

Marco.

Hi Marco,
I guess this all comes only, if you use additional feedback coils.

As Roberto and Otto are not yet using feedback coils and still run it
on a power supply, this will probably come next to do a closed loop
feedback.
Probably then we might see these gyroscopic vibration effects.

Not only that, Stefan and Marco, but I think it is important to think of this as a "baby" tpu.  SM took years to develop what we see in the videos.

SM said that even if you did not hit on the proper frequency's that you would still see a "little" power.

To get from this stage to fitting SM's in mechanics, etc.  will take all of us working together.

BUT at least we have a working model to get started with!!

Cheers,
Bruce

Hi All,

anyone know the diameter of inner loop for 16" version ?

Regards, Earl

Hi Earl,

Is it not better to replicate what has already been done without going bigger just yet?

If you cannot get it to work, you will not be able to get any help!


Regards,

Dave.

Hi Roberto,
Ahh so we need to start off with the IRF840, 500V 8A MOSFET.
Which manufacturer: Vishay (formerly International Rectifier), Fairchild Semiconductor, ST Microtronics.
The reason I ask is that they seem to vary in specification.

A very hot MOSFET is every electronic designers worst nightmare but you are using the heat to warm up the heatsink to get electrons to boil off from the surface, very odd.

Here's an idea, mount the MOSFET onto a piece of double sided PCB and put the aluminium into the centre and heat with a blow torch.

The results you had with solder wire was very good too, could you use this in your device despite the temperatures?

I was reading a book today on Quantum Physics - light bed-time reading and there was a chapter on light interference. This was exploring the double slit experiment showing how light waves create an interference pattern when one source of light is passed through the two slits. The TPU has multiple magnetic sources, maybe there is an interference pattern being intersected by the inner coil.

Regards
Rob

TI_Power Management Selection Guide, 2Q 2007

http://focus.ti.com/lit/ml/slvt145e/slvt145e.pdf

for builders

page 23 has FET drivers

Regards, Earl

Hi All,

I am thinking about using a glass plate with the inner and outer coils laid upon this plate.
In this case, the twin conductors would would oriented horizontally.  Maybe to prevent short circuits hold coils in place with silicone mastic from a cartridge.  Glass resists heat (hehehe if the glass plate melts, you have too many toasts in your power output toaster!) and has excellent HF characteristics.
The glass can also hold ALU heatsinks and circuitry.  The first thing to do is use a diamond disc + hand drill or diamond file to remove all sharp edges from the glass.

In this case bare thick copper wire (yellow-green insulated grounding wire in Europe - remove insulation) could used, or the copper wire could be tinned with solder on its surface, since solder appears to give more output voltage.

Regards, Earl

Quote from: CTG Labs on June 10, 2007, 08:18:16 AM
Hi Earl,
Is it not better to replicate what has already been done without going bigger just yet?
If you cannot get it to work, you will not be able to get any help!
Regards, Dave.

There is a saying "God helps those who help themselves".

Regards, Earl

@Nong,
Page 11 and table 2 on the page is an excellant start.

I would like to add that yes this a 'Baby tpu'. The scope shots that appear on page 11 on have been on my scope. In some parts of those waves I did not know what I was seeing until Moab and Grumpy pointed them out. By adjusting the lower frequency I could move the RE pulse up into the electrical pulse. But the circuit would not put out any power or runaway. Probably due to the iron core as pointed out in Otto's & Roberto's document. The iron did get hot but not as hot as the aluminium stated.
That is probably why I experienced hard kicks transmitted outside the coil due to the energy flying out instead of be held in.

We have seen a light lit. I have seen those scope shots in my tests. The tuning of the coil can be aided by adjusting the bottom frequency. I have seen RE pulses on my scope. I could not attain runaway. I could not light a light.
So this is the next stage of power harvesting. And these 2 gentlemen are expressing safety multiple times in the document.

So one more time, a light has been lit and the presence of runaway experienced. I sure am glad there are others that experienced strange things about the operation now. And this is no way indicative to express that I was here first. It was Otto's circuit both times. My windings, his mobius connections. Otherwise I would only have rewound spools of wire. The tpu graveyards are full of those, no? No body is immune.

@Roberto,
Just out of curiousity could you put an amp meter between the bulb and ground to see if current flows regardless of lighting it or not?


--giantkiller. Our history changes as of now.

Thank you GK.    :)

One can easily melt aluminum in a rapidly changing magnetic field do to the Foucault currents (eddy current) induced in the aluminum.

By the way, aluminum does not change color before it melts, unlike steel which goes through an nice range of colors.

Marinov projected his rotating field out of the coils, so it can be "manipulated" and still function - the field that is.

First of all, congratulations to both Otto and Renotte.  I am amazed at the awesome document you put together for us.  It really explains alot, although at this point I can't understand most of it, I guess that will come with experiemntation.  Just don't overwork yourselves! ;)

Have a great day!

-Brian

Hi Robert,

I like very much your idea about to setup a FAQ page and I think as well that Otto would be grateful. Please help us and do it. Firstly you have just to collect all questions and answers coming from me and of course from Otto. This I think would be a great idea.

I will support you in any possible way.

Thank you very much because it will let me spare time to put here in action the ECD and make a film for you all.

Roberto

Roberto's and Otto's document, with my comments added.

Some may not like it, but the attempt was to be constructive and objective.

Darren

For the Q&A sheet:     It has been brought up that the secondary and primary coils are of same weight AG , Does this Rule still valid or do we stay with the charts ?     ok second - There is a free program throught PCB.com that we can have boards made for the occilator setup if we can put together a list of parts and get some boards made. Then we be all on the same playing feild on this one project as we did in the Bob Boyce fourm. Then we could pickout a supplyer we could all use and that supplyer could keep our parts file on hand. ....Mike  I'm In Columbia SC so if theres anyone from here or close lets work to gether or start a group localy 

Quote from: ronotte on June 10, 2007, 05:58:41 AM
Hi Hoppy,

you are right. I will amend the schematic. The +6V is needed on that schematic only for the CD4027. The IRF7307 does has a max VDS= 20V.

Roberto

Roberto

Which voltage did you actually use in your experiments? If you used 6V and change to 12V and drive the oupput Mosfets correctly within SOA, the heatsinks should not get very hot with the Mosfets drawing just a couple or so amps from the PSU. The aluminium will then need to be heated seperately, perhaps from a seperate PSU?

Roberto and Otto, please can you explain in detail, when exactly the input current went to Zero and if the light bulb still lighted then as bright as before ? Thanks.

@Darren

Much as I appreciate your constructive questions on the Otto & Renotte's 1st draft, I think is not that difficult to put together the circuit when all build of materials are there.

If you did that, you would have answered the majority of questions yourself. These two gentlemen are not 'novices' . They understand elctronics, power measurements, including rms measurements. You just need to treat this device as not a typical electronics device where you can average out the current.

Let me make it simplier, if you were in possesion of SM's 6" or 15" TPU. Was there external power to the oscillators? How then do you proceed to measure that? And what rms value would that yield (average output/average input) when there is no input power? Do you not get it?

They are just one step more from controlling 'the beast' so they can feed back that % of power to make it self oscillating! This is not a over-unity device!

Regards

chrisC

Hi Chris,

Can you point out where the excess energy is measured and shown in the document?  I must be thick.  I see dimly lit 100w bulb, perhaps lit to 20 or 30 watts, just a dim glow of the element.  I dont see any OUTPUT POWER measurements of any kind showing excess energy above the power supply.  I just see complex signal adding.  I have to say at this point I agree mostly with Darrens comments.

I am not seeing anything here I havent seen a hundred times over the last year with various TPU builds, electrostatic coupling leading to spikes which contain no energy and with the right mix they can add to large spikes, as do any signals of the right frequency which you mix.  Despite the fact we are still assuming a kick means a voltage spike, someone just assumed that remember!  SM has never said this is what a kick is, infact he talks more about a kick being the physical movement of the fillament in a vacuum tube when current is first caused to flow in it.

And before anyone says go build it yourself, I am not sure what I am building.  If there is no excess energy documented and measured here, what exactly am I replicating?  If there is no excess energy measured here, why think anything is being freely converted to electricity?

Like I said, perhaps I have missed it, if so I appologise and perhaps I need to go back to school...


Regards,

Dave.

Okay, Dave. 

Let me take a stab at it.   :) This is not just an electronic device.  It is not a "coil" setup, nor a type of transformer.  So, what is it?  What do Roberto and Otto think it is?  What do those of us so excited to replicate it and spending said time and money on such, think it is?  An overunity device of some sort, where you input 50 watts and get back some more wattage?

None of the above.  What SM invented and is now in the "baby" replication stage is:

A.  A mini particle accelerator
B.  A reactor
C.  Generator
D.  A NEW source of electrical power.

These guys have just hit the edge of what will prove to be a rich and exciting research, development and refinement process.  This is not the TPU you see in the video's.  This is what SM said about putting any three frequencies into a wire with the proper circuit potential (mobius).  There will be so much more of SM's words to be listened too, to bring this R&D about. 

What Otto and Roberto have hit on is the "conversion" process.  The output of the coils was "converted" power.  Not just DC 12 volt.  Roberto and Otto can correct me if I have described this incorrectly but I think not.

When I and then others refer to this as "the beast" what we mean, is that it uses heat to assist in freeing electrons.  The flux of the wire is disabled allowing the Electons to be float free and then they are sped along at the speed of light, producing kicks and kicks and more kicks.  When these combine, they produce "Big Kicks".  This was SM's words and now that part has been replicated. The more heat it produces, the more it eats, the more it eats, the more heat it produces.  (@Everyone-In the future I have some UNIQUE ideas for that heat.  Remind me and I will tell everyone later.)  This is why I and Otto and others call it the "beast" and must learn to tame it.  The problem will not be how much wattage can you convert.  NO, the problem will be How can you limit the wattage without it destroying itself.

If you or Darren or others choose not to replicate $7.00 worth of wire and a few components to see the "birth" of something new, then that says alot.  But, in the end, it will not matter, because we will replicate it, improve it, implement ALL that SM said about the frequencies, and not try to reinvent the wheel.

If you or others do not understand, then please reread the NEW pdf of SM's posts.  Then if you have the desire, reread my thread, dissecting every portion, most of the time on the money, but a couple of times not.

@ Everyone
I suggest all further questioning of Otto and Roberto await until after the FAQ, WITH THE EXCEPTION ;) to those of us replicating who may have a question that needs immediate attention for the successful accomplishment of that task.  I suggest this only as a common courtesy on their behalf.  Please put yourself in their shoes, and reread the last several pages, if you doubt me.

Let me also stir the pot, for I think the time is right.  That Letter I posted on my thread, some time ago, where a man named Bob and I erased the last name has some sort of working TPU, either of his own design or replication of SM's.  It works.  But I have been UNABLE to find mention of it ANYWHERE on Bob's website for some reason (like to protect the people, maybe.  Sound familiar.  Who knows.)  Oh, what was the last name erased off of that letter sent to me?  BOYCE.  BOB BOYCE
Read the letter here on my thread.  Tell me if I am imagining things.  Hmm...Something about his letter sounds awfully familiar to what we have been told about SM's TPU.  So now that cat is out of the Hat.  Bob Boyce has a working TPU.  Let's see if he helps us.

Reply #124 here
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2300.msg32259;topicseen
I wonder how his works and where he got it...and why he hasn't told us or anyone.  Mr free energy himself.

Thank you and warm regards,
Bruce

to clarify things Bob Boyce is currently working on the Hydroxy project and the  3 freq. board is a prototype board to run the cell on. I'm not sure if he has a TPU prodject his site is Oupower. theres a lot of interesting things on his site but the TPU may not be one of them that i recall.

Yep,
Bob's 3 frequency's for the splitting of HHO (My first step after replication of Otto's set up) was just happenstance... LOL  Yea, he knows and has a working device.  He knows how it works.  Either he built it, or it was given to him, but he has both the understanding of how it works and the unit.  Don't believe me...reread the letter and remember, I ERASED his last name.  I told Marco that day by PM.  I did not want to distract the forum at the time.  Nor now, BUT if he will come clean, now that this huge step has been made, it could save months or years of R&D.

Cheers,  ;)
Bruce

Quote from: btentzer on June 10, 2007, 10:27:01 PM
This is not just an electronic device.  It is not a "coil" setup, nor a type of transformer.  So, what is it?  What do Roberto and Otto think it is? 

Well, at this point it is a damn fine induction heater (based on the aluminum heat sinks) with the "oscilloscope damage option".  Must have paid extra for that.   ;D

Dave has a good point - let's wait and see what Rob and Otto have next.

I think they should try a 120v/60W lightbulb once.  I wanna see how bright that one is, that's what I'd do if I had that thing.  Maybe after awhile you guys can rig up an inverter to this and see what kind of voltage and current you can get out of this thing, but that's just thinking ahead.  Good luck!

Dave:

Let me just put things in perspective. I am no rocket scientist. I have not even started replicating Otto's setup. I have no oscilloscope(yet) and no soldering iron nor electronics workbench nor any of the fancy frequency generators, DVM's etc. I started reading SM's thread in April 2007, asking myself a lot of questions and doing my own due dilligence and settled on trying to understand Erfinder's findings and eventually following enough of Otto's project to understand he is one of a few people who have gotten far enough in his demo to confirm a lot of SM's TPU phenomenon.
That's the background. I have no claim to fame but always wanted to seek the the 'unconventional' truth because I find that when people think they knew the obvious, then that usually is where the problem lies!

OK, let's again start with simple truths. Is SM's device real? If you don't think so, then there is no need to read on. Quit now.

OK, let's assume it is real. Is there a very special super duper ion lithium battery inside that will light a 100W bulb or ten, 100W bulbs for x number of minutes. If you believe there is such a battery, read no more. Quit now.

OK, then there is no battery and certainly no external power chord and there is no microwave induction capable of inducing such power to fake the experiment. So let's just assume the SM device is real and as SM showed it, it is able to get energy out from AEther? There's no psychic energy and no science fiction here. OK? So something happened. Right?

OK, now you see Otto's project. You asked, "...only say 30W brightness of a 100W bulb brightness in the photo!" AND it uses a 12V power supply. Therefore part of the power must be coming from the power supply, seeing a DC path does seem to exist in the schematic.....But then ask yourself why the need of such a convoluted DC path if the purpose was just to light the lamp. Common sense tells you it is far more complex and certainly in the "real" SM device, there was no power supply.

OK, most people will not understand any more than what their minds tell them at this point. They will tell you it's an induction coil, it's this and it's that. Well, Otto has even told you to reference Dave L's own interpretation of SM's device operation. Even with those drawn diagrams, will people understand any better? Quite apparently not, so it seems.

Therefore, if you can use your own reasoning of what is obvious and still cannot understand any better when some bright guy draws out the details of his explaination of inertia momentum, why continue to insist the only way to understand how this device operates is to measure power output vs power input!

If you think this is an over-unity device then I think there are many other web sites that are more enjoyable. btw, I don't know everything but I do know I will not insist that something MUST be done THIS WAY OR THAT WAY in order for me to be considered reasonably bright. (I don't think you are "thick" in the British sense of the word. I just think you need to free your mind!).

Ok, I will stop here. I really hope to be able to get a oscilloscope soon so I can confirm my understanding with the results of the experiments and not the other way round. So many people here want instant results and even if the instant results are given to them, they don't know how to intrepret the data and go back in circles because that's what magicians do to people. They want them to see what they want to believe! Open your minds before you open your eyes!

Regards
chrisC

ChrisC and btentzer.

There is plenty that could be said, but somehow I know it would be pointless.

Suffice it to say, evidently, you're both in way over your heads.

Darren

@ Darren
I could not agree with you more!   :D  If SM had not left us his posts, I would be back pumping current, seperating HHO.  There is nothing to convince.  I have an electronic partner who is helping me, hands on with my replication effort.  We have ordered the need drivers and mosfets.  Monday I start on the coil according to instructions.  Tuesday night we solder the circuits.  All while juggling family and job.  I do not expect to power my house this week with this set up, LOL, or win the OU prize.  I expect it to be a learning tool, which can then be experimented with, tuned, etc.

Oh, how is your build plans going Darren?

Cheers,
Bruce

Darren:

Sorry, we just have to agree to disagree!

Peace

chrisC

Quote from: btentzer on June 11, 2007, 01:27:23 AM

Oh, how is your build plans going Darren?

Cheers,
Bruce

Precisely my point.

But since you asked, they are going quite well. No, not a GOR type at all. My own, the culmination of a year's worth of study, testing,  and contemplation of Steven Mark's material.

Rest assured, I may post it here, but only if and when I've determined without a doubt that I can demonstrate it produces more power out than I am furnishing to operate it.

Good luck with your build, at the very least, you should learn some interesting, but basic electronics through your experiments.

Regards,
Darren

My own, the culmination of a year's worth of study, testing,  and contemplation of Steven Mark's material.

.... it produces more power out than I am furnishing to operate it.

Regards,
Darren
[/quote]

Hey Darren:

what did SM input for power? Maybe I missed it? (I only saw a swipe of a external magnet?)

chrisC

Hi all,

Please bear with me I'm gonna give you all a bit of a gentle shake

some of you can probably see it comming...I am not being unkind.


Boy you guys seem to be looking hard for Bottom!



I though that it was as clear as xtal.....oh you want it to make sence to you, who has learned well, that this is impossible.

I tell you something that has helped me a lot I always say read it again but never really HOW!.

Read the document first thing in the morning slowly......dont try to grasp any thing .... now read it again before bed slowly...again go to sleep with it if you like ...now In the morning back to your normal speed...try to get it..
Ask any questions and look again....then you are qualified to be confused.

Guess which house  I keep all my current documents in?

One part I better answer here, the most illogical part perhaps.

The collector in the document is 1 turn of twinflex  there is another turn of twinflex underneath it 44 mm away that is reverse connected...that is where the mobius twist is made ......it is in the connection....

I know that this is not what many people have been doing and it sort of seems reverse logic...but If you ever expected some thing that made sense directly...you were always going to be disapointed.


Again I say this is a RESEARCH PROJECT...This is not a generator...go to the hardware shop!
This is so that you can see the power and decide if you can or want to  add to the knowledge....just like it has been given to you.


Otto and Ronnette have given you guys the key to the gate. The effort that was put in is even shown.an example has been set.you can watch the gate open before your eyes....wether you want to work with this is up to you. Some of you will get hurt by it...be careful but do not expect them to hold your hand all the way.

I think that this is about what YOU can bring to it rather what you can get out if it.

Good luck and thank you all for listening

Darren,
Im surprised!

The efforts that you put into the spinning magnet game was astounding  you do see some similar things with that control coil....you have so much to offer here, why do you share your doubt? Who does it serve?






Lindsay

OK, since you seem serious and passionate about the TPU, I'll throw out a little insight.

You don't get something for nothing.

The original prototypes SM developed, used batteries to power the controller.

Later, they achieved equal success apparently without the use of a battery...yes the swipe of the magnet. There is rumour or speculation however that this was only an activating mechanism, and in fact, watching the videos, I believe there is at least one unit that operates without a magnet.

We also know that the magnet is not necessary for the device to operate.

Regardless if a battery is used or if initial power is furnished by the induction caused by the swiped magnet, the controller circuit requires power to operate...all the time.

Power can be supplied either by a battery, or by feeding back a portion of the output. At the very least, initial external power is required to get the device operating. Again, the initial external power is furnished via a battery or magnetic induction. After the device exceeds unity, it can then furnish its own input power, and the battery can be disconnected.

Bottom line is there is ALWAYS an input power required to operate the TPU.

Since there is an INPUT and an OUTPUT power that can be measured, the COP can easily be calculated.

Darren

Hello all

@Mr.Mannix

thanks.

Otto

Darren:

I knew that much about the initial versions having a battery as SM's post specifically mentioned that. Now the real question I'm sure that even you would need to face reality is that whatever battery was used, the continuously useful power isn't coming from the battery once the 'process' is activated. Yeh or Nay?

That's all. No more.

Peace

chrisC

Quote from: Mannix on June 11, 2007, 02:12:52 AM
Darren,
Im surprised!

The efforts that you put into the spinning magnet game was astounding  you do see some similar things with that control coil....you have so much to offer here, why do you share your doubt? Who does it serve?

Lindsay

Lindsay, you know I have no doubt SM's TPU is authentic.

I am simply questioning one's interpretation of SM's work, as I see some flaws and assumptions. I am attempting to bring some objectivity to this group as well, as sometimes things seem to get a little out of hand. But this of course is just my opinion.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and to question another's work, and I expect the same would happen if I posted a design here as well. I believe I would be much better prepared though to answer those questions.

No one truly knows what comprises SM's design Lindsay, not even yourself. Steven and UEC may be the only ones that do, and unless they come forward with the design, we will never know with 100% certainty we've got it, even if ou is achieved.

Regards,
Darren

Quote from: chrisC on June 11, 2007, 02:29:24 AM
Darren:

I knew that much about the initial versions having a battery as SM's post specifically mentioned that. Now the real question I'm sure that even you would need to face reality is that whatever battery was used, the continuously useful power isn't coming from the battery once the 'process' is activated. Yeh or Nay?

That's all. No more.

Peace

chrisC

Chris,

Go back and read my post again. Your answer is and was already there.

Darren

Hi Chris & Bruce,

Thanks for your comments.  I guess I am still confused.  Everyone is wanting to replicate it, but what are you replicating, there is no excess energy above that used to operate the device.

You all seem to be dancing around that talking about conversion and spikes.

So, I will ask again!  CAN ANYONE SHOW ME ANY POWER MEASUREMENTS IN THE DOCUMENT SHOWING EXCESS ENERGY OUTPUT ABOVE THE WHAT THE POWER SUPPLY IS FURNISHING?

Roberto said that the device will give you whatever power output you want to take and the input power will remain the same or drop regardless of output, and that the input simply powers the oscillators and so the output to the bulb is a free conversion right?

Surely this would be the MAIN POINT!  SHOWING EXCESS ENERGY!  Thats the point of the device, and yet there is none.  Yes, you can talk about heat releasing more electrons, isnt that what silicon in transistor does anyway?  The point IS if there was ANY CONVERSION taking place, there would BE EXCESS ENERGY ABOVE THAT OF THE POWER SUPPLY.

As we do not have any excess energy above that given by the power supply WE CANNOT SAY THERE IS CONVERSION OF AN UNKOWN ENERGY TAKING PLACE CAN WE?  Then what do we have but a pile of wire?

No the bulb is not being powered by the DC directly, the transistors have taken care of that, pulsing it and creating spikes instead, but the output is not shown to be more than taken in watts or joules from the supply and until that is shown which I would have thought would have been FOREMOST in the document, then there is nothing.  And I dont see the point of everyone else trying to replicate something the author hasnt even shown to be true himself!

What I mean is, if the unit converts more "aether" in to electrical energy than electrical energy used to run the device why there are no measurements?  If it gives you what you want to take, why the bulb is dim, why there are not 10 bulbs?

Someone mentioned putting a 60 watt bulb on instead of a hundred 100 watt bulb and I am not sure of the point, so the 60 watt bulb will light to 30 watts instead of the hundred watt one?



Regards,

Dave.

Dave:

It's almost 1 am where I am and I'm calling it a day but just to answer your question one more time!

. Its not about the power supply. The PS is ony used in this demo. to power up the magic 3 frequency oscillations for the magnetic coupling & other effects (heat) to get started.
. The amount of Aether power potentially available is infinite. At absolute resonance it will probably kill you. That is why Otto forced his tuning to be off from the resonance, so at least you can see a lighted bulb but safe enough so members of his "family" will still be around!
. Don't look to compare input and output , please! Get over this hump and you will see reality.

Regards

chrisC

Ok,

So what your saying is that there is no excess energy, but the bulb is being powered by converted aether instead?

The batteries are powering the oscillators only and the bulb lights from converted aether.  So if we add up the power used by the bulb and by the oscillators and take it away from the power suppled by power supply, surely we will read an excess because the bulb is not powered by it.

If I find your comments to disregard input to output power completley reckless!  I dont mean to offend you, but I must say what I feel on this.  How do you intend to confirm that aether is being converted to EXCESS electrical energy is you do not intend to measure HOW MUCH YOU HAVE CONVERTED COMPARED TO WHAT YOU USED TO START THE OSCILLATIONS??>?????? ???

If aether is being coverted to electrical energy and is powering the bulb, we can measure it.  Even if we cannot measure it with instruments, we can hook up 100 bulbs and clearly have proof of excess power output.

Regarding "opening my mind", I dont claim to know it all by a long shot, but I have spent 12 years actively researching and building every affordable (to me) device I have been able to lay my hands on.  I would like to think I have an open mind in order to pursue this as actively and long as I have and the amount of money I have spent on it, loosing my fiancee over it and spending a year in prison.

If there was shown measurements of power in the bulb not taken from the supply but instead from converted aether then I could say, ok I have an open mind I can try and replicate these results.  But none is shown to have an open mind about.

Good luck in your replication.


Regards,

Dave.

Hello all,

@Dave

I know in the past you made TPUs, coils.....why dont you try to build just 1 control coil, cut 2 lamp wires to the exact lenght connect everything as shown and then see whats going on??? Almost forgot: pulse this coil with 3 frequencies.

If you do so, just with this few wires you can already see how the sinus if forming.
But I must warn you. Dont even think to touch the wires when this coils are pulsed. Because its only 1 control coil this doesnt mean there is not much power. Just try it.

I know you have a lot of other work to do but just try.

Otto

Hmmmm...  :-\

Interesting discussion going on here. I haven't been following any of it because I have been busy replicating Otto/Roberto's setup. So far, I have constructed the control circuits (using mic4427BN MOSFET drivers and IRF840 MOSFETs). The circuit works great and I have been able to measure rise times as fast as 38ns on the FETS with these drivers.

I also constructed the TPU (ECD as Otto/Roberto call it) and have photos of it below I still have a few more connections to make to connect the collector coils properly and then it will be ready for preliminary testing.

By the way, for all of those out there wondering what is going on with the input/output power. This thing is so easy to build, why not just make one and answer the questions you have for yourself? My goal is to duplicate the effects outlined in the PDF file. If I get any results worth reporting, I'll draft up my own PDF with build and test details. Video will also follow if results are positive.

God Bless,
Jason O

Hi Otto,

You may remember many months ago I posted a PDF showing an variable oscillator I built with 3 ICL8038s and I was going on about how you must mix 3 frequencies and sometimes they can combine.

I also showed scope shots in this document showing these signals combing in to much higher voltage spikes.  Most of you will remember this, I think it was last novemeber or something.

I saw no excess energy gain here.  I simply saw electrostatic coupling and some constructive mixing of signals to higher peaks.  But I SAW NO EXCESS ENERGY, SO I HAD NOTHING!

I went on to replace these home made oscillators with 3 proper signal generators and with each I placed mosfet driver stages to run the coils.  Again I could see the same, but at no time did I see any excess energy above what I took from the supply.

Otto, I have tried your 50 turns of wire with a single wire through the centre, and yes I can see spikes, but if I place that wire outside of the coil rather than the inside, the same occurs, oh and I saw no excess energy there either.

I think that for now I will leave it in the hands of those who are clearly better qualified than I since given everyones responses towards me I am clearly missing the point, which I thought was excess energy freely converted.


Regards,

Dave.

PS Otto & Roberto, no disrepect intended in any of my posts.

Dave,

I think that what is shown is the document is a circuit tuned to such frequencies so it doesn't give up too much energy - but enough for safe experimentation.

I'm guessing that if you try to tune closer to the 'right' frequencies then the unit would produce more...

Peter

Hi Peter,

If this is the case, I am sure someone on here who is braver, (or perhaps dumber!!!) will go straight ahead and synchronise the frequencies straight off and then perhaps we will know.

Until then, ITS ALL SPECULATION!

If we cannot get useful power without synchronising, then we must synchronise.  I call to Otto and Roberto to then clear the room, stand with remote switch, connect a bank of bulbs and crank this baby up!


Regards,

Dave.

Before anyone attempts to replicate Otto's and Roberto's we need to fill in a few gaps in knowledge. For instance, I have already raised the issue about the Mosfet drive. Did Otto and Roberto drive their output Mosfets at 6V gate voltage? No answer yet. If they did then the Mosfet heatsinks were getting hot for obvious reasons and their observations on PSU current and temperature are consistent with this and it follows that their conclusions may be incorrect. To test the 'hot' aluminium theory, drive the Mosfets at the correct gate voltage and thereby keep them in their SOA. Having done this, heat a piece of aluminium using a seperate power source and insert it close to the TPU and observe / record then compare results with the original data.

We see a very dimly lit light bulb. What was the measured voltage across this bulb and the current through it? OK I appreciate that a DVM reading of a complex waveform is rather meaningless but at least it gives us all a comparative baseline to work with.  IMO the average power was well under 30W. Does the bulb stay illuminated at the same level for the duration that the PSU volts drop? This question was raised by Stephan and is also unaswered.

I disagree with the interpretation of the waveforms. The traces described as emerging sine waves are IMO the on to off transitions of the Mosfet's. The sharp voltage spikes occur at the current cessation in the coils, followed by the coil discharge. These look complicated and a perhaps a bit sinus in nature because there is a lot of 'ringing' and overlapping in the traces. There will be a number of sub-harmonic resonant points in a frequency sweep and these will produce current peaks and troughs which will translate into variations of bulb brightness. However, I suggest that the capacity of the PSU will dictate the maximum level of bulb illumination with the given coil and driver design. The throughput efficiency may be approx 40 -50% so using a PSU that can deliver 5Amps @ 12V,  a 60W mains lamp should illuminate at a respectable level with careful tuning.

@ Otto

"But I must warn you. Dont even think to touch the wires when this coils are pulsed. Because its only 1 control coil this doesnt mean there is not much power. Just try it."

What do you feel Otto? Is it  high voltage in the form of an electrical shock or something else. If it is high voltage then I respectfully suggest this does not imply that there is any amount of power behind it.

Hello all,

@Hoppy

the work was done without MOSFET drivers. I have 3 oscillators connected directly to the gates of my MOSFETs. They are directly mounted on 3 heatsinks.
Yesterday while pulsing  my coils, the Alluminium was very hot and I touched the MOSFET: just warm. But the MOSFET is DIRECTLY mounted on the Aluminium. Oh, yes, everything is normal.
The sinuses in the pictures are not 100% formed. I did it and the result is known.
Nobody of you sees anything unusual. Good, no problem.

If allowed, a question to all the people who are surching for excess energy, looking and asking about the power supply measurments, asking a lot of questions about everything:

Did you try to replicate my setup, my coils???.....had you a little time for it???....

Dont answer, I will do it:     NO!!!!

Thanks, but please dont question before you built it.

Otto

Hello,

as s..t happens I touched a lot of times my wires. First: the heat is like you would hold liquid iron in your hand. Second: after this you have the feeling that somebody is crashing the bone of your finger. VEEEERY "NICE".

Once, I pulsed a not so good coil just with 1 frequency and hold the end of the pulsed coil in my fingers. I knew that it was NOT danger. I wanted to know whats the danger that I can expect from a TPU. Result: veeeery hot.

Now Im really carefull.

Otto

Hi all,

@Jason,
very, very good work please get my compliments. It's just like this! So go on and let me know soon. I'm anxious to check your tests.

@all,
I do know that's real difficult to accept it. It has been for myself as well as I'm a standard college educated guy. I do understand and respect all the opinions. Of course you all ,in a way or the other, are contributing to advance this knowledge. There are, as you have seen, key points: 'The Seed' is just one of them: IT'S REAL IT APPEARED IN FRONT OF OUR EYES. IT CAN'T BE DENIED! In our opinion is THE KEY to open 'the Gate'. If you will built the ECD you'll see it with your eyes: please dont question before you build it. Power measuremet: we are scared. At least let us have the right time to do something to assure our safety before pushing up the 'conversion' process (one time runaway it's enought).

Regards

Roberto

@ Otto

You say: -

"the work was done without MOSFET drivers. I have 3 oscillators connected directly to the gates of my MOSFETs. They are directly mounted on 3 heatsinks."

OK, so you did not use the configuration shown on page 29, Diagram 8 - Final ECD Setup. Could you then show us the exact circuit you used to achieve the results described in your document? 

At the moment I do not understand why your heatsinks are getting so hot at the current drawn from the PSU. This may be because they are not being driven correctly or it may be because we have external influences but if we are to satisfy ourselves which of the two possibilities it is, then we need to drive the Mosfets in the same manner as you did and clearly not in the manner you show in your document.

Hello all,

@Hoppy

in the picture is my future way to connect my MOSFETs. The only point is that my oscillators are far away to be good. At my crash I didnt notice that all my 3 oscillators crashed too. Not burned but the values of my used elements changed...couldnt see this without a scope.

Connect just DIRECTLY your oscillators to the gates of your MOSFETs. I hope the output voltage from your oscillators are not over 20V.
Dont worry, my MOSFETs are driven very well.
You forgot something: The MOSFETs MUST be inside thr TPU. Why??

Otto

Quote from: z_p_e on June 11, 2007, 02:22:16 AM
[snip]
Since there is an INPUT and an OUTPUT power that can be measured, the COP can easily be calculated.
Darren

Daren, All,

Let us just imagine that in device xyz, which looks like a black box, there are two inputs and an output.  The black box itself however only has one physical input and one physical output.  The second input can not be seen, felt, or smelled.

Now I put in a catalyst signal and I measure the power consumption.  It is 10 Watts.
I measure output power as 50 Watts.  Frequency is f1.

Now I do nothing but change the frequency to f2.  Power input stays at 10 Watts, but output power is now 150 Watts.

I change the frequency to f3. Power input stays at 10 Watts, but output power is now 1500 Watts.

I change the frequency to f4. Power input stays at 10 Watts, but output power is now 1.5 MegaWatts.

Is this device overunity or underunity?
(Hint: answer can be: UU, OU, both, or neither)

If overunity, what is its COP?  How do you calculate COP, and do you include the input power that you can not smell?

For such a device does talk about input or output power make any sense?

Perhaps, one should place more emphasis on the term:  excess power and forget about COP???

Regards, Earl

Quote from: otto on June 11, 2007, 06:37:48 AM
[snip]
You forgot something: The MOSFETs MUST be inside thr TPU. Why??
Otto

Sorry Otto for being so exact, do you mean inside the 6" outer ring or inside the 4" ring?

I can very easily see some experiments where I want to put the FETs and ALU between the two rings.

Regards, Earl

Roberto just emailed me and asked to be patient.
They saw much higher output, but due to risk they have not
shown the pics and measurements.

Otto and Roberto have to rest first
from their enourmous work and then will
try to build a FAQ thread or PDF file.

So others, if you try to rebuilt it, be cautious not to
open the gate too far and not exactly hitresonance.
Only do this, if you have a scope and see the  pulses.

Regards, Stefan.

Quote from: Earl on June 11, 2007, 06:41:48 AM

Quote from: z_p_e on June 11, 2007, 02:22:16 AM
[snip]
Since there is an INPUT and an OUTPUT power that can be measured, the COP can easily be calculated.
Darren

Daren, All,

Let us just imagine that in device xyz, which looks like a black box, there are two inputs and an output.  The black box itself however only has one physical input and one physical output.  The second input can not be seen, felt, or smelled.

Now I put in a catalyst signal and I measure the power consumption.  It is 10 Watts.
I measure output power as 50 Watts.  Frequency is f1.

Now I do nothing but change the frequency to f2.  Power input stays at 10 Watts, but output power is now 150 Watts.

I change the frequency to f3. Power input stays at 10 Watts, but output power is now 1500 Watts.

I change the frequency to f4. Power input stays at 10 Watts, but output power is now 1.5 MegaWatts.

Is this device overunity or underunity?
(Hint: answer can be: UU, OU, both, or neither)

If overunity, what is its COP?  How do you calculate COP, and do you include the input power that you can not smell?

For such a device does talk about input or output power make any sense?

Perhaps, one should place more emphasis on the term:  excess power and forget about COP???

Regards, Earl

Hi Earl,

The terms free energy, overunity and COP do require some more definitions I think!  What does free energy mean, just that, no cash required?  Solar panels and wind power are "free energy" they are also COP>1 since COP only is caring about what you have to pay for on the input.  The solar panel is 15% efficient, but the COP is greater than one.

The term overunity to me is meaningless.  We cannot create something from nothing, if we have an excess it must have been converted from some other source by our device, so with the TPU we do not get more out than we put in, in total.  We get out the battery source to the oscillators and the amount of energy we freely converted, minus losses.  Its just that part of this source we had to pay for the other source was free, but we dont get out more than 100% of the total input, ie the battery power and the "aether" input combined, one part is free the other is not.

The TPU would therefore be COP>1 since we can get out more than we PAY for ie, the battery source.  We can therefore calculate the COP of the device by comparing the output power to the battery source power taken.  But the overall officiency is not greater than 100%.

The term by SM "these are not free energy devices they are conversion devices" is also meaningless and just designed not to scare his employers or investors off.  Do you have to pay for  the power you are getting?  NO, then its free energy.  Are you greating something from nothing, NO.  Are you converting an unknown form of energy to electricity, YES.  The conversion happens for free.

So this is a FREE ENERGY DEVICE, with COP greater than one, but overall efficiency well below 100% due to heat losses.  This is how I would sum it up and indeed ANY free energy device since it must always rely on the free conversion of another source.  You can never convert from nothing, so this one definition fits all free energy devices!

I just see no evidence of COP greater than one in this case.  I hope that when Otto and Roberto feel safer handling it they will crank it up and show this to be true.

I do not know why you all believe there to be COP>1 when it has not been shown in the document with any tests!  If it can be shown, I will be more than happy to spend yet more money on this project and wind yet another TPU and duplicate the conversion process to produce excess energy, but while NONE has been shown yet, I dont see the point.  I have other projects that I am working on at the moment and I cannot just give them up when no excess energy has been proven or shown yet!



Regards to all,


Dave.

@ Otto

Thanks for your replies, much appreciated. I think your answers to my questions have given me enough to have a stab at replication. I'm sorry that I've had to ask so many questions but things were not clear enough for me to start building.

You ask: -

"You forgot something: The MOSFETs MUST be inside thr TPU. Why??

I presume to make it work properly! I'll let you know when I've built it.


Regards
Clive

Hi Stefan,

T H A N K

Roberto

Hi Otto and Roberto,
I will start the work on a mosfet driver PCB.
This will go between the signal/function generator and mosfets.
I will include a lot of bypass capacitors to enable the mosfet to be fully driven.

PCB Board size will be 4" x 3" and split into 3 sections for the 3 mosfet drivers.
I will use double side PCB and have one side for the ground plane.
Have you any preference of mosfet driver?
[edited]I have a load of UCC37324 drivers (10 off) to experiment with.
These are 4A, rise/fall of 20ns/15ns typical.
As long as you stick to an 8 Pin DIL with industry standard pinout we can interchange the driver ICs.
I can parallel up the inputs/outputs to reduce the rise/fall times slightly.

Terminals:

Inputs: (6 terminals)
3 x freq. feed
6V +ve (driver supply)
0 to 12V +ve (coil/mosfet power)
GND

Outputs: (5 terminals)
3 x mosfet gates
0 to 12V +ve (coil/mosfet power)
GND

Attached is an example of the circuit I did for the MEG.

Regards
Rob

Hi Rob,

I'd like to check it before you start. Please be so kind to send me the UCC3724 datasheet as I don't find it !!! (or a link at).
Again if you want I'll check circuitry also, just send it me. Of course I'm interested also for myself as I'm using a breadboard version. Remember that the power MOSFETS must be put near the outer ring (for example).

Many thanks

Roberto

Hello all,

@Rob

IRF 840 not BUZ11. I tried the BUZ 11. NOT GOOD!!!

Otto

Hi Roberto,
Typo in post, should be UCC37324.
Here is the link:
Texas Instruments
http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ucc37324.pdf

Hi Otto,
Yes I know, circuit shown is not the driver board, its is an example of the driver IC being used.
I will be creating a new board for this project.

Regards
Rob