As far as i know you can create HHO from sound waves, hence the singing monk bowl. Is it possible to electronically create that same sound pattern but on a bigger scale? has anyone tried this with a speaker tuned to the sweet spot and a container of water ???
I want to reply to this i just can't do so in good heart until you tell me you don't work for haliburton.
Thanks
Joe
Quote from: Haliburton on January 28, 2008, 01:42:30 AM
As far as i know you can create HHO from sound waves, hence the singing monk bowl. Is it possible to electronically create that same sound pattern but on a bigger scale? has anyone tried this with a speaker tuned to the sweet spot and a container of water ???
Where is the connection between the singing bowls and HHO generation, Any source references?
Hans von Lieven
EDIT: I think you are referring to this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdOJZDWJkuk&feature=related
I do not think we are seeing there water dissociating into HHO. This looks like ultrasonic cavitation to me. The bowl has a very high fundamental frequency and the harmonics would extend well into the ultrasonic region with considerable amplitude. This would cause the bubbles. The shape of the bowl would concentrate the waves in the centre and that is where the bubbles form.
Quote from: Haliburton on January 28, 2008, 01:42:30 AM
As far as i know you can create HHO from sound waves, hence the singing monk bowl. Is it possible to electronically create that same sound pattern but on a bigger scale? has anyone tried this with a speaker tuned to the sweet spot and a container of water ???
H-
What was the frequency the monk was singing. I am sure it would be possible. Can you provide some details for the experimenters in the crowd?
jeanna
LOL Jeanna,
It is not the monk that does the singing, it is the bowl. It is similar to rubbing the rim of a wineglass in a gentle circular motion with a wet finger. It emits a high pitched sound rich in harmonics.
Hans von Lieven
Quote from: hansvonlieven on January 28, 2008, 02:07:28 PM
LOL Jeanna,
It is not the monk that does the singing, it is the bowl. It is similar to rubbing the rim of a wineglass in a gentle circular motion with a wet finger. It emits a high pitched sound rich in harmonics.
Hans von Lieven
Hans, or anyone,Please tell me more about this bowl. Things like
what it is made from
what its shape is.
Is it rung like a crystal glass or
tapped with a 'hammer' ?
(and Hans, does it look at all like those hemispheres under the 'beer cans' on Stubblefield's battery?)
Thanks,
jeanna
:D
@ Jeanna,
Watch the video I gave a link for in reply 2 this thread. It will show it better than I can explain in words.
Hans von Lieven
So Hans, do you think the bubbles are just air that is being expelled from the water, water vapor, or caused by some air pressure difference above the surface of the liquid? This is very interesting.
I wonder if the water temperature increases at all while this is happening? If it does, probably not by much I would assume.
I have been wondering about that too Dave. It would need a very sensitive thermometer. Even then the water and the bowl would have to sit in a temperature controlled environment for quite some time to establish thermal equilibrium before the test has any meaning.
Hans von Lieven
Quote from: hansvonlieven on January 28, 2008, 04:17:30 PM
Watch the video
Hans von Lieven
Great find.
Thanks Hans.
It makes such a beautiful set of tones.
jeanna
No i do not work for Haliburton, but it is very powerful name which one day hopefully will change by us united. I read somewhere that the bubbles where HHO. I might be wrong but it is kinda neat. I wonder if you can split HHO and O2 with sound
Quote from: hansvonlieven on January 28, 2008, 12:48:12 PM
Quote from: Haliburton on January 28, 2008, 01:42:30 AM
As far as i know you can create HHO from sound waves, hence the singing monk bowl. Is it possible to electronically create that same sound pattern but on a bigger scale? has anyone tried this with a speaker tuned to the sweet spot and a container of water ???
Where is the connection between the singing bowls and HHO generation, Any source references?
Hans von Lieven
EDIT: I think you are referring to this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdOJZDWJkuk&feature=related
I do not think we are seeing there water dissociating into HHO. This looks like ultrasonic cavitation to me. The bowl has a very high fundamental frequency and the harmonics would extend well into the ultrasonic region with considerable amplitude. This would cause the bubbles. The shape of the bowl would concentrate the waves in the centre and that is where the bubbles form.
but interesting that it takes time to cause the bubbles , i watched all singing bowls filled water videos so I am also thinking that water dissoociating because in the other videos all bubbles come rapidly from the bound between the water and bowl to he center but in this video it starts coming from the bottom like starting to boil maybe this bowl is lucky and it has the right frequency and the harmonics ::)
Quote from: hansvonlieven on January 28, 2008, 05:54:24 PM
I have been wondering about that too Dave. It would need a very sensitive thermometer. Even then the water and the bowl would have to sit in a temperature controlled environment for quite some time to establish thermal equilibrium before the test has any meaning.
Hans von Lieven
We seemed to be posting simultaneously yesterday. I was wondering also if the temp would be rising. It was still on my mind when I read a post of yours in earth batt (?) about having the programs on your computer to produce desired frequencies.
So, I am wondering if those programs can
detect the frequencies that are being produced in that vid.
I think it would be interesting to find out what they are (and also to find out what frequency Kanzius is using to burn his salt water).
I wonder if the full harmonic is there in the singing bowl or every one except the one that is stimulating the bubbles?
Anyway, if you could define which freq's are coming out from the bowl vid, AND IF THEY ARE ALL THERE you could recreate them from your computer and direct them toward some water ........ and see what happens ;D
I assume that the size of the surface and maybe the total amount of water and together with its shape of the bowl are playing into the exact frequency that activates the bubbles. Unless it is specific to water only.
Even on youtube it is possible to hear many of the harmonics. ooo I think this is interesting. I am sure you have seen those youtube vids on cymatics. (Chladni experiments using lycopodium and sand)
jeanna
I just watched the vid again. I noticed that the bubbles don't appear until a sub fundamental begins. I could be wrong but to me it sounds like a full octave and a fifth BELOW the 'tap' sound of the bowl. Once that low frequency is heard, the bubbles begin.
QuoteThis looks like ultrasonic cavitation to me. The bowl has a very high fundamental frequency and the harmonics would extend well into the ultrasonic region with considerable amplitude. This would cause the bubbles
I looked up ultrasonic cavitation. are you simply saying that these bubbles are not even water vapour? That they are microscopic bubbles that are already there in the water or on the place where the bowl meets the water under the water surface? And therefore just expanding because of the frequency? If that were true, then the bubbles would run out at some point. Is that correct?
Speculation: I was wondering if the monks singing bowl was related to the Keely effect and the Bflat scale.
I also noticed that the sound waves pattern on the surface of the water seemed to form a pulsating cross.
Hopefully giant killer reads this
Your hearing a standing wave in mid air... wild right! This bowl heterodynes audio in space and can create infrasonic or subsonic pitches as well given its manufacture... I replicated this mildly
Go find a metal mixing bowl the silverish kind fill it 1/3 with water and start smacking the thing with a metal spoon at a given interval youd be suprised the cymatic pictures you can make yourself in water from the natural resonance of a bowl.... for more fun do it wiht ladle and hold the ladle just close enough so it does not touch the bowl and it starts ringing this awesome high pitch ... Resonance what a wonderful thing ***NOTE** I wittnessed water cavitation
I have a primitive sound making program on my computer. On its keyboard which is surely tuned to A=440, I found that the sub harmonic tone is in fact 2 octaves and one fifth below the 'tapped' tone of the bowl with water in it. The tones of the bowl are not exact and seem to be just a bit higher (sharper) than the keyboard but are F# and C# - C# being the first tone we hear with the tap of the stick on the bowl.
@Hans,
I jusr read almost all of your website and I am really curious why you think cavitation is what is happening here?
jeanna
G'day all,
@Jeanna,
Here is an audio oscilloscope and spectrum analyser. You have to have the audio input file in .wav format .
The programme is quite small and once unzipped runs of its icon, no installation necessary
Hope this helps
Hans von Lieven
EDIT:
Quote@Hans,
I jusr read almost all of your website and I am really curious why you think cavitation is what is happening here?
from past observation of cavitation in ultrasonic cleaning tanks. It looks just like it.
Quote from: hansvonlieven on January 30, 2008, 03:02:08 PM
from past observation of cavitation in ultrasonic cleaning tanks. It looks just like it.
I guess my ? should be why don't you think cavitation and what keely was doing are related? I guess if the resultant bubbles don't explode is the reason. Keely blew things up a few times before he found what made things blow up.
But the process he was doing sounds very close to what I see in that bowl. Things like using sound for tickling things to get them started but then they keep going with more results or with less input.
Doesn't it?
Blowing apart props and things with the force unleashed from water when the water molecules have merely been excited enough to form bubbles (by cavitation) seems similar to me ... etc.
jeanna
I think there is an electro static factor as well. all the video's of the phenomenon I've watched so far show the water following or just a mist following the wooden mallet that is used to do the circle movement on the edge of the bowl the cavitation seems to stay stationary tho .. weird
You are quite correct Jeanna, the phenomena are related.
The way I see it, cavitation occurs first. As the intensity of the overtones increases even higher harmonics are generated leading to sonoluminescence thereafter we get into dissociation of water on a molecular level, the real effects occur on the subatomic level where these enormous forces Keely talks about are released.
Still, just guessing, I have not been able to duplicate it yet. :-[
Hans von Lieven
so like i asked before. Has sound ever been proven to split water ??? Audio freq are much more powerful then most people think. It is a form of energy resulting from electricity. Ok know i know that this might sound funny but has anyone tried using the positive and negative terminals from a stereo and play different audio tones to produce HHO in the cell design's rather then just pulsing it or using DC. Imagine putting on a Pink floyed CD and watching the cell produce record amounts :o
Yes you can do this Haliburton, in fact the Kanzius device does just this. It is still electrolysis though.
As to sound, this is a totally different proposition. Sound waves are pressure waves and are NOT part of the electromagnetic spectrum. There is no electricity involved in a pure acoustic wave, though with an electromechanical apparatus (such as a loudspeaker) we can generate sound waves.
Hans von Lieven
Interesting video.
Did you try to burn these bubbles ?
I guess it is just disolved air inside the water,
so these are probably just air bubbles coming out of the water...
Many thanks.
Regards,Stefan.
P.S: Regarding:Trying rock songs for HHO gas generation:
just use a graetz brdige rectifier after your amplifier speaker output,
so all negative wave parts are rectified to positive waves, so you
have only "chopped DC".
Then when you hit the right tunes you could probably get good HHO production.
Haha i just found where i first saw that sound can crack water . Guess where it was posted http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3969.0;topicseen :-\
Quote from: PolyMatrix on January 30, 2008, 08:43:59 AM
Speculation: I was wondering if the monks singing bowl was related to the Keely effect and the Bflat scale.
Yes. John Worrell Keely is the key here. Him and his quartz
bowl which may have resonated at 42khz. (A strange bowl).