...can be a possible outcome,if the same arm difference of a first class lever (equal masses/effort=load) ,performs between a greater and greater gravitational leves difference (up-down).
We must take into account the time factor...
All the best! / Alex
How do you mean, i'm not quite with you
Alex
huh?
Quote from: iacob alex on March 18, 2010, 10:56:25 AM
...can be a possible outcome,if the same arm difference of a first class lever (equal masses/effort=load) ,performs between a greater and greater gravitational leves difference (up-down).
We must take into account the time factor...
All the best! / Alex
Shoot a bullet up into the air at 4000lbs per square inch, now measure the amount of PSI as the bullet falls back to earth, you will not get the same energy back. not even close.
also, don't be fooled by levers and fulcrums, there is a trade off and it is called distance over time.
good luck.
....is the basic idea of a possible PM.
If we play the TIME FACTOR (v=g*t),we play in fact the height (level difference).
To use this opportunity,we need a greater free fall.
A lever/two spokes only/ (vs. a many spokes wheel...) is allowing this greater fall...
If we work with a small,constant,same input(arm difference) and the arms become greater and greater (free fall height),the accumulated torque difference is incresing the kinetic energy (the output).
This is comparable,equivalent to the free fall of a mass,from a greater height "H",but we "pay" to remake this fall with the same,small arms difference "h",only (H>>>h).
It's so simple...small input (unbalance),great output (unbalance),Prigogine "style".
All the best! / Alex
.....there was a small (but "essential") mistake in the first message:...(equal masses/long arm-short arm scheme/effort>load).
The same starting unbalance (effort-load),can be increased,as much as possible,in a greater and greater up-down fall.
The torque difference develops "alike" a free falling mass,from a greater and greater height.
On the top we need the same input.
On the bottom,we can get a bigger output...
All the best! / Alex
Quote from: iacob alex on March 18, 2010, 10:20:22 PM
....is the basic idea of a possible PM.
If we play the TIME FACTOR (v=g*t),we play in fact the height (level difference).
To use this opportunity,we need a greater free fall.
A lever/two spokes only/ (vs. a many spokes wheel...) is allowing this greater fall...
If we work with a small,constant,same input(arm difference) and the arms become greater and greater (free fall height),the accumulated torque difference is incresing the kinetic energy (the output).
This is comparable,equivalent to the free fall of a mass,from a greater height "H",but we "pay" to remake this fall with the same,small arms difference "h",only (H>>>h).
It's so simple...small input (unbalance),great output (unbalance),Prigogine "style".
All the best! / Alex
Seems interesting, is there a picture you can directly link us to?
Alex
....can be expressed easy,as a simple as possible:
-as a scheme...if you want "to eat fish".
-as a word-description (see previous messages...)...if you want "to catch fish".
About schemes,drawings,designs...sorry,for the moment ,the "innkeeper" geocities.com is not more available.
A copy of my old web-site is iregular accessible on a personal computer,so I hope to find the fit words to illustrate it.
Words are the tools that models concepts out of experience.
All the best! / Alex
Quote from: iacob alex on March 21, 2010, 04:23:23 AM
....can be expressed easy,as a simple as possible:
-as a scheme...if you want "to eat fish".
-as a word-description (see previous messages...)...if you want "to catch fish".
About schemes,drawings,designs...sorry,for the moment ,the "innkeeper" geocities.com is not more available.
A copy of my old web-site is iregular accessible on a personal computer,so I hope to find the fit words to illustrate it.
Words are the tools that models concepts out of experience.
All the best! / Alex
I don't mean to be rude but can't you explain things in a more simple way?
Alex
huh?
....as a wish for,and in the same time,as a realm of possibility to imagine a PM device ,can be defined with the help of a setting side by side :
- the positive work ("H"), done by the fall down of a small unbalance (let's say a first class lever,two equall masses,two unequal arms/a small long arm-short arm difference...).
-the negative work ("h") ,done to spring up (remake),the same small unbalance ,as a starting point of a repetitive process .
Now,if H>>>h ,or h=constant and H is ever increasing ?!
All the best! / Alex
huh?
Are you saying that by having two equal weights on an off-balance lever, the weight that rises (short side of lever) is ever increasing so it can then repeat its lift from its current position? Is that what you mean? Which wont perpetuate as the long arm will just balance at the bottom...
Alex
....it's a simple logic :
-an off-balance lever (equal masses,unequal arms/"h" is their difference ).
-starting unbalance: long arm on top position.
-due to unbalance state and gravity "pressure",the mass on long arm plays positive work(torque),the mass on short arm plays negative work (torque).
-the motion of the lever (fall) is determined by their torque difference.
-if we are interested (really...!),to collect more power,we need more space (height "H")...or time (v=g*t).
-if we have more stored power,we can easy to remake the starting unbalance ( mgh),to "pay" friction and to take out some power supply...
All the best! / Alex
uh, i don't get it.
Quote from: iacob alex on March 24, 2010, 12:01:48 PM
....it's a simple logic :
-an off-balance lever (equal masses,unequal arms/"h" is their difference ).
-starting unbalance: long arm on top position.
-due to unbalance state and gravity "pressure",the mass on long arm plays positive work(torque),the mass on short arm plays negative work (torque).
-the motion of the lever (fall) is determined by their torque difference.
-if we are interested (really...!),to collect more power,we need more space (height "H")...or time (v=g*t).
-if we have more stored power,we can easy to remake the starting unbalance ( mgh),to "pay" friction and to take out some power supply...
All the best! / Alex
Yes the greater the fall, the greater the energy, but how do you get it make it back to its starting position in order to repeat?
Alex
.... is the first sequence:gravity fall working as an unbalance amplifier.
The second sequence is an UNBALANCE JUMP...
The classical and old (15-th century...) simple hinged arm,as a natural suggestion (leg,arm) is the best expression,for the "self"- switch of unbalance from bottom to top position.
To get a continuous process ,we need to use a part of the stored power for a second unbalance jump(small input...)...in some manner.
All together,we must play a mechanical unbalance amplifier(due to gravity),then a mechanical oscillator (due to rotational inertia)...
All the best! / Alex