Quote from: Magluvin on August 14, 2012, 10:35:31 PM
The only way I would agree to do so is if the members hammer against an idea that they themselves have not built themselves, like TK and the Tar Baibies, or Poynts diligence one the sims and come to accurate conclusions. But if they are just going to preach text book theories and laws against something as complicated as Waynes device, without having full knowledge of the device, nor ANY experience with it, then they should keep to themselves until they do have this knowledge and experience, in order to even make a case against the idea.

Otherwise it is just hounding, bickering, useless posts. Trolls.

TK, I have a feeling will delve deep into this. I see he is still on the 'HUH?' side, but as others here have spoken as to whom they want to see more posts from and who not, this should be a good indicator. And the Not's are agreeably  not helping to figure things out, this is for certain. The Not's only post time/page wasting material. And animosity along with it. You can see it in the last few pages up to this one.

Wayne doesnt have to show anything. But he is and he has a nice, high, level of patience in doing so. Everyone deserves a fair chance to do their thing. But if their thing is to disrupt a thread with bias, and little knowledge of the device specifically in order to prove their case 'against' it, then most will agree that these posts are the least wanted.


With TK here, doing some serious questioning, while seriously trying to understand what is happening, there is no need for extra grumble and mumble about things that are well known or just insulting comments. They have know idea how this thing works exactly, and their posts show it. ;]

My local Plastics store (Plexi, etc) has lots of sizes of thin wall clear tubing(1/8 in). ;]

MaGs

"Wayne doesn't have to show anything."

On the contrary, Mr. Wayne has to show everything if he is claiming over-unity and wants people here to accept his account and view of his device.  He is the sole source of information, and therefore he must provide actual data and proof of his claim if he wants anyone to accept it.  (He apparently desires this or he wouldn't be here on this site).  It is reasonable to expect a clear and concise explanation with examples of drawings that explain the operation and input and output measurements of the device.  It is reasonable for the people on this site to expect nothing less.  Especially since the device in question already has patent protection, there should be nothing to hide.  Those asking reasonable scientific questions have every right to do so, without being considered a "troll" and should not be silenced or moderated.  If moderation wins, the truth may be lost.

Liberty

Quote from: TinselKoala on August 14, 2012, 09:03:18 PM
SO the only question is whether the output work is different or the same. Since the system on the RIGHT cannot push up a water column to the same height, when released, as the system on the LEFT.... it should be clear that the work output available from the system on the right is less.

Misleading again, I have shown many time in different calculators and drawings. The Travis system Risers intersect and uses the pressures from each air column against each riser surface areas to produce lift. Please do your due dillegence and stop misleading.

Regards, Larry

Hello all,

This is the link to my public ZED distribution folder:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/6vdnbk72ywyckns/zB501rT78P

A PDF document has just been uploaded.  It is too late tonight to generate a set of animation files.  That will have to wait until sometime tomorrow.  Text that appears in red are numbers and formula terms that are changed from my previous version.  They will only be red for a single significant version.

The purpose of this analysis is to present (for critical review), the theory and implementation I used for a simplified simulation of a single ZED machine. This is just a single layer version.  A 2+ layer simulation model will follow after this one is verified for accuracy.  No attempt was made to find the most efficient geometry for this.  It is known that other geometries had better simulation results, but it would be wasted effort to try to optimize this model before verifying that it is accurate.

~Dennis

Quote from: LarryC on August 14, 2012, 11:42:06 PM
Misleading again, I have shown many time in different calculators and drawings. The Travis system Risers intersect and uses the pressures from each air column against each riser surface areas to produce lift. Please do your due dillegence and stop misleading.

Regards, Larry

Are you claiming that I am wrong, that the work is not less in the system on the right? And when I say that there  is no energy gain evident in any of the systems you have drawn? Are you disputing that? And when I point out that the work involved in the righthand system is far less than the work in the lefthand system... is that misleading or wrong?

I don't think it is I who am misleading, Larry. You set up your system and your illustration to make it look as if there was some kind of advantage to the system on the right. But there isn't. A naive person might look at the pressures, forgetting that you are only showing a half-cycle, and also might assume that you are saying you get the same benefit from the system on the right as you do from the system on the left, but with less cost. I think your entire drawing is misleading... that's why I had _you_ explain it first.

QuoteThe Travis system Risers intersect and uses the pressures from each air column against each riser surface areas to produce lift.

So?  What exactly does that prove? You take two identical systems, neither of which is "overunity" itself,  and "intersect" them and somehow... nobody has yet explained "what is measured to judge it"...  overunity performance emerges?  You are waving your hands, not explaining.

How is the ratio of input work or energy, to the output work or energy, determined for the three layer system that MrWayne tells us is clearly overunity itself?

Please tell me what the total input energy is to initiate and sustain a cycle, and what the total output energy is for a complete cycle.

What _numbers_ do you compare, to determine the clearly overunity performance of this system itself?

Quote from: Liberty on August 14, 2012, 11:28:57 PM
"Wayne doesn't have to show anything."

On the contrary, Mr. Wayne has to show everything if he is claiming over-unity and wants people here to accept his account and view of his device.  He is the sole source of information, and therefore he must provide actual data and proof of his claim if he wants anyone to accept it.  (He apparently desires this or he wouldn't be here on this site).  It is reasonable to expect a clear and concise explanation with examples of drawings that explain the operation and input and output measurements of the device.  It is reasonable for the people on this site to expect nothing less.  Especially since the device in question already has patent protection, there should be nothing to hide.  Those asking reasonable scientific questions have every right to do so, without being considered a "troll" and should not be silenced or moderated.  If moderation wins, the truth may be lost.

Liberty

Show me the rule or the law that states MrWayne has to show anything at all, even though he has claimed OU?  He is not claiming a prize here. he is just talkin, and goin with the flow.  Who gives you the right to say how fast or slow that flow goes? Hmm?

Show me 10% of the 'moderated' members posts that shows that they have a good understanding of Waynes device that gives them the right to bash.

They dont. And until they do, they should pay attn, and if they want to know, they will do as Webby and Larry(and they agree so far) has and do some work, instead of insulting what the Not's know nothing about.

If you think its fare to let that crap go on, then open your own site, noholdsbarredposting.com

When they understand, what TK is trying to figure out, then yes, argue away. But before then is just trolling. Go ahead, ask one of those guys if they know exactly what is happening in Waynes device. If you get any 'real' answers, they would be interesting to hear, and compare. lol

Some people are of the understanding that there is nothing left to figure out in this world and that we are all just wasting our time here(just like you) and THEY NEED TO LET US KNOW HOW THEY FEEL ABOUT IT, EVERY SINGLE DAY.  Yea, that sounds reasonable. Gimme a break.

MaGs