Quote from: Red_Sunset on October 24, 2012, 03:08:29 PM
Now that is a start, >>"Please help us Red_Sunset, let's start from the beginning"<<

So what do you mean, and expect and intend to do ?

What do I mean.
Let's start from the beginning. Review basic elementary principles, formulas, etc while all staying on the same page. Continue to get deeper and deeper into, for example, how the ZED, or similar systems work. Ensuring that together we agree on and have proven every dot, every iota of evidence.

What do I expect.
I think from my former comments you know my expectations. How great an opportunity though to start from square one and as skeptics and believers, uniting to come to a common ground, based on reality experiment, testing, etc. Again you know my current stance, however I am good at admiting I was wrong. Which leads me to your last question.

What do I intend to do.
I intend to start down this slow methodical path and once and for all end the dispute of OU in this system. Since both sides are covered no, assumption should be accepted, verifications on every level will be the only way to take the next step.
I intend no monetary gain, only the knowledge gained from this experiment and a journey that none, to my knowledge, have weathered.

If at the end of this exercise, however long that takes, I am wrong, I will admit as much and invest, promote, and proclaim truth to HydroEnergyRevolution, in hopes of furthering Mr. Travis' vision, in what little ways I can.

Red_Sunset I ask that you accept my invitation.

- correcaminos

beep beep

Correcaminos

QuoteWhat do I mean.
Let's start from the beginning. Review basic elementary principles, formulas, etc while all staying on the same page. Continue to get deeper and deeper into, for example, how the ZED, or similar systems work. Ensuring that together we agree on and have proven every dot, every iota of evidence.

Wayne posts contain the whole picture of the invention, so the best way to approach this is to review all of Wayne's posts in this thread and formulate his statements with your added understanding and comprehension (and conclussions as needed). There is material enough for a complete book. It is just a matter of organizing the info.
I will be glad to review, discuss and correct understanding as needed.

QuoteWhat do I expect.
I think from my former comments you know my expectations. How great an opportunity though to start from square one and as skeptics and believers, uniting to come to a common ground, based on reality experiment, testing, etc. Again you know my current stance, however I am good at admitting I was wrong. Which leads me to your last question.

I like your wholehearted approach

QuoteWhat do I intend to do.
I intend to start down this slow methodical path and once and for all end the dispute of OU in this system. Since both sides are covered, no assumption should be accepted, verifications on every level will be the only way to take the next step.
I intend no monetary gain, only the knowledge gained from this experiment and a journey that none, to my knowledge, have weathered.

Good, this is exactly the motivation you need to start with point 1 "what do I mean"

QuoteIf at the end of this exercise, however long that takes, I am wrong, I will admit as much and invest, promote, and proclaim truth to HydroEnergyRevolution, in hopes of furthering Mr. Travis' vision, in what little ways I can.

Don't worry, the OU light will shine on you and repentance is a life enriching exercise

QuoteRed_Sunset I ask that you accept my invitation.

You got it.

RSS..

I apologize, I obviously did not make clear my invitation.

I do not believe reviewing previous posts, that do not start at the beginning, is the way to go in proving whether OU is achievable with the ZED, hence why I put the invitation out there in the first place. Starting in the middle and continueing from there is a dangerous way to build understanding of a system. Building fallacy upon fallacy leads no where, at least no where I wish to go.

I guess that first I should ask this question.
Do you understand how the ZED works, functions and expands on many Laws of Physics?

- correcaminos

beep beep

Quote from: correcaminos on October 24, 2012, 06:04:01 PM
RSS..
I guess that first I should ask this question.
Do you understand how the ZED works, functions and expands on many Laws of Physics?
- correcaminos
beep beep

YES

Powercat,

QuoteSurely you can understand the unicorn idea sounds just as convincing as Wayne's argument

I understand the point you are trying to make with the unicorn, but that I see due to your own shortcomings, not Wayne’s. Your expectation did not match the delivery from Wayne in this forum. There was a mismatch between intentions and expectations.

QuoteI know you only ever post in this thread but I hope you will take some time to look at the thousands of other threads on this forum where people have made claims just like Wayne, they all had their chance to prove their technology worked and they all failed (on going investigations not included)

I never had a login into this forum until last July, acquired at the time because I was so outraged how Wayne’s was being torn apart early on in this forum by so called skeptics of devious character, while I was trying to understand the workings of the invention. I have never seen such disrupting disturbance before. After understanding his concept, the login purpose was to show my support for his concept against the attacks. Before Wayne’s thread I have looked at many other OU threads over the years for a new idea or a different viewing angle on the same old OU problem.  I have seen flawed or doubtful conclusions and some that were very clever but could not make the grade for OU,  others required some testing to confirm or disprove an assumption.
I was in this way that I came across Wayne’s zed. What intrigued me was how Wayne was going to convert force to energy after seeing the inverted cup test. It didn’t take time to realize that there is a penalty payoff for using Archimedes in this way. Notwithstanding I was sufficiently intrigued and I wanted to understand how this idea could work out  towards OU. For me, it didn’t matter if he had OU or not. I was only interested in the approach method. For possible use sometime in the future in a different way. So for me, the principle was more important than the device.
By having command of a principle that opens a loophole, its physical implementation is just a matter of experimental engineering.

The delay problems experienced by Wayne relate to the physical design model that is still at its infancy and its implementation is undergoing ongoing changes. Multiple improvements are being applied and tested, resulting in greater efficiency per cubic volume.  It is not just OU that is sufficient but the output to cost ratio that play a great importance in commercialization.
In addition  the intellectual property of these improvements and concept changes need to be secured. This is a business enterprise, not an amateur setup.  The peculiar reaction received from certain members of the forum came across as unsavory and for the purpose of security led to curtailing of the information released in the forum.

QuoteReplications.. there have been no replications of Wayne's self-running device, not by anyone on this forum and no links have been posted to other sites where this is shown.
The numerous spreadsheets and calculations that are as close to any real information as we have ever received are inconclusive and very debatable.

I can not comment on self running replications, because I don’t know.  If you think that spreadsheet and calculations are inconclusive and very debatable, then why did you not debate them ?  You can always bring your own data (if it is more accurate and better)

Quote"And so Mr Red I only post in this thread" do you really expect people to except Wayne's word without any scientific proof, and let's not forget how many times we have heard the verification team is coming,

I do not expect myself or other people to accept Wayne’s word as proof. If you are worth your salt, you do your own diligence and find proof, you do not need to rely on Wayne for that? Although you need the pre-requisite of understanding the system, to generate your own proof.  The validation team date is closely tied in with Wayne’s engineering and business activities, any delay should be seen in that context not from a forum viewpoint. Concept proof does not come from the forum. I think some self appointed people's heads are to big on this forum.

QuoteI guess you have a special relationship with Wayne that we are not party to, no need for the validation team to visit Wayne, as you are completely convinced that is device works,hmmm very suspicious.

If you are not party to a special relationship with Wayne, but you would like to have one, I suggest you better make contact with him.
I did my homework, validation and proof, if that is “ hmmm very suspicious”,  I don’t see the point