Quote from: CRANKYpants on May 20, 2008, 10:02:27 PM
FYI - THERE IS ACCELERATION FROM A PLASTIC SHAFT WITH THE MOTOR 2 FEET AWAY. AETHER SAYS IT'S BUBBLE GUM GOING DOWN THE SHAFT BUT I AM NOT SO SURE.

Thane

To 'prove' it, one of the many ways (maybe not the best) is to go back to the setup in demo 1&2 and verify that when going at the same RPM as it is with the all steel shaft if it will kick into action without the steel.

Again there are many experiments that must be done to help remove more of our ignorance.

Quote from: JustMe on May 20, 2008, 07:55:31 PM
Coils that WORK:

Working coils 1 through 5 have those steel bars, I do not understand 6, is it just 4 coils from induction fan motors in series?
And then 7 has no backing but for some reason is listed as working.

Then there is not working coil 7 which is the same exact coil still no backing.

So is it possible that there is some slight change that makes coil 7 functional or not?

Anyway other than that the images would make me think that maybe the steel bars are a good idea for MOTs since every MOT looking coil that works has them.

Quote from: Nali2001 on May 20, 2008, 05:20:19 PM
Just some extra info on me sys.
The airgap is over 10mm or else the core will be cooking in no time.
And yes if your system barely manages 50watt at like 10volt then yes a 55watt car bulb will not light up in a flash.

And cuz ya'll so nice:
http://www.krystyna.nl/Machine/NormalNoLoad001.wmv

Regards,
Steven

@Nali2001

Good stuff ! and thanks for the previous info and feedback re your coil characteristics and demo setup.
I think your observations and conclusions put us on the "same page" (or very similar page) regarding the cause/s of this effect.
Nice machining work and multi-media presentation by the way.

Cheers and KneeDeep

Quote from: aether22 on May 21, 2008, 01:58:34 AM
And then 7 has no backing but for some reason is listed as working.
Then there is not working coil 7 which is the same exact coil still no backing.
So is it possible that there is some slight change that makes coil 7 functional or not?
Anyway other than that the images would make me think that maybe the steel bars are a good idea for MOTs since every MOT looking coil that works has them.

THE LAST 2 COILS ARE THE SAME AND DO NOT ACCELERATE THE MOTOR.

THE BACK IRON IS ONLY THERE TO REDUCE THE RELUCTANCE IN THE AIR GAP AND PULL MORE FLUX INTO AND THROUGH THE CORE. STRONGER ROTOR MAGNETS WOULD PRODUCE THE SAME EFFECT.

# 6 WAS PRODUCED AND POSTED WHEN YOU WERE AWOL AND IS MY OWN REPLICATION OF THE GENERATOR TOROID COIL - YOUTUBE DEMO # 4.

AS SOON AS JM GET HER COOKING , CLEANING, AND OTHER IMPORTANT CHORES DONE SHE WILL POST THE COILS I PRODUCED YESTERDAY - A 91 OHM COIL AND A 53 OHM COIL.

THE INTERESTING THING THAT SURPRISED ME WAS THAT THE 53 OHM COIL WORKED BEST.

Thane

Quote
I think Nali made an important point when he related that his experiment showed that the shorted coils just reduced the drag and heating effects of their iron cores

.

I DON'T THINK HE SAID THIS EXACTLY, I WOULD IMAGINE SHORTED COILS INREASE THE CORE HEATING BUT ALSO CAUSE THE MOTOR TO ACCELERATE BECAUSE THE CORES ARE SATURATED AND THE DRAG IS REDUCED BECAUSE ROTOR FLUX CANNOT ENTER THE COIL/CORES.

AGAIN HV COIL EFFECT IS DIFFERENT BECAUSE HV COILS PRODUCE LITTLE OR NO CURRENT WHEN SHORTED AND DO NOT INCREASE CORE FLUX LEVELS TO THE POINT OF SATURATION - AND HV COILS DO NOT HEAT UP AT ALL.

MY FEELING IS THAT STEVE "LOST" THE ACCELERATION EFFECT WITH LAMINATED CORES BECAUSE THEIR RELATIVE PERMEABILITY IS HIGHER AND THEY DO NOT SATURATE AS QUICKLY. IRON CAN HAVE A PERMEABILITY OF AROUND 200 WHEREAS LAMINATED CORES CAN BE IN THE NEIGHBOURHOOD OF 10,000.

QuoteCan everyone observing the acceleration under load effect make some measurements to compare:

1. Motor input and rpm when accelerated by loading the coils
2. Motor input and rpm in the presence of no generator coil or cores [i.e. Completely remove the whole coil/core assembly from the presence of the magnetic rotor]

This would lead us to important conclusions one way or another.

I DID TEST THIS A FEW PAGES BACK (PAGE 48) WITH THE SPLIT-PHASE MOTOR TEST.
HV ACCELERATING COILS REQUIRED LESS MOTOR INPUT POWER THAN WITH NO COILS AT ALL.

Thane