Bessler , Karl I! The fat lady is gonna sing , haters bring it I'm not skeered .

[johnny874]

I'm bored.... If you explain it well enough I'll draw it in sketch up, and post. See others can see it to understand...

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:BuzzSaw_Gravity_Wheel
(http://peswiki.com/images/c/c6/BuzzSaw_Gravity_Wheel_-_Small_Front.jpg)

my blog; http://bessler2011.blogspot.com/
I am considered a fraud because I am taking my time to build and am showing my work.
Something not supported by moderators. But all tooling does need to be designed so that
they will work properly. Other wise, it would be a poor qaulity build and a waste of my time.
Someone has posted (Koenl,http://www.overunity.com/558/bessler-wheel-design/ ) a design similar to Mt 21. While such a design would seem to have no advantage, when the weighted lever moves past top center, it is generating torque at it's fulcrum.
It is this wasted potential that could allow for a perpetual wheel to work. This would be by using the mechanics found in Mt 20. And since the wheel and it's levers are in a  perpetual state of balance, then the work being performed by the swinging weight would not allow a wheel to reach an equilibrium within itself.

Thought I would mention that I because of the harassment I have had to tolerate am showing less of my work.
The more credible people in this forum believe it is such a simple idea that I should have already finsihed it. And
if I make to much of my work known, then anyone could build one without having to do to much work. After all,
the build process would be known and of course would seem obvious.
And one thing I mentioned to rlortie and memebers of his Arreche build group is that what is shown of the buzz saw is engineered wrong. The outer wheel would need more slots than the inner wheel but doubt such a design could work.
The reason being that the inner wheel would have to be geared to have the same movement as the outer wheel. By this I mean if the outer wheel rotates 90 degrees and the inner wheel rotates 180 degrees, it would need to bea t a 2:1 ratio and the outer weight would be twice as far out as the inner weight.

[johnny874]

  @All,
I have to say this can not work other wise I would be expected to build it.
Using a 1 meter diameter, then weight locations A, B and C are 50 cm's from ceneter.
What needs to be remebered is that Pi2R = circumfrence. In this example, 1 m x 3.142
equals 3.142 meters and the inner weight locations have a circumfrence of 1.57 meters.
This needs to be understood because of w = md or work equals mass times distance.
To illustrate this, if weight B moves 3.142/8 or rotates for 45 degrees, it travels 39 cm's.

The corresponding movement of weight B1 is .5Pi/4 or 90 degrees and it also travels
39 cm's. What everyone might be missing is that weight B moves from a perpindicular distance to gravity
of 70.7*1m/2 or about 35 cm's to 50 cm's from center.
in the mean time, weight B1 moves a perpindicular distance to gravity of 25 cm's to 0 cm's. The force calculations would have
vastly different answers. This is because weight B is never closer to the center of the wheel than 35 centimeters while weight B1 moves from a distance of 25 cm's from center to directly above it.
if you consider the movement of weights A and A1, A1 is starting at bottom center while weight A is at 45 degrees. Weight A will always have more force than weight A1 until they are both level with the axle and perpindicular to gravity. This is the only time that 2 opposing weights would have equal force, at all other times, weights A, B and C should have more force.
Also, with a 6 weighted wheel, as shown, weights A and B would have more force than weights A1 and B1. And while they are causing the wheel tor otate, weights C and C1 would be rolling on ramps to switch their positions as inner and outer weights allowing the cycle to continue.
Still, prefer Bessler's water wheel, not only would it have fluid motion but hopefully it would run like a clock or at the least it would slink as a cat does.

                                                                                                                                               Jim

  thought I would mention that for the ramps, and angle of about 3 degrees should be plenty as some potential would be lost because of this. it might be possible to have flat ramps and use the weights own momentum to allow them to move themselves. You know, force equals mass times velocity and since the weights would be in motion, they should have some momentum.
If so, then the only loss of potential would be the little lost due to using something like roller bearings which should be less than 1% and maybe less than .5% of the over balance that may or may not be possible with a design like this.
Myself, I say it will not work. This means I am not required to build it.

[circle]

I find it extremely unlikely that two individuals could have invented gravity wheels at almost the same time, and of the same design.

So either your hillbilly friend is related to the original inventor (who was a descendent of Bessler), was related to someone that worked for the inventor, or was related to someone that ripped off the idea from the inventor.

i think my friend will get a nice chuckle when i let him know that those are his only options.. right there in the bulletpoints..
- his family is either related to bessler because you said so...
- or his family was related to some itenerant worker because you said so..
- or his family is related to a thief.. on your authority and judgment

if you are not too mentaly worn out after making such an athletic minor league conclusion jump..
i would suggest that you may be missing several chapters in the devices history

seems there were quite a few who had the wheels and across an area many states wide
the posibility that the device went into production and saw limited distribution never seems to have been permited as considerable in your view

but by the accounts i was told.. his great grandfather had secured the first device by purchase between 1911 and 1917 and the second within a decade after that
..additionaly was told that both appeared more 'modern' than the one commonly seen on the web

i sent you some info about it

only point i would readdress is the order of events as the weights exchange
if we let gravity do its work.. the lower weight drops first and it is its weight that would then trigger the next hammering discharge of the coil

i see you commeted about my posting of the pages of besslers book as potentialy 'pissing people off and wasting space'
<how could anything posted compare to the annoyance of the cheap way this site is tagged with adds for pay per click monitization?>
some people will look at something they could easliy interpret and choose not to make any effort to discern what it means on the premise that they do not know the language
not much sence bothering with them.
for some other persons, however, having the pages posted for easy reference might be of some use
for example.. when i said i turned to those who had seen the device.. you dont even need to be able to read much german or latin to understand the page that has their names and credentials
and armed with names and titles etc one can begin in ernest to discern what marks the persons left on history.. and it is their obscure biographies that did me all the good, even if not for spelling out the solution, but for putting it into context

in truth though i was only posting it to keep myself present high on the list of recent posts
i can see that it would make more sence to simply post in my first thread to generate some awareness of my claim.
notice i still have done very little to push my claim into the limelight
if someone has an interest in this device they will dig deep and in so doing they may find my posts
i have the correct design
now.. how to procede?

[ace569er]

 .

[ace569er]

  was wrong nvm