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Overunity Machines Forum



MH's ideal coil and voltage question

Started by tinman, May 08, 2016, 04:42:41 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 21 Guests are viewing this topic.

Can a voltage exist across an ideal inductor that has a steady DC current flowing through it

yes it can
5 (25%)
no it cannot
11 (55%)
I have no idea
4 (20%)

Total Members Voted: 20

verpies

Quote from: tinman on May 11, 2016, 06:12:39 AM
Because the current produced by the inductor is equal and opposite to that being provided by the ideal voltage source, and so no current flows, but it dose rise to an infinite amount.
It is true only for an ideal inductor that has an infinite inductance.
In an ideal inductor having a finite inductance, in series with an ideal voltage source, the current will be able to flow and it will increase linearly in time without a limit.

Anyway, that statement above is so awkwardly worded.
First you write about two currents flowing and at the end you write about currents not flowing - that sounds contradictory.

I think you wanted to write about two currents, that would flow if they were not opposing each other.
Specifically, one current, that would flow due to the nature of a shorted voltage source and a second current, that would flow in a shorted ideal inductor (shorted by the voltage source). 
That's all, that I was able to decode, so far.



verpies

Quote from: picowatt on May 11, 2016, 01:15:16 PM
An ideal inductor does not have to have an infinite inductance.
True. An infinite ideal inductor is a special case of an ideal inductor.

Quote from: picowatt on May 11, 2016, 01:15:16 PM
What I said was your description of an inductor whose EMF and CEMF are in perfect balance would be descriptive of an inductor with infinite inductance.  An inductor with infinite inductance, when connected across a V source, would forever appear as an open circuit.
I agree and I think Tinman was stating the same thing but in terms of opposing hypothetical currents instead of opposing EMFs.

Magneticitist

until some form of 'distance' or 'length' is brought into the equation, which has a direct relation with resistance in the real world (I think?) isn't 'time' out of the window altogether because without anything to slow electron drift velocity (pardon if that makes no sense I just read some stuff and thought I made some sense of it) wouldn't the current technically travel at light speed? what about collisions? would that be meeting a resistance? if we have nothing with which to truly factor a Tau
into the equation then why can't 'current infinitely rising' be synonymous with 'no current flow at all'.

the real problem here is nobody want's to come out and say Ohm's law needs to be thrown out
of the window in this situation isn't it? and we are supposed to be trained to rely on Ohms Law.
Brad was trying to show extremely high amps calculated at extremely low resistance as a metaphor for approaching "infinite" using Ohms Law. But as we have been discussing, and maybe do not all agree on it, but infinite=0.

MileHigh

Ohm's Law applies to resistors, it does not apply to inductors or capacitors.  I am keeping it simple and with that in mind forget about Ohm's Law, we are discussing an inductor.

So you are correct, for this discussion we can throw out Ohm's Law.

minnie




   The inductor is impeding current flow but when I look up impedance it
  refers to ac circuits and reactance doesn't seem to fit the bill either.
  It's all good fun and the whole thing proves that not many of us know
  that much!
      You've got to hand it to the Henrys and Faradays and Maxwells for
  figuring it out so well in the first place.
          John.