The Old Standard Ignition System. Battery. Coil. Points. And Condenser....

[Magluvin]

I had brought up this subject in a multi recipient pm with MH.  I was trying to get him to see just one example of how resonance can give us a gain in output......


(mh)  "And I think of all the time you idiots have called me an "idiot" or told me that I don't know my stuff and I am faking it or I am a "disinformation agent."  And most of you bloody idiots can't understand a motor passing an inductive kick-back spike to a bloody LC resonator.  And yet you have all spent literally years playing with inductive kick-back spikes and LC resonators.  What the fuck?"

(mags)  "Can you explain why a standard igniton coil with a cap across the points produces a hotter longer lasting spark than without the condenser? Very very simple circuit and some of the diagrams online are incorrect.  Battery, points and primary in series with the condenser across the switch. Polarity of the battery is inconsequential.."

These few pms were between he and I only at this point. I was trying to be friendly, but...  I copy pasted from the pm to make sure what was said is accurate to the T.

Mh had 4-5 others in this pm fest and they all mostly  didnt reply much if any. But he came out and said I was asking him to help me understand it. And that the condnser was some kind of modification to the standard points ign. He twisted my words again with the group. In my question post I stated it was a standard ignition with battery, coil point and condensr and he makes it look like I am adding a cap to make the original circuit different.  Heck I posted what i know about it and why it works at OUR the day or so before I asked MH thins question. Can prove it all.  But he twisted the whole thing around and told everyone that he wasnt going to explain how it works and he is not going to spoon feed me, etc etc. 

He pulled up a depiction to ask if this is what I was talking about and I said yes, those are the 2 circuits.

Then he said this to me first, and then to the group again.





"Here, Magluvin asked me about this standard ignition circuit and why you get a more robust spark when you put a cap across the interrupter switch:

https://cdn.instructables.com/F4Z/QP4N/GC4G94M5/F4ZQP4NGC4G94M5.MEDIUM.gif

I suggested to him that he post it in the thread as a sort of "primer" to see if you guys could figure out exactly why you get a bigger spark when you add the cap.  Right now, I don't think that any of you can explain why.  And that represents a paradox for all of you.  If I am right and none of you can explain the how and why for the modified ignition circuit, then what's the point in discussing the Tesla ozone patent if you don't even understand how the modified ignition circuit works?  What's the point of building and testing a Kapanadze "grenade" coil circuit if you can't even understand the ignition circuit or the ozone patent?"


So here are my response vids.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4aHl8JL2PI&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rlSoAShf2o&feature=youtu.be

Mags

[Magluvin]

In the very short second vid, when with the capacitor connected, you can see it is not just one thin spark like without the cap connected. There are multiple sparks happening during the ring down of the resonant LC. 

There is a gain by way of resonance here.

Mags

[citfta]

It seems we have a bunch of experts with no real expertise.  The ignition coil circuit is very simple as Mags has said. Lets take it a step at a time.

First the points are closed.  This allows current to flow through the primary of the coil.  When the points open the inductance of the primary now forces the current to flow into the cap.  Since inductance wants to keep the current flowing the cap will charge to a higher voltage than the supply.  Once the inductance has expended all it's energy minus the resistance loses then the cap starts to discharge back through the primary into the source.  Again since the inductance wants to keep the current flowing the cap will discharge until the voltage of the cap is lower than the supply voltage.  And then the supply will reverse the flow again back unto the cap and back and forth it goes until the resistance uses up the energy being supplied by the resonance of the LC circuit formed by the cap and the primary.

If you doubt this, then just put a scope on the primary and watch what happens with and without the cap.  Any old school mechanic will very quickly tell you the system does not work if the cap is removed or goes bad.

Respectfully,
Carroll

[Magluvin]

It seems we have a bunch of experts with no real expertise.  The ignition coil circuit is very simple as Mags has said. Lets take it a step at a time.

First the points are closed.  This allows current to flow through the primary of the coil.  When the points open the inductance of the primary now forces the current to flow into the cap.  Since inductance wants to keep the current flowing the cap will charge to a higher voltage than the supply.  Once the inductance has expended all it's energy minus the resistance loses then the cap starts to discharge back through the primary into the source.  Again since the inductance wants to keep the current flowing the cap will discharge until the voltage of the cap is lower than the supply voltage.  And then the supply will reverse the flow again back unto the cap and back and forth it goes until the resistance uses up the energy being supplied by the resonance of the LC circuit formed by the cap and the primary.

If you doubt this, then just put a scope on the primary and watch what happens with and without the cap.  Any old school mechanic will very quickly tell you the system does not work if the cap is removed or goes bad.

Respectfully,
Carroll

Exactly. But, Mh is at it again with resonance of an lc is of no use to us.  Said in pm 2 times that he got an A in pulse circuits.  Haha lol  That is just too much.

But there are actually a lot of mechanics that do not know this today, strangely enough.

Mags

[Magluvin]

It seems we have a bunch of experts with no real expertise.  The ignition coil circuit is very simple as Mags has said. Lets take it a step at a time.

First the points are closed.  This allows current to flow through the primary of the coil.  When the points open the inductance of the primary now forces the current to flow into the cap.  Since inductance wants to keep the current flowing the cap will charge to a higher voltage than the supply.  Once the inductance has expended all it's energy minus the resistance loses then the cap starts to discharge back through the primary into the source.  Again since the inductance wants to keep the current flowing the cap will discharge until the voltage of the cap is lower than the supply voltage.  And then the supply will reverse the flow again back unto the cap and back and forth it goes until the resistance uses up the energy being supplied by the resonance of the LC circuit formed by the cap and the primary.

If you doubt this, then just put a scope on the primary and watch what happens with and without the cap.  Any old school mechanic will very quickly tell you the system does not work if the cap is removed or goes bad.

Respectfully,
Carroll

Ooops, forgot.  Im not putting a scope on it. I want his explanation of how Im wrong and to give his imaginary way that it works first.  He wont because he cant.  Cant come up with a better reasoning that is.  He does it once again and lays the challenge all on me.  I showed the clear indisputable results that he seemingly cant agree that THE CAP AND COIL RESONATE BECAUSE THATS WHAT LCs DO .  Must have got an F in filter class.

Ive shown him what is and what isnt with the difference.  He would even dispute a scope shot with more imaginary bags of dimwit. Yup.

Mags