inertial propulsion with gyroscope

[sm0ky2]

Using the knowledge of these relationships
We can set-up a controlled 3-axis gimble system
Wherein 3 identical motors control the rotation of 3 identical masses
And by variable resistance, control the speed of their rotation


Old Atari style gaming joysticks are designed in a way
where we can implement the varying resistance
(in almost 50% of complete control)
And by including a switchable inversion circuit, handle the opposite 50%
of the vectors from the perspective of our inertial plane.


A "pilot" in the center of these gimbles experiences a linear force
the vector of which is a combination of the vectored force on each gimbled axis
in response to the resistance of the current to the drive motors, at that instant.


in a training simulation, the gimbles axes are fixed in space.
However, in free space, the axes feel the same forces felt by the pilot,
who is also rotating, but to each their respective magnitude and vector.
The combination of which applies a vectored force to the entire mass.


The simulation trains the pilots to stabilize the combined vectored forces
to control free-fall spin in a gravitational field.
In the real shuttles, this gimble control was replaced with
areal rutter systems, similar to those found in fighter jets.


This allows this allows the pilot to apply force to the axes of rotation
in each of the 3 dimensions, with respect to the pilots reference plane.
The goal being to stabilize the craft.


If the goal was the opposite, it's a matter or further training
we can learn by the same system to apply a vectored force on each of the 3 axes
and cause a force to be applied to the mounted the device is attached to.
This causes wear on the system in the mounted version, in the vector of the applied
force.


In the free space example, is force is applied to the rotating mass, in that vector.


One such machine is on public display in the space center in Houston, Tx.
On occasion, you can observe an elected participant or a youth in one of the space
programs, operating the simulator.


On even rarer occasion, you meet someone who has become good at it.
And they can describe to you how the whole machine tries to rip itself off in
each of the 3 directions as they try to orient themselves upright to their surroundings

[woopy]

Hi conrad

i reread your post concerning the very small vertical precession freedom in the Fiala description. It can be effectively very small almost touching the track but to me  it is mandatory.

And i would add that if you observe my video in general, it seems that the ratio of duration of the traction part to the free precessing part is about 1/2.

Si i will try to "force" the traction  on a portion of the track and then help the free precession back (same distance), but 2 time slower. If you see what i mean.

And i am looking for a servo  or stepper motor, linear solenoid or anything which could rotate half a turn , or push a certain distance in a certain time and back 2 time faster.

Any idea

Laurent

[sm0ky2]

The point of this being, that these proportional relationships hold true
wether in Newtonian mechanics, or the full expanded version in a Hamiltonian space.


Another proportional relationship can be established between the magnitude of the vectored forces
and the rotating mass, with respect to each gimbled axis.
By increasing or decreasing the masses rotating about each gimble, we can cause
each of the 3 forces increase or decrease in magnitude.


By increasing the radius about the axis of rotation, we proportionately increase the
torque applied to the respective axis.

[sm0ky2]

Hi conrad

i reread your post concerning the very small vertical precession freedom in the Fiala description. It can be effectively very small almost touching the track but to me  it is mandatory.

And i would add that if you observe my video in general, it seems that the ratio of duration of the traction part to the free precessing part is about 1/2.

Si i will try to "force" the traction  on a portion of the track and then help the free precession back (same distance), but 2 time slower. If you see what i mean.

And i am looking for a servo  or stepper motor, linear solenoid or anything which could rotate half a turn , or push a certain distance in a certain time and back 2 time faster.

Any idea

Laurent

With a bit of programming a computer hard drive motor and circuit
could be used to perform the desired function.


Another option would be to control a similar stepper motor with a less complex IC chip.
and a small circuit.
The 555 can be usd with a few circuits to do this.
there are better ways to do this but I'm not the best to ask.
So I offer this as an example
Mine would handle it differently, other people would engineer a better control circuit
https://circuitdigest.com/electronic-circuits/stepper-motor-driver


The basic idea being to supply a current to the motor for a duration of time
that gives the appropriate "steps" in the proper direction for what you are trying to do.


The same circuit can be modified to handle a D.C. Motor, and wormgear on an arc-track
placed some distance along the arm.
Though this method restricts certain forces which get translated to the mounts of the actuator.
These may or may not be the forces you are attempting to harness.
So I would avoid that option,  but really depends on your design.

[conradelektro]

Hi conrad

i reread your post concerning the very small vertical precession freedom in the Fiala description. It can be effectively very small almost touching the track but to me  it is mandatory.

And i would add that if you observe my video in general, it seems that the ratio of duration of the traction part to the free precessing part is about 1/2.

Si i will try to "force" the traction  on a portion of the track and then help the free precession back (same distance), but 2 time slower. If you see what i mean.

And i am looking for a servo  or stepper motor, linear solenoid or anything which could rotate half a turn , or push a certain distance in a certain time and back 2 time faster.

Any idea

Laurent

@Laurent: I looked into all three things (solenoid, servo or stepper motor).

Solenoid: you could do your machine which was inclined with a solenoid. The solenoid pushes the gyro on the arm up the inclined track very fast and then it falls back down the incline to the resting position by gravity. But the solenoid gives you practically only one speed (very fast).
https://www.conrad.at/de/hubmagnet-selbsthaltend-2-n-12-n-12-vdc-12-w-ebe-group-k10sl-503714.html (I have similar solenoids of different strength and size, push and pull, but I gave up on the idea).

Servo: A servo basically gives you also only one turning speed. You could use the servo like a solenoid for a push (arm with gyro moves) up the incline and then again a free fall down the incline. You could easily adjust the length of the push with a servo, which would be nice. And the best way to control a servo is again with an Arduino (you will NOT need a motor shield). I also gave up this idea.


Stepper Motor: This is the only motor I know for precise turning speed, turning direction and position control. The bummer is the programming. A stepper motor needs a rather complicated program (with interrupt handling at least for the "home" position sensor) to make it do interesting movements. The adafruit motor shield with an Arduino Uno Rev3 gives you a rather cheap programming means (about EUR 60.-- and for EUR 12.-- you get a decent stepper motor). The stepper motor is also a power hog (1 to 2 Ampere each), which means a lot of batteries on the moving platform. And of course the big question: are you into programming? Everybody can learn programming, but how much time do you want to spend on the learning effort? I can give you the program, but it has to be adjusted to your stepper motors and for each specific test, maybe frequent redesigns are necessary if things do not work as expected. So, stepper motors are the way forward, but do you do programming? Although I did system engineering level programming in industrial control for seven years (and have an informatics and mathematics background) I will still spend countless hours on the program till it works as intended. But maybe I am a brain dwarf and I also have become a slow old man.

Greetings, Conrad