Magnetic OU principle, You should really take a look at this !

[AbbaRue]

Even if what Ergo says is correct, I don't see how it effects the overall concept.
No one said anything about placing the washers right next to each other in the system.
Just take two magnets and place them next to a stack of washers. 
It doesn't take much distance to stop the effect.
Once I find the time I hope to build a small prototype of a concept I had in mind.
Just a simple demo setup.

[wizkycho]

Interesting to see Ergo and Koen1 incorporated but without experiment with negative result.Just BLA, BLA.
They are practically fighting fabric of Space itself and they are not aware of it....placing walls, where there aren't any, just to be able to head bump them...well that's were the world is now, so nothing new.

I still am well assured that this can do 50 or 100 to 1

why:

(this all aplies for one slide move of magnets and nothing is saturated)

- permeable flux from magnets is free,
- we can put as much magnets as we want/can and not influencing base mechanicall friction to rise in manner more magnets more friction.
  so mech friction is constant
  on other hand output lineary rises with number of magnets.
- no sticky points when moving magnets (flux always has same short permeable way to close upon other pole, bending (doesn't go through air if it doesn't have to ) very slightly(unmeassureable small force - 1/1000th of force that magnet develops on fanner) when passing 1mm gap.
- if many magnets are used (mass rises) free spring action can be used for slide back and preserving mass velocity momentum and convert vector for 180deg (if full cir. 360deg) lowering input requirements even more.



Wiz

[wizkycho]

Hello Koen1

I'm with you in this matter and I have thought a lot about it lately and I think I have found the reason why it won't work.
As usually when people go crazy over something and totaly believe they have found the holy grail they always miss
out on something that "they didn't think of". And that scenario is repeated every time. Sometimes thinking is of good use.

The thing is: A setup using a line of washer piles placed between a moving horseshoe magnet will have an unwanted effect.
The nearby piles will also get repelled by the magnet and it declines from the center of the strongest magnetic field, being the magnet.
The repel force from the washers will spread out on all affected piles of washers. And the accessible power is consumed by inertia.
So this is the nail in the coffin on the washer idea...To bad, for a short while I really hoped we had something good going on here.

this is another replay on funny picture posted by Ergo (at least he could use some mag sim program that will show him different)

(everything here applies on never saturated material)
(rectangles between magnets are edges of permeable material - not air inside rectangles)

It is so that poles will close on each other in a red line fashion and only in that fashion.

in his Ergos world magnets will close flux with blue lines. Funny picture isn't it

it is as funny as watching cartoon Strippy (anyone seen this cartoon ?)

Wiz

[Ergo]

Mechanically driving it with magnets makes not much sense to me.

Sorry, I was focused on the mechanically solution that wizkycho was pushing so hard.
If "driving it via a LC tank at the resonance frequency" solution makes any difference is yet to be seen.

Magnet flux doesn't act as electron current . Electron current will lineary of resistance devide its curents through two paths. complete magnet flux will not devide proportionaly(lineary) of mag resistance but whole of it will pass through one path with less resistance, while it has larger permeability.

I have never mentioned this mix up. This is your interpretation of my words.
I know exactly how flux lines travel and interact. Don't put words in my mouth I have never spoken.

Permeability means most desireable path for mag flux. How can You possibly think that flux will jump over air that has perm of only 1 ?

Simply because the washers can't handle the flux from the nearby neos. In order to handle all the flux the washers must be just as
wide and high as the neos, namely a solid block of iron. Let's say the washer area is half the height of the neo area.
This means that the flux of approx 1.36 tesla is driven to 2.72 tesla if all of the flux should pass through the washers. But it can't.
It will stop at 1.7 tesla and seek another path. Why 1.7 tesla. Simply because this is where the saturation starts to have an effect.
Did you get that wizkycho? The washers have only HALF the area of the neomagnets. This is why the excess flux escapes the washers.
That crappy childish picture you posted above is just so wrong. You misslead people in magnetic understanding. It's bad. Please get educated.

Have You ever seen B-H curve?

In daily basis. It's part of my jobb. The correct name is actually B/H curve, not B-H curve.

I can publicly only call for You to be banned from this forum, cause you say something is not working not giving it a slightes tought. what a destroyer. You are destroying this forum...this is clear.

What kind of BS is this. You show your childish narrow-minded perception abilities by this statement.
I have never threatened you or been abusive. I have just told the true facts that you totaly refuse to believe or even consider.
When does a man destroy a forum by a sane logic discussion? It's you with your bad attitude that is destructive.

you don't make any ,not even simplest experiments, to prove your "wannabe it is so" theories.

I have made my fair share of experiments in my earlier days but once you get past the entry level of understanding
magnetics you can see in your mind how the outcome will become. This is when you truly can see the magnetic
interaction of a contraption in your mind because you know almost all parameters involved in the setup.
When you come to that level (if ever) we might be able to have a civilized discussion.

Not even Hartiberlin believes in your idea. Why is this so. Because his eduction level is good and he can see the flaw himself.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=5064.msg133710#msg133710

I haven't provoked you once but you behave as I am the worst case of scum alive. I just told you some basic facts you rejected badly.

[wizkycho]

Sorry, I was focused on the mechanically solution that wizkycho was pushing so hard.
If "driving it via a LC tank at the resonance frequency" solution makes any difference is yet to be seen.
I have never mentioned this mix up. This is your interpretation of my words.
I know exactly how flux lines travel and interact. Don't put words in my mouth I have never spoken.
Simply because the washers can't handle the flux from the nearby neos. In order to handle all the flux the washers must be just as
wide and high as the neos, namely a solid block of iron. Let's say the washer area is half the height of the neo area.
This means that the flux of approx 1.36 tesla is driven to 2.72 tesla if all of the flux should pass through the washers. But it can't.
It will stop at 1.7 tesla and seek another path. Why 1.7 tesla. Simply because this is where the saturation starts to have an effect.
In daily basis. It's part of my jobb.
What kind of BS is this. You show your childish narrow-minded perception abilities by this statement.
I have never threatened you or been abusive. I have just told the true facts that you totaly refuse to believe or even consider.
When does a man destroy a forum by a sane logic discussion? It's you with your bad attitude that is destructive.
I have made my fair share of experiments in my earlier days but once you get past the entry level of understanding
magnetics you can see in your mind how the outcome will become. This is when you truly can see the magnetic
interaction of a contraption in your mind because you know almost all parameters involved in the setup.
When you come to that level (if ever) we might be able to have a civilized discussion.

Not even Hartiberlin believes in your idea. Why is this so. Because his eduction level is good and he can see the error himself.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=5064.msg133710#msg133710

I haven't provoked you once but you behave as I am the worst case of scum alive. I just told you some basic facts you rejected badly.

What You just said is confirmation of my previous post. You do not understand how undesireable air path (desireability only 1) is for magnet flux especially if prolongs path - (not direct path) (side air 1mm gap.) it must allso go back through that gap now 2mm. there is no reason mag flux would do that.

washers together have more then enough material (surface) not to satturate. Natures Calculator is enormously fast it is clayirvoiant it knows the path in advance. It wan't allow to saturate one washer and then seek another. flux will devide equally through washers. none of those washers gets saturated and they still represents shortest path. that last sentance is enough to know that complete flux wan't go a stray.

But even if you do not see this let's say that air gap between rectangle washer stack and overlaping permeable metal is 0.25mm
this is possible.

still got You over 50 to 1     Nature and Space is astonishing in so many ways and You don't see Any of it.

Wiz