HHO Cell - Stan Meyer Design.

[Farrah Day]

SM

The aluminum plate acts as a DIODE, blocking current only in one direction. You have a diode, in one direction, and a capacitor in the other direction

I don't really consider this a diode as such, but rather a polarised or electrolytic capacitor, whereby connecting it the wrong way around destroys the dielectric oxide layer and hence allows current to flow.  I'm still inclined to think that the water is simply acting as one of the electrodes.

Newbie

Cool experiment.   I've seen similar 'sparkling'  between two electrodes connected directly to an AC wall outlet (zer0pointunlimted on youtube, the video appears to be gone now)  ... What you're doing is completely different I believe.

If I remember correctly Dave Lawton and Ravi both saw this photoluminescence phenomenon.

My take on this - for what it's worth - is that inducing the water molecule to ionise at the electrode is an endothermic reaction, so absorbing energy from the environment, but there will always be ions recombining back to a water molecule at the electrodes. When this happens, the energy is emitted as a photon. We don't see this if the the ions are quickly exchanging charges at the electrodes as in electrolysis, just when they are being held there as in this case. 

This just shows us how active things are at the electrodes and tells us about the constant energy fluctuations.

All good stuff.

[supermuble]

Here (could be) the key to all of this. Meyer said that electrons were stripped from the water molecule... But how?

According to Tom Bearden, when you charge a capacitor with "potential energy" the electrons are drawn into the capacitor from the local area. It is a phenomena that is totally separate from regular charging, and it creates a "free" charge on the capacitor. The other part is that electrons are not furnished by the circuit, so the capacitor must create electrons. Perhaps if using pure voltage potential, the electrons are actually furnished from the water molecule. According to Meyer, electrons were stripped to make hydrogen and oxygen. He said the covalent bond "switches off" because the hydrogen atom loses an electron.

Potential energy is really just the back EMF from a DC inductor coil that is rapidly disconnected (Bedini charger) or a spark coil. Spark coils do not put out much current, if any, they just emit radiant energy.

(Radiant energy/back EMF/potential energy/voltage) can perform work. According to Bearden. But only by using a CAPACITOR. The capacitor has a unique phenomena of creating it's own electrons. Since Meyer said we want to restrict electrons in the circuit, it only makes sense that Meyer was using radiant energy and a true capacitor.

Again, I am just speaking of ideas. I think this is very interesting. 

Here is an excerpt from the book - Energy From the Vacuum by Tom Bearden

Figure 9-8 shows a remarkable thing when we charge the capacitor with
Dirac sea holes. Suppose we charge the rightmost plate of the same
capacitor used before, while the leftmost plate is temporarily disconnected
from the circuit (or connected to another capacitor). Now Dirac Sea holes
pile up in the local vacuum connected with the right plate. Whether or not
they interact with the right plate, these positively charged holes attract the
negative ends of the dielectric molecules, again straining the top of the
dielectric molecules to the right. The strain of the dielectric is a force
interacting upon the local vacuum, and it lifts real electrons from the Dirac
Sea (or pulls them from the circuit or other attached capacitor) and onto
the leftmost capacitor plate. The charged capacitor in its supersystem thus
has additional functions that occur. The total Vq joules stored in the
charged capacitor, were this time drawn (converted) from the applied
Dirac hole current and the resulting interaction upon the vacuum, to lift
real electrons onto the leftmost plate.261
261

[newbie123]

Here is a more scientific explanation of the glowing & sparkling phenomena.

http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/GlowExper.pdf



I'm still not convinced water can be "charged"   though..
edit:    IE.   Dr. Stiffler's claim of pouring "charged" water into a glass, etc.

[supermuble]

That article seems to agrees with my previous post. Though it doesn't seem to go into great detail.

"The anode interphase, however, is dramatically changed by a conductive oxide layer.
Here, in order to sustain ordinary electrolysis reaction, an electron must be removed
from an OH- radical. However, a powerful gradient forms at the anode and may be
sufficient to strip electrons from neutral molecules given a sufficient lack of
availability of OH- radicals in the vicinity of the anode."

The article is saying that electrons tend to be stripped out of the water as voltage is increased above 200 volts (note that only a few people have ever got above 5 or 6 volts on their cell).


Well, the plates charge - not the water. The water is submerged in a voltage field. Sorry for the confusion.

[Farrah Day]

Interesting link that Newbie, possibly that's whats occuring, but SMs glowing is clearly not blue, neither was Lawton's. Also, Lawtons was using just ss tubes without the obvious oxide layer build up of the aluminium.

Here's the possible alternative answer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoluminescence

Stiffler seemed to be genuinely charging the water itself, so I'll have to put my doubts aside at the moment, because I see no reason to doubt him. However, it would be nice to replicate his results with my own experiment, but I've still not yet achieved this with a 1.5Kv EHT supply.  Mind you I've only been giving it minutes at a time up to now.

Let's hope Stiffler's website link is back up soon for you to have a gander.

SM

You're doing some very interesting work, but I personally feel you're overly reliant on what Meyer said, which could be throwing a spanner in your works.

The other part is that electrons are not furnished by the circuit, so the capacitor must create electrons. Perhaps if using pure voltage potential, the electrons are actually furnished from the water molecule. According to Meyer, electrons were stripped to make hydrogen and oxygen. He said the covalent bond "switches off" because the hydrogen atom loses an electron.

You stated that you're only throwing ideas about, fair enough, and obviously you give Meyer far more credibility than I ever would, but just how do you make hydrogen and oxygen from stripping electrons off a water molecule?  Answer: You can't, the chemistry does not add up.

I've never ever seen anywhere that will tell you that electrons provide a current through a liquid... apart from Meyer. Everything I have ever read states that the current through a liquid is ionic... never electron.

When water ionises into OH- and H+ we are effectively breaking a covalent bond, but electrons are not pulled off to float about freely as Meyer implies.

You have a wet electrolytic capacitor. The aluminium is one electrode, the ss and the electrolyte together are the other electrode. The dielectric is the oxide layer. The capacitor does not create electrons.  The science behind this is well known and not particularly mysterious.  The longer the voltage is applied, the thicker the dielectric becomes and hence the greater the voltage can build up before catastrophic breakdown. Your cell would however repair itself.

I assume that the aluminium is your anode. The charge building up on the aluminium will therefore be +ve holes, while your sodium bicarbonate will provide OH- ions that will be building up on the oxide layer. Na+ will be drawn to the ss cathode, but no charges will be exchanged because the oxide layer effectively creates an open cct situation.

Check out: http://www.faradnet.com/deeley/chapt_03.htm

and: http://www.faradnet.com/deeley/chapt_05.htm

http://www.faradnet.com/deeley/book_toc.htm#toc