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Overunity Machines Forum



what happens with an electric field when it did work on a charge?

Started by Creativity, December 06, 2008, 03:20:03 PM

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Creativity

 ;D today my mind was twisted about one of my old idea's i picked up from my dusty idea books.

there is a high voltage plate capacitor.It get charged and disconnected.From now on no energy source is used to recharge it and by itself capacitor is not loosing any charge over time(to make it simpler).Now i shoot electron beam to pass between the plates of the capacitor.Electron beam was not energetic enough to produce visible light by itself,but when passing through the capacitor,the e-field makes additional work on the beam so electrons start to emit visible light.

This idea was to produce a source of light using less energy than bulbs and so on.On top of this concept i created many more inventions,all of it laying in a notebook until now that i had some time to think over it in deep :)

Now big question my brainy friends :) what happens to the electric field of the capacitor? obviously the charge is not lost(capacitor was disconnected from anything) so the electric field should behold its strength.It would mean that it makes work on charges but by itself its not loosing any energy  ???
Blues it through your outstanding life,leaving more than just footsteps behind (1999 B-stok by me).

By being intensively responsive to what others say,i do run a risk: I open myself up to the opinions of others.i will,at times, have a great understanding for their opinion.Sometimes,i will even change my own opinion because i realize that the other person is right.This "risk" i do not run if i am unresponsive to what others say.

broli

You brought an interesting topic up something I was thinking of a while ago and forgot. Purely technical an electrical field can do work and even deliver free energy imo. This can be done in many ways. Take two plates and make a uniform electrical field between them. Throw a charged particle through the field with an angle so it's main velocity gets affected and voila you have a particle that has more energy than it started with, without putting any other energy in it. I also had a super simple wheel idea based on this concept.

Creativity

so in ur opinion efield is not affected over time?if it would be true,i feel so stupid i underestimated my inventions about it  :-\

interesting wheel BTW much like local gravity-antygravirty concept(that's why i like efield,it can be made local :) ).Still it feels like magnetic motor design ;) so u should be cautious with sticky points.
Another idea of mine was to bombard water with this accelerated electron beam to produce hydrogen,but few months later i came with even better ideas.I just want someone to verify my way of thinking about the efield.If no one puts a flawn on it, then we have had free energy before our eyes laying and screaming  ;D

PS:ths for pictures,it makes it more visible to the others.
Blues it through your outstanding life,leaving more than just footsteps behind (1999 B-stok by me).

By being intensively responsive to what others say,i do run a risk: I open myself up to the opinions of others.i will,at times, have a great understanding for their opinion.Sometimes,i will even change my own opinion because i realize that the other person is right.This "risk" i do not run if i am unresponsive to what others say.

Creativity

so noone has an explanation? here i have a pice of interesting stuff then, how to connect efield to the 0PE(nergy) aka Openenergy aka ZPE  :)I think 0PE is better description than ZPE.

In short is says how charge is extracting efield flux from the source and how is this source "recharged'.If this holds its own shit(untill noone can explain me otherwise),here u have a free energy from 0PE + a mechanism how to extract it  ;D

We want to explain the above mentioned energy-flux of the efield and its propagation. And we want to explain the functioning principle of the conversion of vacuum energy into mechanical energy(of changed movement of the charge in the efield). This can be done as following:

Let us begin with the first aspect. This is the question in which way the space absorbs energy from the propagating field and in which way it supplies the field source (this is the charge) with energy: Each energy correction corresponds to an event of vacuum polarisation. Also the zero point oscillations have their contribution to these terms of energy (otherwise they would not be influenced by the fields). Although events of vacuum polarisation only occur temporarily, there are always some of these events going on, depending on their probability amplitudes. The situation describes a permanent (statistical) coming and going reminding to a picture of people coming and going along a street. Although they stay only temporarily in the street, you can always see people there. As long as events of vacuum polarisation occur, there exist some virtual electrons and positron and so on…

With other words: In this model, the efield generates a lot of events of vacuum polarisation during its propagation (because of the field’s energy) â€" and this is just the amount of energy which the field gives to the vacuum during propagation, so that the field strength will follow Coulomb’ law. The events of vacuum polarisation are the medium which extracts energy from the field.

The way how the field source is supplied with energy follows the same principle but to the opposite direction: The events of vacuum polarisation take finite time and finite space, but they don’t have to follow the directions of the flux lines of field. They diffuse to every direction and to everywhere in the space. Obviously they generate the loss of energy from the field during propagation .Some of them come close to an electrical charge (to a field source), and the charge extracts energy from them. It is not the issue here, to think about the mechanism of this extraction. It is even not said, that the fields source gets back the

In the notation of particle physics, the zero point oscillations are bosonic Quantum field fluctuations (because they are electromagnetic waves), and events of vacuum polarisation are fermionic Quantum field fluctuations (because they consist of particles like virtual electrons and positrons). Their conversion (which is necessary for vacuum polarisation) consists of processes like virtual pair production and annihilation. Especially in electric fields the probability amplitudes for the conversion for those both types of Quantum field fluctuations depend on external field strength. Thus the distance to the field source has an influence on the number of such processes occurring in a given time interval.

The number of events of vacuum polarisation per space and time (ultimately their probability amplitudes) is responsible for the amount of energy, which the field gives to the space.

So now a charge can extract efield energy via exchange with vacuum energy(polarisation differences).
When charge is inside the energy flux going from the field source into the space it obviously extracts energy from this energy flux â€" in detail as following:

The field source produces an electric field, thereby it emanates an energy flux which causes an alteration of the wavelengths of the zero point oscillations. As we know from the Casimir-effect, conducting plates block the propagation of the zero point oscillations. If we adopt this principle to our experiment, this means that between the field source and the charge, we have the alteration of the wavelengths. But on the other side of the charge, looking away from the field source, the zero point oscillations have the wavelengths as in free space without field, because this part of the space, which is shielded by the charge against the field source. Thus the wavelengths on the one side of the charge differ from the wavelengths on the other side of the charge. From the point of energy conservation, this is only possible, if the charge compensate the difference of energy. In fact the charge absorbs energy , because the total energy of the field is reduced in comparison to the situation withouta charge, because the field produced by the field source does not reach the space behind the charge.

In consequence this means that the energy flux is going from the field source to the charge which absorb some energy from the flux. The field source converts vacuum energy into field energy (this is the energy to alter the wavelengths of the zero point oscillations), which is a flux going into the space. This part of the flux which meets the charge is absorbed from the charge, being converted into mechanical energy(kinetic energy of the movement).

Blues it through your outstanding life,leaving more than just footsteps behind (1999 B-stok by me).

By being intensively responsive to what others say,i do run a risk: I open myself up to the opinions of others.i will,at times, have a great understanding for their opinion.Sometimes,i will even change my own opinion because i realize that the other person is right.This "risk" i do not run if i am unresponsive to what others say.

tinu

Hi,

Of course there is an explanation. You may not like it but here it is:

Electrons need to be brought at the ‘starting point’. See above drawing (broli) for identifying it.
That action requires energy. You may take simple cases and compute integral Fdr (work) and see that they are equal on incoming and outgoing paths. In all, energy balance holds true. No OU.

Another way of looking at it is electric fields are conservative, meaning that work on any closed loop is zero. So, if you ‘tie’ the electron with a string, although at ‘exit point’ it may have a higher velocity (and energy), when the string (an ideal one, no loses here are considered) is forcing it to return back on a circular path, it will close the path with no gain and no lose. That’ because on a closed loop there are portions of the path on which the particle is moving against the field thus decelerating.

No matter how a device of this kind is imagined, it won’t work.
…unless one finds a continuous spring of electrons being oozed out of nothing; I would also buy a couple of those springs, when available.   ;)

Cheers,
Tinu