DEK motor with U-coreless coil or Lenz boxing against Lentz

[Kator01]

Hi Laurent,

I posted a drawing in thanes thread how to catch the energy back to the driving battery ( NiCd I proposed )
This is the most effective way because using another bypass to catch reactive-emf in another electronic element will mean another loss of energy. It simply does not make sense to do this.
I wonder why you have choosen the complicated way. You always have to think of losses with each additional element placed in the circuit ( current-path)

In the proposed way you can watch how the NiCd reloads or the other way around :  how it is drained which I hope it will do not.

Now why do I insist on this : I have done a lot of innovative development during the last 20 years, both electronically and in software-enngineering.
One thing I have learned the hard way : Do not go ahead with two many steps at one time neglecting basic steps necessaray in the first place. Just finish the basics.

Next systematic development-step in your case would be to find out how this one coil works with this  one magnet.
What is the estimated input and output. And of course eliminate errors ( losses by unnecessary element used )

Again : Why do I say this ? Because if the basic function is not satisfactory the following steps in development can be obliterated and you have to find a new way.
Think for youself of the time you might save. I have watched too many people fallen into this trap.

I repost the pics here again.

Regards

Kator01

[gyulasun]

Hi Kator01,

sorry for chiming in here but I would like to understand your circuit on catching the energy back to the driving battery.

You showed two current directions,  forward in blue and backwards in red.  If you mean the forward current is flowing when the reed switch is ON then I understand it  but what potential or voltage difference gives the backward current via the diode?  Because the switch must be OFF to get the flyback pulse's energy, right?  What am I missing?

Please explain.

thanks,  Gyula

[Kator01]

Hi Gyula,

no sorry for chiming in here, gyla. It really like it if you guys are attentive.

As a understand Laurents setup the reed is switched on while the magnet is approaching the coil. Which magnet he uses for this is not of importance, meaning it must not be the one just aproaching the coil. However Laurent did not answer my question (I asked twice ) how he starts moving the disc in the first place. But anyhow I assume he sort of starts spinning it manually.

Now the reed-switch closes ( upon approaching of the magnet) blue forward-current energizes the coil->magnet is attracted more so -> magnet recedes from the coil ( reed switches off )-> Red Reactive reverse.-current  ( not Back-EMF) which has its positve side now at the reed-switch and the negative-polarity at the left end of the coil flow via diode to the negative terminal of the battery.

I have to emphasize again  the difference between Back-EMF and Reactive-EMF. I already explained it in the thanes-thread. I once saw a good video which explained it very well.

The Reactive-EMF ( if the reed is open ) is caused by the break-down of the magnetic field-energy stored up in and around the space of the coil ( set up by the forwad-current) and can be catched in thee ways : The way I presented it, meaning back to the battery, or seperately in a condenser or as a reversed magnetic field by shorting the coil right after the the reed has opened which then either exerts a pull or push onto the  passing magnet ( this is happening in thanes setup )

The Back-EMF is the resistive voltage arrising in a coil which acts against the forward-current trying to rise to its full value.Back-EMF is occurring as a companion and at the same instant the forward-current wants to rise.
It can not be watched or measured as a seperate phaenomenon. You only can observe it by the time-delay of the forward-current rising. ( phase-angle )

This is very important to distinguish so we will not get mixed up wtih terms.

Regards

Kator01

[gyulasun]

Now the reed-switch closes ( upon approaching of the magnet) blue forward-current energizes the coil->magnet is attracted more so -> magnet recedes from the coil ( reed switches off )-> Red Reactive reverse.-current  ( not Back-EMF) which has its positve side now at the reed-switch and the negative-polarity at the left end of the coil flow via diode to the negative terminal of the battery.

Hi Kator01,

I still have the problem of the reverse current flowing through the diode :  How can that current flow when the right hand side of the coil (which is connected to the reed switch) is an open circuit?  The diode's cathode is connected to the left hand side of the coil and if you say the reactive reverse current comes from the coil when the reed is OFF, then how can it flow when the coil is an open circuit?

this has been my problem, ok?

thanks,  Gyula

[woopy]

@Khabe

hoho! very nice design

did you do this thing in reality ? it is exactly what i am looking for

thank's very much for the 2 magnets per UCC idea   and i have made a small test with a linear 3 magnets train in a UCC     it pushes very well much better than the same setup with only one magnet    so we could perhaps stay simple  organise a disk with more time       1 UCC pushing-pulling a 3 magnets train    but yoursetup is very interesting

@Kator01

thank's for following on this thread and for the shema you posted   the problem is that  all my electronic knowledge comes from what i learned on Perepiteia and my first test with this DEK motor so please be patient i will try to be a good student and i apreciate what you do .
To start the motor  there is 2 ways  one to spin the rotor manually   second to place the reed actuator-magnet so it shut the reed and put the power on and it starts

cheers

Laurent