Joule Thief 101

[MileHigh]

Brad:

Where is your model for the battery coming from that has the decreasing source voltage?  Is it your own invention from this recent discussion or is it something that you have seen and used before?  I have never seen it before myself.  Can you show any references for that model?

Right now I am assuming that model is yours, but I will see what you have to say.

You are playing quite a bit of the "ignore game" over the past few days, haven't you?  I have pointed out several key points that you just try to "waive" but perhaps people are noticing them.

You can't ignore this:

There is a tragic flaw in your model.  If when the battery is outputting 1.0 volts and you measure a 10-ohm output impedance, then having your variable voltage source set at 1.0 volts and the output impedance resistance set at 10 ohms will not work.  The reason it won't work is that the variable voltage would have to be at 1.0 volts plus some unknown delta so that the final voltage after the resistor is 1.0 volts.

Do you get that?  You might need the variable voltage to be 1.15 volts with a variable resistance of 10 ohms to give you 1.0 volts after the variable resistor.  This will always be a function of the resistance of the load itself.  For a different load you might need the variable voltage to be 1.20 volts with a variable resistance of 10 ohms to give you 1.0 volts after the variable resistor.  From what I can see your model is unworkable.

And continue to learn the past?

No, more like getting up to speed with the present.  Wouldn't you like to reduce the number of ridiculous gaffes you make?  You need to read some electronics books.

Like you would of heard about a J/FET

I heard a story about a JFET being shoved up your ass.  Is it true?

At T=5 seconds,MHs device explodes.
I am yet to see any reason posted why the CEMF is also not ideal.
This means that it will also take an infinite amount of time before current start to flow
If you did(theoretically),the current would rise instantly to an infinite value.
If R = 0,which id dose,as the inductor is ideal,then no current flows through the ideal inductor.
This results in an instant current rise to an infinite value.
If the voltage increases,then it is not an ideal voltage,as an ideal voltage dose not change in time.
This also shows that MHs question cannot be answered,as it cannot exist.

That was brought out for your Bizarro World debate fans.  It gets them all excited, they even start taking warm up swings with their frying pans but they don't make contact.  You fans love the fact that when talking about the ideal inductor and voltage source question you kept on going back and forth between no-current infinite-current no-current infinite-current like some poor hapless pinball being banged back and forth between the bumpers of a pinball machine.  They absolutely love your early work and it gets them all excited and pumped up.

MileHigh

[Grumage]

I can see you have about as much imagination and creativity as lumpy gravy.  I guess that you are just a drone in The Grand Parade of Lifeless Packaging.

For the grand parade of lifeless packaging
All ready to use
The grand parade of lifeless packaging
I just need a fuse

Got people stocked in every shade
Must be doing well with trade
Stamped, addressed in odd fatality
That evens out their personality

With profit potential marked by a sign
I can recognize some of the production line
No bite at all in labor bondage
Just wrinkled wrappers or human bandage

Grand parade of lifeless packaging
All ready to use
It's the grand parade of lifeless packaging
I just need a fuse

"We are now in our manufacturing phase. Your interest is important to us but due to overwhelming demand we have temporarily suspended accepting orders at this time."

Bad MileHigh...... Bad.

You dare to bring a poor defenceless lamb into this debate, what about it's " Mama "?

The " Ripples " caused might just go on till " Suppers ready " !

For your " Nursery cryme " I sentence you to a week in the " Colony ".

Los Endos...... Grum. 

[minnie]

  tinman you don't seem to have much of a grasp of basic concepts.
  I don't know if you can get it in your part of the world but the BBC
  does a series of programs called "In our Time" with Melvyn Bragg.
  There are a whole lot of interesting science programs to choose
  from with things like the photon, negative numbers,quantum gravity
  and loads more. Enjoy,
                   John.

[tinman]

 author=MileHigh link=topic=8341.msg488321#msg488321 date=1468320145]







That was brought out for your Bizarro World debate fans.  It gets them all excited, they even start taking warm up swings with their frying pans but they don't make contact.  You fans love the fact that when talking about the ideal inductor and voltage source question you kept on going back and forth between no-current infinite-current no-current infinite-current like some poor hapless pinball being banged back and forth between the bumpers of a pinball machine.  They absolutely love your early work and it gets them all excited and pumped up.

MileHigh
[/quote]

I heard a story about a JFET being shoved up your ass.  Is it true?

LMAO
Sorry MH,but sometime's-even when you are being rude and perverted--you are funny.
I did have a laugh at that lol
And because you made me laugh,i will let it slide.

Where is your model for the battery coming from that has the decreasing source voltage?  Is it your own invention from this recent discussion or is it something that you have seen and used before?  I have never seen it before myself.  Can you show any references for that model?

Right now I am assuming that model is yours, but I will see what you have to say.

You are playing quite a bit of the "ignore game" over the past few days, haven't you?  I have pointed out several key points that you just try to "waive" but perhaps people are noticing them.

You can't ignore this:

There is a tragic flaw in your model.  If when the battery is outputting 1.0 volts and you measure a 10-ohm output impedance, then having your variable voltage source set at 1.0 volts and the output impedance resistance set at 10 ohms will not work.  The reason it won't work is that the variable voltage would have to be at 1.0 volts plus some unknown delta so that the final voltage after the resistor is 1.0 volts.

Well first up MH,your model was a power supply set at 1.5 volt's,and a VR in series with the power supply and load. This just dose not simulate a real battery simply by increasing the VRs resistance over time.

My model that simulates a real battery running a JT is as follow's,when wanting to use a super cap as the power source. As we all know(except you it would seem) the batteries voltage will drop as the energy value stored in that battery reduces. We also know at the same time,the impedance (internal resistance) will go up in that battery. All three things happen at once MH,and these are facts you cannot ignore.
So ,as the voltage drops in the super cap-(as it will with a battery),we increase the resistance of the series VR to mimic the increase of impedance that would take place in the battery.
So with your model,the inductor will always have 1.5 volts across it at T=0,where as using my model,the inductor will have the actual voltage of the battery,and will show the drop in voltage over time,as we get with a battery--where yours will not.

Below in the first diagram,i show your model as you describe it should be.
In the following scope shot's,i show the value of the VR that is to mimic impedance of a battery.
You can clearly see,that no matter what the impedance value,at T=0,the inductor always has your set 1.5 volts across it.

So ,unfortunately for you MH,your model dose not replicate an actual battery running a JT,as the voltage across the coil at T=0 will always be a set value,and dose not show a batteries voltage dropping as we would see with an actual battery.

Next i will show you the JT running on a super cap,and then after that,i will show you the JT running on a battery. We will then use my model-the super cap and VR,and look at both that model and an actual battery at various voltages,and see who's model is correct.
So even after half an hour running MH,your model will still show a peak voltage across the inductor of 1.5 volt's,and we all know that that would not be the case with a real battery.

No, more like getting up to speed with the present.  Wouldn't you like to reduce the number of ridiculous gaffes you make?  You need to read some electronics books.

Says the man that dares not take up the challenge --even with the help of others lol.


Brad

[tinman]

  tinman you don't seem to have much of a grasp of basic concepts.
  I don't know if you can get it in your part of the world but the BBC
  does a series of programs called "In our Time" with Melvyn Bragg.
  There are a whole lot of interesting science programs to choose
  from with things like the photon, negative numbers,quantum gravity
  and loads more. Enjoy,
                   John.

If you agree with MH because these programs say he is correct,then i think i will give them a miss thanks.
Perhaps you would be better sticking with the animal picture's--they seem to make more sense


Brad